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Why European motorcycles are doing better then the Japanese

Well why are people still buying more European Brands then Japanese brands even if there competitively priced with one another.

I wouldn't say people are buying more European brand bikes because I still see more new or newer Japanese bikes than European bikes on the streets and events such as the International Motorcycle Show.

Although the MSRP gap is as close as it has ever been thanks to the Japanese brands continuing to increase their MSRP year after year and the European brands' MSRP either idling, or has minimal increases or in some cases lower than the previous MSRP, I think a major factor why Japanese bikes still far outweigh European bikes on the streets is Japanese brand bikes can still be bought for way less than its MSRP. When that huge discount is taken into account, the Japanese brand bikes are still thousands less than comparable European brand bikes. Another factor is European bikes tend to cost more to own overall i.e., maintenance.

I still see brand new 2011 Japanese brand literbikes go for about $10-11K regularly instead of the listed $13k plus MSRP. Can't say that about the Duc 1198, BMW S1000RR, or other 2011 European brand liters. That huge discount also applies to other models and classes and have been that way for years. That's been my observations over the years.
 
After doing a little "soul searching" I feel that my latest purchase tends to reflect some of the posts.

I'm in my 40's.
I've been riding 25 years, mid-80's.
I still earn a decent paycheck.
I have owned 18 Japanese motorcycles
Not counting my vintage Vespa

I just bought my first European motorcycle. Why? I was looking for an FZ1 to totally streetfighter. But I bought a KTM SuperDuke.

I didn't consider a Ducati Monster. Or the Speed Triple. Too common.

The KTM came to mind and I bought it the next day. It was uncommon. quirky. Brash.

Maybe I am getting older and I want to have what I never had. Maybe i'm bored with the I-4 motor.

The KTM is so unlike anything I have owned. I am pleased.

Miguel
 
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European bikes for the most part are as reliable as japanese bikes and have lost that stigma that they had like the old Triumphs of the 60's and 70'sm.

I pretty much ruled out all Ducati's cuz they drop valves or jsut need rebuilds quickly and BMW's for drive shafts exploding when I was searching for a used bike. I don't remember finding anything that drastic on Japanese bikes except for yamahas blowing 2nd gear and the newer cbr1000 with their oil/massive design flaw thingie.
 
This argument has been made for 40 years, and yet they Japanese brands sell way, way, way more bikes than the Euros. Why? Because they are awesome at giving consumers exactly the bikes they need/want/can afford. All the Euro streetbikes sold in the USA combined would be maybe half of the two smallest Japanese brands combined and 20% of H-D. Honda Motors builds tens of millions of vehicles a year, so if BMW sells 10,000 more R1200GSs, I don't think corporate officers will be hurling themselves out of 10th-story windows in despair.

Jensen's story was good, but he is writing from a very narrow range of experience--the last 5 years or so. The Japanese think 10, 20, 30 years ahead and have made billions--trillions?--of dollars making soul-less, but very capable, products that people want to buy. His argument describes why you and me may not want to buy a Japanese motorcycle, but is weak as a warning to Hamamatsu's product planners to build bikes with soul.

Has he considered that maybe, just maybe, the bikes with soul don't sell very well?
 
I pretty much ruled out all Ducati's cuz they drop valves or jsut need rebuilds quickly and BMW's for drive shafts exploding when I was searching for a used bike. I don't remember finding anything that drastic on Japanese bikes except for yamahas blowing 2nd gear and the newer cbr1000 with their oil/massive design flaw thingie.

The only thing defective is your grammar and not either of the brands your mentioning. :nerd

Do everyone a favor and do some research, before you pollute the boards with your gibberish and ridiculous statements again.. :twofinger
 
This argument has been made for 40 years, and yet they Japanese brands sell way, way, way more bikes than the Euros. Why? Because they are awesome at giving consumers exactly the bikes they need/want/can afford. All the Euro streetbikes sold in the USA combined would be maybe half of the two smallest Japanese brands combined and 20% of H-D. Honda Motors builds tens of millions of vehicles a year, so if BMW sells 10,000 more R1200GSs, I don't think corporate officers will be hurling themselves out of 10th-story windows in despair.

