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Tesla Model 3: End of the Internal-Combustion Engine?

Lmao, the sudden unintended acceleration is what happens when you put 500hp cars in the hands of commoners who are used to their ICE shitboxes.

So far not a single case has been proven.
 
Tesla isn’t the first car company to be accused of sudden acceleration. The usual cause is a loose nut behind the steering wheel but with cars becoming more autonomous, at some point a car will make a decision that isn’t in the occupant’s best interest.
 
tzrider said:
Tesla isn’t the first car company to be accused of sudden acceleration. The usual cause is a loose nut behind the steering wheel but with cars becoming more autonomou, at some point a car will make a decision that isn’t in the occupant’s best interest.
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The Audi's that go accused of it, back in the 80's only had pedals that were narrower and a little different placement, but that didn't stop them from becoming 'undesirable', especially as used cars. Nevermind that the linkage didn't even exist on the brake pedal to even cause acceleration.

I knew several people who really enjoyed their used audi's that they got for a great price.
 
mrzuzzo said:
Lmao, the sudden unintended acceleration is what happens when you put 500hp cars in the hands of commoners who are used to their ICE shitboxes.

So far not a single case has been proven.
Click to expand...

Do you think that people that can afford the high performance variants of the Teslas came from some gutless Corolla? Not defending the collective skills of Tesla drivers here. Just saying that people that can spring for let’s just say an average $100k car, probably did not come from a shitbox.

And you don’t need some ludicrous mode level of power to get into trouble with “unintended acceleration.” Those little buzzwords that get thrown around so much in my industry these days started with the oh so high performance Toyota Prius.
 
tzrider said:
Tesla isn’t the first car company to be accused of sudden acceleration. The usual cause is a loose nut behind the steering wheel but with cars becoming more autonomous, at some point a car will make a decision that isn’t in the occupant’s best interest.
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It was proved to be floor mats bunching up and wedging the pedal down.
 
TheRobSJ said:
It was proved to be floor mats bunching up and wedging the pedal down.
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I have to agree because I actually came across this on in my sister's car. She would stack a thin plastic mat on her stock mat. Then feel it didn't do a good enough job of catching the dirt from her shoes, so she bough a thick rubber mat and threw it on top or a combination of mats in various orders. First time the mats bunched up at the base of the gas pedal. Second time, different vehicle of hers, the mats bunched up behind the brake pedal when I was driving it. That was crazy shit too. I'd tell her and she'd still have various mat stacked on a mat in every new car she got.

Hell now that I think about it, once I went to push on the brake and the mat pressed down on the gas pedal at the same time.
 
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TheRobSJ said:
Do you think that people that can afford the high performance variants of the Teslas came from some gutless Corolla? Not defending the collective skills of Tesla drivers here. Just saying that people that can spring for let’s just say an average $100k car, probably did not come from a shitbox.

And you don’t need some ludicrous mode level of power to get into trouble with “unintended acceleration.” Those little buzzwords that get thrown around so much in my industry these days started with the oh so high performance Toyota Prius.
Click to expand...

With Tesla you don't need the high-performance version for it to be quick off the line. They are all quick.

In a Prius you'd be able to correct yourself in the second it takes to get going if you accidentally mash the throttle.

In any Tesla, you'd be long gone.
 
tzrider said:
So, speaking of "internal combustion," a Tesla driver lost control, took out a light pole and crashed into a brick wall in Pleasanton Saturday evening. The car caught fire and was fully consumed within minutes. The driver didn't make it out.

After the fire was put out and the car was taken away, the car reignited.

Something we don't talk a lot about with EVs is a lithium ion battery's tendency to catch fire if damaged. Gasoline cars can burn too of course, but this fire spread very rapidly and was difficult to extinguish.

My wife saw a family getting into a Model X at a local hardware store on Sunday with a bunch of fire extinguishers. :laughing

We haven't discussed EV's but her feeling right now is, "No way in hell." I kind of feel the same way until solid state batteries make it into vehicles.
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Pretty silly to not look at the stats/facts and base your decision off a fairly rare one-time occurrence.

