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Old 03-16-2018, 08:37 AM   #136
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are the trees just a couple feet off track? does the sand runoff feature sandbags?

are the runoff issues for that corner discussed during rider's meeting?

for example at thill west, running reverse config - last turn heads you straight for a wall...this can be dangerous...the trackday providers say to take that turn slow and easy since there is the potential for a quick-stop....i would say that is due diligence...

caveat emptor and all that aside, there are a few variables in play.

all of this would be a non issue if laguna had proper drainage. laguna would have proper drainage if it wasn't mismanaged into insolvency. scramp should be sued but they don't have any money to pay, already millions in debt. oh look, keigwins has a nice car they must have $$$, let's go after them.

edit: apparently Monterey County Parks department is responsible for drainage on track?? seriously?? a state department in charge of on-track drainage?? i thought to myself that those sandbags look like a cal trans 'solution', but i didn't realize how close i was...


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Was that an instructor dragging that guy around?
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Old 03-16-2018, 08:45 AM   #137
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Was that an instructor dragging that guy around?
No, some guy on a camera bike.


=============================================

Interesting thread. So the sandbags should not have been there. The ditches would still have been. Hitting a 10" deep ditch would have been about the same. I guess the argument then would be that it's necessary to run a grader before every trackday. Tell that to Thunderhill. You go off the track there at T6, T7, or T8 you're fucked. And might run into an electric fence. Lot of sniping here. Most of it jealousy and envy related, rich guys should get fucked they are assholes. And some of it nit picking just for the point of nitpicking. Without any thought to the real issues. I'm actually saddened and depressed to see these attacks. A few guys are cutting your own throats and think you're cool.
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Old 03-16-2018, 09:21 AM   #138
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Lot of sniping here. Most of it jealousy and envy related, rich guys should get fucked they are assholes.
FWIW I have a permanently embedded metal reminder of what happens when you go off at THill. I didn't blame anyone but me.

I don't think the negative sentiment here is because the guy is rich. As budman said there's a segregation between his money and the business. I think most people don't like that he has some high value assets in the business ( the Ferrari, the motorhomes, and does he still have the i8?) and he's holding his hand out for money from us to presumably protect those assets - even when his insurance has offered to pay.
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Old 03-16-2018, 09:35 AM   #139
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FWIW I have a permanently embedded metal reminder of what happens when you go off at THill. I didn't blame anyone but me.

I don't think the negative sentiment here is because the guy is rich. As budman said there's a segregation between his money and the business. I think most people don't like that he has some high value assets in the business ( the Ferrari, the motorhomes, and does he still have the i8?) and he's holding his hand out for money from us to presumably protect those assets - even when his insurance has offered to pay.
That's not entirely correct. Yes he has some money. And assets. He has refused to settle. That's an entirely different issue. If the insurance pays, everyone in the industry is going to pay more, not just Keigwins. The waivers have been pretty bulletproof for decades.

And the amount here is tiny relative to the cost of defending. It's as much as show of support and interest as anything else.

That's how I see it. Thanks.
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Old 03-16-2018, 09:43 AM   #140
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Mods, please close this disaster of a thread. Thanks
Closing per OP request. We held off while we discussed the merits of leaving it open versus closing it, hence the delay.

For other folks: there are other threads on BARF that cover the details of the case where discussion can be ongoing.
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Old 03-19-2018, 06:04 PM   #141
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Man I might sound like a dick but I find it hard to give money to a guy who owns a Ferrari, a sick ass Mercedes, an enormous motorhome and 2 Ducati Superlaggeras. I loved that company when I was doing track days and I wish them luck but thats the burden of business. Its the riders fault and it will get worked out.
Here is a valid question. If he doesn't use the donated money will he return it or keep it in the company? Its not a guarantee he needs it if the case gets tossed early on. Right? Just my .02
Good luck with the bullshit lawsuit though. I do hope they crush that little wimp.
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Old 03-19-2018, 07:33 PM   #142
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Man I might sound like a dick
You don't sound like a dick. You are one and your tiny brain doesn't even comprehend what is a stake here. There were approximately 20 crashes at Keigwins season opener despite the fact that in the riders meeting everyone was told the track was slick and cold. No fast lap times would be recorded. It was explained, (keep your dick in your pants) take it easy. no one listened. If Kim wins and even gets a dime, all 20 of these bozos and every crasher at every track day everywhere will be filing lawsuits for damages. Goodbye track days for everyone.