Jensen's story was good, but he is writing from a very narrow range of experience--the last 5 years or so. The Japanese think 10, 20, 30 years ahead and have made billions--trillions?--of dollars making soul-less, but very capable, products that people want to buy. His argument describes why you and me may not want to buy a Japanese motorcycle, but is weak as a warning to Hamamatsu's product planners to build bikes with soul.

Has he considered that maybe, just maybe, the bikes with soul don't sell very well?

Very well said...

Or as an alternative argument, maybe consumers want bikes with no "soul", as it is oft recognized as a veiled excuse used often by merchants to hide a variety of shortcomings... You know, like when your friend tries to set you up on a blind date with a girl who has a lot of personality.

I had a friend in college who had an Alfa GTV6, which I thought was a nice looking car at the time and was even thinking of getting one, but his broke down every other week and had a really chincy and uncomfortable interior and horrible ergonomics. I can still remember him justifying all of it saying "Yeah, but it's got that uniqueness, it talks to you!" as we were hopping into my Toyota to go somewhere.

Are Reliability and Soul mutually exclusive in the vehicle market?
 
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This argument has been made for 40 years, and yet they Japanese brands sell way, way, way more bikes than the Euros. Why? Because they are awesome at giving consumers exactly the bikes they need/want/can afford. All the Euro streetbikes sold in the USA combined would be maybe half of the two smallest Japanese brands combined and 20% of H-D. Honda Motors builds tens of millions of vehicles a year, so if BMW sells 10,000 more R1200GSs, I don't think corporate officers will be hurling themselves out of 10th-story windows in despair.

Jensen's story was good, but he is writing from a very narrow range of experience--the last 5 years or so. The Japanese think 10, 20, 30 years ahead and have made billions--trillions?--of dollars making soul-less, but very capable, products that people want to buy. His argument describes why you and me may not want to buy a Japanese motorcycle, but is weak as a warning to Hamamatsu's product planners to build bikes with soul.

Has he considered that maybe, just maybe, the bikes with soul don't sell very well?



+1

This article only has meaning in wealthy metropolitan areas. Ducati's are big here so, riders here think they must be selling like hotcakes.
 
This argument has been made for 40 years, and yet they Japanese brands sell way, way, way more bikes than the Euros. Why? Because they are awesome at giving consumers exactly the bikes they need/want/can afford. All the Euro streetbikes sold in the USA combined would be maybe half of the two smallest Japanese brands combined and 20% of H-D. Honda Motors builds tens of millions of vehicles a year, so if BMW sells 10,000 more R1200GSs, I don't think corporate officers will be hurling themselves out of 10th-story windows in despair.

Jensen's story was good, but he is writing from a very narrow range of experience--the last 5 years or so. The Japanese think 10, 20, 30 years ahead and have made billions--trillions?--of dollars making soul-less, but very capable, products that people want to buy. His argument describes why you and me may not want to buy a Japanese motorcycle, but is weak as a warning to Hamamatsu's product planners to build bikes with soul.

Has he considered that maybe, just maybe, the bikes with soul don't sell very well?
+2
I've never understood this "soul" crap? I had an R1200ST, and people talk of how great BMWs are cuz they gotz "soul" but I call it high maintenance, paint shake'in, quirkiness myself. Y'all can keep that shit! :laughing
Bad news fer y'all, bikes don't have soul, they're just machines! :rofl
 
+1

This article only has meaning in wealthy metropolitan areas. Ducati's are big here so, riders here think they must be selling like hotcakes.

I think the numbers are about 10,000 nationally for Ducati. BMW does about 15k, Triumph 12-14k, and Aprilia and Moto Guzzi combined sell about 1000 motorcycles.
 
"soul"
LOL.

This conversation reminds me a little of the typical New VFR discussion.

"I want a 1000cc V5 with 190+ Hp and weighs less then 400lbs and also has comfortable pillion as my wife likes to go and make sure it has a 10 gallon gas tank and please give me ohlins and adjustable windshield and a chain no I mean a shaft drive and it had better be quality and feel like a Desmosedici because of the "racing heritage blah blah" and give me ten colors to choose from and and automatic dick warmer!! WTF??!! The goddamn Japs can't give it to me for 10 grand?!! Fuck them then!!! I'll show them!! I'll buy the $22,000 BMW that weighs 600lbs and has 135 hp brag about its the most powerful thing eva!! Then act smug about my "soulful" purchase.....
 
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