People will find ways to die in any vehicle, there is no evidence suggesting that Teslas are more dangerous.
 
It's SDFUS (Sudden Driver Fuck Up Syndrome) all over again. Research says it was first observed in an Audi back in nineteen eighty...
 
tzrider said:
The NHTSA studied 75 cases and found one instance of pedal entrapment. The rest were attributed to driver error, iirc.
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There’s gotta be something to it. After the fiasco with the runaway Priuses, there was a recall to install floor mat anchors into the cars. And now all new cars have them. They also have the logic programmed in to override the drive by wire accelerator pedal position if the brake pedal is depressed at the same time.

Personally, all but one case of “unintended acceleration” I’ve seen at Acura have been from people having a bunched up floor mat situation. Yes we have the anchors, but people stack multiple mats (WTF is wrong with you people) and the anchors can only hold one in place. One other case, the guy blamed the car accelerating on its own and getting in a wreck. We “black boxed” him and determined that he probably fell asleep. No throttle or brake input at all during the event. Probably looking to save his insurance rates from going up by trying to pass blame.


mrzuzzo said:
With Tesla you don't need the high-performance version for it to be quick off the line. They are all quick.

In a Prius you'd be able to correct yourself in the second it takes to get going if you accidentally mash the throttle.

In any Tesla, you'd be long gone.
Click to expand...

Never overestimate the skill of Prius drivers. Much like Tesla drivers, I see a Prius, Volvo, or minivan of any kind on the road and I assign them a higher threat level.

And again, all of the people I know with Teslas, they either still have or didn’t come from a gutless vehicle. I think the 3 series BMW is one of the more popular conquests (industry data, not my anecdotal evidence) for Teslas. While I doubt many are walking away from a M3 GTS to get a Tesla, even the typical 3 series isn’t exactly what I’d call shitbox.
 
The unintended acceleration complaints seem to be at least partially from a Tesla Short seller that does not even own the car.

Tesla has redundant accelerator pedal sensors and data logging to prove what happened case by case. The statistics seem on par with "pedal misapplication" cause - which has been a cause for so many unintended acceleration issues with other automakers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqTXhKVtQbU
 
TheRobSJ said:
There’s gotta be something to it. After the fiasco with the runaway Priuses, there was a recall to install floor mat anchors into the cars. And now all new cars have them. They also have the logic programmed in to override the drive by wire accelerator pedal position if the brake pedal is depressed at the same time.

Personally, all but one case of “unintended acceleration” I’ve seen at Acura have been from people having a bunched up floor mat situation. Yes we have the anchors, but people stack multiple mats (WTF is wrong with you people) and the anchors can only hold one in place. One other case, the guy blamed the car accelerating on its own and getting in a wreck. We “black boxed” him and determined that he probably fell asleep. No throttle or brake input at all during the event. Probably looking to save his insurance rates from going up by trying to pass blame.




Never overestimate the skill of Prius drivers. Much like Tesla drivers, I see a Prius, Volvo, or minivan of any kind on the road and I assign them a higher threat level.

And again, all of the people I know with Teslas, they either still have or didn’t come from a gutless vehicle. I think the 3 series BMW is one of the more popular conquests (industry data, not my anecdotal evidence) for Teslas. While I doubt many are walking away from a M3 GTS to get a Tesla, even the typical 3 series isn’t exactly what I’d call shitbox.
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"Here are the highlights of Bloomberg’s top ten cars ditched for a Model 3*

No. 1 most traded in was the Toyota Prius, with an average selling price of $27,080

No. 2, the BMW 3 Series, with an average selling price of $46,477

No. 5, the Nissan Leaf with an average selling price of $34,562

Others ranked in the top ten were inexpensive cars like the Toyota Camry, Honda Accord, Honda Civic, and Mazda 3"

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brooke...licting-results-in-brand-survey/#5c24b6dd2658
 
I thought the Audi issue was a lack of interlock to prevent the driver from shifting the automatic transmission into drive without stepping on the brake pedal.