The owner's gofundme page is not an attempt to get his legal expenses paid. It is an attempt to show the insurance company his customers support his desire not to settle and to keep fighting. (when they want to settle)

You and all the other haters that think a self made millionaire should support your cheap track days from personal wealth obtained in the private sector need to grow a brain. Clearly none of you have one!
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Old 03-19-2018, 10:02 PM   #143
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You don't sound like a dick. You are one and your tiny brain doesn't even comprehend what is a stake here. There were approximately 20 crashes at Keigwins season opener despite the fact that in the riders meeting everyone was told the track was slick and cold. No fast lap times would be recorded. It was explained, (keep your dick in your pants) take it easy. no one listened. If Kim wins and even gets a dime, all 20 of these bozos and every crasher at every track day everywhere will be filing lawsuits for damages. Goodbye track days for everyone.

The owner's gofundme page is not an attempt to get his legal expenses paid. It is an attempt to show the insurance company his customers support his desire not to settle and to keep fighting. (when they want to settle)

You and all the other haters that think a self made millionaire should support your cheap track days from personal wealth obtained in the private sector need to grow a brain. Clearly none of you have one!
Hey don't put words in my mouth...I tend to agree with you. Keigwins is an awesome trackday organizer. I've only had the pleasure to use them 3 times because I didn't start doing trackdays until I was almost eligible for Denny's discounts .

Anyway, this guy is a disgrace...he's the CEO of a successful company that builds two wheel electric vehicles. How would he like to get sued by someone who has an accident with his product and it's totally the operators fault, but some attorney thinks he can get some money out of a corporation and tries to sue. Maybe karma will be his downfall. Sorry Ernie...I'm off topic. I'll chip in some for this good cause. I hope all trackday regulars and motorcycle enthusiast follow suit and support this worthy cause. Simon, Jesse and the whole Keigwins crew are awesome.
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Old 03-20-2018, 01:33 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by wfo439 View Post
You don't sound like a dick. You are one and your tiny brain doesn't even comprehend what is a stake here. There were approximately 20 crashes at Keigwins season opener despite the fact that in the riders meeting everyone was told the track was slick and cold. No fast lap times would be recorded. It was explained, (keep your dick in your pants) take it easy. no one listened. If Kim wins and even gets a dime, all 20 of these bozos and every crasher at every track day everywhere will be filing lawsuits for damages. Goodbye track days for everyone.

The owner's gofundme page is not an attempt to get his legal expenses paid. It is an attempt to show the insurance company his customers support his desire not to settle and to keep fighting. (when they want to settle)

You and all the other haters that think a self made millionaire should support your cheap track days from personal wealth obtained in the private sector need to grow a brain. Clearly none of you have one!

WFO has been suspended, by unanimous moderator vote, for the post above which is a violation of TOS 4.1. Keep it civil.
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Old 03-20-2018, 08:00 PM   #145
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I don't understand the need for $ on Kegwins part.

If they have insurance, the insurance company pays for the attorney to defend Kegwins.

So if Kegwins need $, they must not have had adequate or any insurance and that was a very bad business decision.
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Old 03-20-2018, 08:23 PM   #146
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WFO has been suspended, by unanimous moderator vote, for the post above which is a violation of TOS 4.1. Keep it civil.
If it matters to his suspension, Im not offended by his comments. Its an emotional issue that he is close to and he lost his mind, I get it. I think he's overreacting about the issue but then again, Im a dick so what do I know.
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Old 03-21-2018, 09:17 AM   #147
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Thread from RC (same title) merged into this one as of 3/21-merged threads start with post #142. A couple of PMs were exchanged with OP, Ernie, about merging, keeping thread closed or open. He opted to have the entire thing closed.
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