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Old 04-01-2016, 11:28 AM   #31
TheRobSJ
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Originally Posted by nbean16 View Post
Ok. Well i drive to la often. You asked why would anyone not buy one. Thats why. And there are plenty of long range commuters. 215 is max range likely babying it as well.
You can always stop at the Supercharger station in Colinga and smell cowshit for half an hour (more if there's a line) and you'll get enough juice to make it the rest of the way!



I'm driving to Torrance next week. I'll bet I make it there at least an hour faster than anyone in a Tesla could.
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Old 04-01-2016, 11:37 AM   #32
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Nissan Leaf sells for 15K after incentives new in Colorado. If you go there to find a slightly used one you can probably have it for around 7-8k after depreciation. Seems this is the best bang for the buck...have to get it shipped though...range problems.

Tesla is doing good things...anyone talking about where they are getting the precious metals for the batteries in Africa? The heavy mining and pollution it creates vs. switching folks to easily made diesel?
you rang?
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Old 04-01-2016, 11:40 AM   #33
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I don't drive 200+ mi daily but when I do want to, I want to. So a plug-in hybrid should be more useful. The superchargers could make it work, but they have limited capacities and locations. In terms of global warming and air pollution modern ICE is already so much better than before that I think there are much lower hanging fruit. When I'm on the freeway it's the old vehicles and diesel trucks that spew the most... if we're gonna have incentives they should be for any new car really. And hydrogen still seems more scalable and better in the long run.
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Old 04-01-2016, 11:41 AM   #34
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Africa and North America is where they get their metal. There's a big mine close to where the giga factory is being built. Madagascar has recently found huge deposits as well. No regulations and it's a dirty strip mining process.
What precious metals specifically?
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Old 04-01-2016, 12:05 PM   #35
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True. Tesla should have taken those deposits in Nevada and not California.
Why ? I don't understand Nevada v California
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Old 04-01-2016, 12:10 PM   #36
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The way they designed the trunk and the lid is stupid:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16SW...utu.be&t=3m24s
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Old 04-01-2016, 12:10 PM   #37
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What precious metals specifically?
I was referring to the biggest component of the anode of their Li-ion batteries, large-flake graphite. For their cathode, lithium from Western Lithium USA. The anode / graphite isn't likely to change / develop as quickly as the cathode / lithium does.
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Old 04-01-2016, 12:15 PM   #38
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Really? You'd prefer what looks like an econo-hatch to a sports sedan?
Yes, I like the layout, easy to throw stuff in the back. Plus, I already have experience with Chevy's battery layout as I geeked out on how my current car, a Chevy Volt, operates.

I guess the future motorhead arguments will move from Mopar vs. Motorcraft to Panasonic (Tesla's battery supplier) vs. LG Chem (Chevy's battery supplier)

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Why ? I don't understand Nevada v California
By law, all deposits in California are refundable.
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Old 04-01-2016, 12:38 PM   #39
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If a republican wins and defunds fed tax credits for EV, there goes Tesla's operating income. If they can manage to keep a going concern for long enough to bring costs down and expand production they will be okay.

If a democrat wins and pushes for responsible mining practices, there goes Tesla's future profit margin until they can bring costs down with the giga factory.

Panasonic is helping to fund the factory and I think they are hoping for an opportunity to pick up the PP&E for pennies on the dollar from Tesla should one of the things above result in a substantial doubt regarding their going concern and they shutter or consolidate.
By the time all that happens oil will be back to $80/barrel and EV's still looking good
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Old 04-01-2016, 01:05 PM   #40
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Nice car but there's no fuel filler door so how do you pump gas innit?
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Old 04-01-2016, 01:09 PM   #41
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The new Tesla Model 3 was whipped out yesterday...beautiful car, $35,000 ($25,000 after incentives), 215-mile range and Tesla already has 135,000 $1000 deposits. Crazy.

It won't be out in significant numbers for a couple of years, but I'm looking at this car and wondering why anybody would want to spend money on a gas-engine car when they could have this for the same price or less.
You wonder why certain car buyers don't only factor cost or economy into their buying decision?

Do you also wonder who certain motorcycle buyers choose a Panigale 899 over a scooter that gets 100mpg?

Looks like they did a better job styling the Model 3 than the prior cars, but a) it ain't gonna really be $35k when you factor in minimum options most buyers will want, b) the incentives are going to be largely used up by Tesla by the time the 3 goes on sale, and c) that back seat looks even smaller than the Model S, which didn't even work for me at 6'2". I would probably spend $22k on the Camry my son drives before I paid likely over $40k for a Model 3. If you're gonna buy a box on wheels, I'd go for the cheapest and the more spacious, of which the Model 3 appears to be neither. That said, I do think it's the best looking car they've made so far and I think they'll sell a lot of them, at least in the first few years it's actually in the market.
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Old 04-01-2016, 01:10 PM   #42
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I placed my reservation yesterday for the Model 3 and plan on getting a fully loaded one. I currently have a BMW i3 so I'll already fully electric outside of my moto. Even my wife loves the car and says that she wants one as soon as they make a convertible.
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Old 04-01-2016, 01:12 PM   #43
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Depending on how one drives/ weather, etc...fully gonna be a problem. The larger problem will be the pull on the electricity grid mid day. EV's are going to drive CA energy rates higher. Yay.



Like an airplane spec sheet, that's an ideal/ best case situation. I'd expect about 150-180 miles/ day. That's not bad, but a few around town trips in the middle of the day and the asshole puckering starts to happen.

I think there's gonna be a good business in towing huge Military grade generators around with superchargers on them and charging people's Teslas in the middle of the day!
I'm planning on having a large solar panel array installed so that will alleviate some strain from my Model 3 charging.
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Old 04-01-2016, 01:20 PM   #44
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The range is ok for families where this is a second car (commute, shopping trips etc.). I wouldn't want one as an only vehicle though.
Agreed that the range is still not functional for an only vehicle for most, unless you factor in the cost and PITA of getting a rental some weekends that can actually go anywhere and back in a day.

A $35k "second car" is a ludicrous concept for the vast majority of people outside the Bay Area.
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Old 04-01-2016, 01:38 PM   #45
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Agreed that the range is still not functional for an only vehicle for most, unless you factor in the cost and PITA of getting a rental some weekends that can actually go anywhere and back in a day.

A $35k "second car" is a ludicrous concept for the vast majority of people outside the Bay Area.
Yup, I have lived in this area for too long. $35k is a lot for a second, runabout car.

We drive to LA once every couple of months to visit in-laws and friends. The rental doesn't work for us because we have four dogs, and slobber/shedding happens.

I could get an electric as a commuter, but I'd probably be more inclined to get a Zero. Cheaper, lane-splitting etc.
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