People would step on the gas instead of brake by mistake, pop the car into gear and then mash the pedal harder when they started rolling all the sudden since their brain though they where on the brake pedal.
 
TheRobSJ said:
Do you think that people that can afford the high performance variants of the Teslas came from some gutless Corolla? Not defending the collective skills of Tesla drivers here. Just saying that people that can spring for let’s just say an average $100k car, probably did not come from a shitbox.
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Actually yes. Aside from mrzuzzo's putting down drivers not as cool as him (and while also being correct that the Teslas are quite too powerful), my personal anecdotal evidence is pretty much most of the Tesla owners I know, come from "shitboxes". ... I'm just viewing their shitboxes differently. Yes, the people I know all came from the Honda Vans, AND a Nissan Leafs, etc. One hit the hood of his previous wagon with his garage door. They were simply all these drivers that we consider 'driving while ... braindead' , some with wide blocky oversize shade covers over their regular glasses.

I've also seen them now not knowing where to charge the Tesla 3 (but still bought it), or fiddle with the rear pass seatbelt switch of a Tesla X (I guess one of those 'quality issues'!!!) because the car complained.. :(

That said... since the appearance of the Tesla 3, I had two cases where the 3s wanted to race me.. one even slingshot up and then braked, on a highway.. so hotheads exist, now that we got out of the "old guys family car" range for the S and X and the "lower" price Tesla 3 was offered.

Only one guy I know came from the typical "dude with a 3 series" when he was younger, vanity plate and all, and then Tesla. But then again he had $$$$ for a young guy, not for a family guy.

TheRobSJ said:
.. but people stack multiple mats (WTF is wrong with you people)
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.. as for that.. it's simply hearsay/culture. I've literally seen/heard this young woman, who leased the Toyota brand new, basically say "OK now I'll go buy some mats to put on top". They want to ... protect the car IMO.
You have to view it from the eyes of other people.
 
mrzuzzo said:
Pretty silly to not look at the stats/facts and base your decision off a fairly rare one-time occurrence.

People will find ways to die in any vehicle, there is no evidence suggesting that Teslas are more dangerous.
Click to expand...

While true, what people disregard when looking at stats is the manner of the failure and how likely it is to happen to any given individual. With Tesla, though the incident don't happen often, they are usually fairly spectacular and out of the driver's control.

The Pleasanton crash cause is not known, but it seems likely it's driver error. Cars that have caught fire due to battery damage from road debris are more insidious and can happen to even attentive and skilled drivers. The crash where the Tesla steered itself into the median seems not to have been a driver error.

I'm OK with a car that kills me if I fuck up. I don't need a car that does random shit.

It's awesome that you love your car. I hope it is always reliable and that you remain unable to understand why other people might not want one just yet.
 
bpw said:
I thought the Audi issue was a lack of interlock to prevent the driver from shifting the automatic transmission into drive without stepping on the brake pedal.

People would step on the gas instead of brake by mistake, pop the car into gear and then mash the pedal harder when they started rolling all the sudden since their brain though they where on the brake pedal.
Click to expand...

The Audi issue was caused by the fact that the tight pedal spread they used, normal in Europe, seemed to be too difficult for some American's to grasp. There was nothing wrong with the pedal functioning, it was solely people thinking they had the brake pedal when they had the gas.
 
I'll believe that there is an acceleration problem at Tesla when someone comes forward with real evidence of it happening once. So far, there isn't a single, real documented case, just a lot of conjecture, largely by a short seller.

Now, an autopilot issue? That I think is very real and it's getting criminal that the Feds haven't looked into that long ago and put an end to Tesla's misleading marketing.

And the idea that a car maker can put a feature in a car that allows it to operate autonomously in parking lots with no driver in it, WITH ABSOLUTELY ZERO REGULATORY TESTING, is fucking beyond me.
 
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