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Old 11-24-2020, 03:54 PM   #1
spicy.ramen
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Rear Wheel Slippage

It feels like I am only on BARF to reveal my bad riding skills.

I recently went up highway 1 passed Jenner and had a lowsider on a tight loop. I was going 15 mph around the turn when I felt the rear wheel slip, but since I was taking it pretty slow, the bike and I left with only a few bumps and bruises.
My question is how can I overcome the fear of going into these turns? I think I have to chalk it up to a slippery road surface and inexperience with turning on these surfaces, but I notice that I'm really scared to take any of the deeper turns beyond a crawl.

Any thoughts or stories of motivation? Thanks a bunch barfers.
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Old 11-24-2020, 04:13 PM   #2
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Old 11-24-2020, 05:52 PM   #3
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Keep your eyes up and look where you want to go. Make all your inputs smooth but decisive. Slow in, fast out. Do it a lot to build muscle memory.

Visualize what the suspension is doing and how that affects traction. Being tentative and off the gas (coasting) makes the bike unstable in the turns. The bike is more stable with the suspension and tires pressed down into the pavement by the braking/cornering/accelerating forces. Visualize how the weight shifts and how the traction changes between your front and rear tires as you brake, turn, accelerate, and position your body.

Another way to think about falling down in the turns - the bike only falls when it loses forward movement; closing the throttle and losing speed would do that. If you keep a steady throttle and be loose on the bars and steer as needed, the bike will keep going even if the wheels are slipping. Feel how you can use the throttle to balance the lean - a little less throttle to lean more and tighten the turn, a little more throttle to stop the lean.
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Old 11-24-2020, 08:26 PM   #4
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Find a parking lot to practice in.

Set up an oval as long as you can fit.

As you ride along the long sides do the following in order:
1) slow to the correct entry speed that allows you to be on the throttle maintaining speed or accelerating a little, all the way through the turn.
2) turn your head to look all the way through the turn about a 1/2 to 1 second before you turn the bike.
3) turn the bike, making sure you keep looking through the turn and maintaining the throttle through the turn.
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Old 11-25-2020, 06:24 AM   #5
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Lots of good advice here.

Primarily, don't look right in front of the bike. Look ahead of the bike. As far as you safely can. If you are looking five feet in front of the bike, that's how much time you have if something comes up to react. The time it takes to cover five feet. If you are looking thirty feet ahead of the bike, you have six times as much time and space to react.

Be proactive, not reactive.
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Old 11-25-2020, 08:02 AM   #6
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I had almost the exact same type crash on Hwy 1. You weren't underneath a Eucalyptus tree were you ? Those things leave sap that gets very slippery when there is any moisture

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Old 11-25-2020, 09:00 AM   #7
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All of the above...plus emphasis on a couple of ideas already put out here. If you're newer to riding, you're probably not exceeding the tires' grip abilities in that turn. You could have hit a patch of snot (eucalyptus leaves, deer poop, oil, who knows...). You also could have been going too slowly, leaned too much and just fallen over from lack of balance. Maybe you felt the tire "giving" as it lost contact with pavement, and heck, maybe that even helped the fall, but that wasn't the reason you were picking your bike up outta the weeds. On really tight stuff, I rev the throttle and pull in the clutch just a tad--eeeeeease it off once through the turn. I'm not too proud to put my feet down when I'm feeling really chicken either. My pride is cheap--new paint job is expensive.
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Old 11-25-2020, 10:20 AM   #8
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15mph is about right for some tight turns in the mountains. Dont try to go fast in slow corners - they are slow corners after all.

More speed requires lean angle and tire grip. Tire grip requires heat and proper pressure. Both require smooth and appropriate rider inputs. Its all helped by good body position. Doing any of these things poorly will absolutely wreck your confidence. And vice versa - fixing one or all of them will likely give you lots of confidence. So pick one at a time and work on them.
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Old 11-25-2020, 01:51 PM   #9
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Your post is the perfect example of why the crash forum is so valuable; knowing what put us on the ground is what helps us get over the fear it'll happen again. Tight loop? Likely something on the surface, IMO. But, you'll never truly know until you tell yourself "self, that was gravel, coolant, and oil all mixed together".

One question:

When you went down did the inside bar turn into the corner or away from the corner?

Let's try and figure out which tire lost traction first.
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Old 11-25-2020, 09:07 PM   #10
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The only time I recall having the rear tire slip and slide was on braking hard on dry pavement while going straight. (I might have been a tad enthusiastic with the rear brake.) Do you recall braking in the turn?

After the lowside, did you check the road surface for debris, oil, coolant, fine sand and your tires of same?

Plenty of roads in the Berkeley hills and beyond to ride in turns. Still what you consider to be a tight turn might not be described as tight by others. I'd say Wildcat Canyon Rd. has gnarly tight turns whether you're going up or down.

The only way to extinguish a fear is to do what you fear. (And to keep the throttle open at a steady tempo.) Lots of great advice given so far. Good luck!
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Old 11-26-2020, 07:12 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by dravnx View Post
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I imagine the first thing you may remember after getting on the bike is feeling every twitch of the tires as if they're about to give way "yet again".

Having had that happen to me once or twice, I know that's how I felt. Every wiggle broadcast to my brain that it was going to be a high side, or low side, or up side, or down side.

And all you can do is ride through that trying to be conscious of the fact that it's always been that way, you're just hyper sensitive to it.

Riding in the dirt for any length of time (and it doesn't take much) and you'll find the darn bike doesn't stay still at all, that it's all over the place and seems to you can't stop the sliding, so you just roll with it.

But then you get back on asphalt and feel like you're glued to the road more than ever.

So, simply, just ride, and ride some more. The only way to get the experience to deal with those situations is to keep getting saddle time.
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Old 11-27-2020, 01:58 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by spicy.ramen View Post
It feels like I am only on BARF to reveal my bad riding skills.

I recently went up highway 1 passed Jenner and had a lowsider on a tight loop. I was going 15 mph around the turn when I felt the rear wheel slip, but since I was taking it pretty slow, the bike and I left with only a few bumps and bruises.
My question is how can I overcome the fear of going into these turns? I think I have to chalk it up to a slippery road surface and inexperience with turning on these surfaces, but I notice that I'm really scared to take any of the deeper turns beyond a crawl.

Any thoughts or stories of motivation? Thanks a bunch barfers.
You were likely at the bottom of one of the box canyons along that route. If that’s the case, then you were in a shady, damp area, where the road never really fully dries out in some places. From there the surface gets green and snotty, which creates an issue for motos.

As for being “really scared to take any of the deeper turns beyond a crawl”, it sounds like you might be a newer rider who is still learning about your moto’s capabilities.

So two things to consider:
1. Work on understanding the different types of surface you might encounter, noticing which type of surface you’re riding on at any given moment, and understanding how you must adjust your riding accordingly.
2. Seek out ways to practice slow speed, tight corners - whether that’s on a known, favorite stretch of road where it’s safe to make a pass through the corner(s) and then turn around and do it again; or attend an MSF advanced rider course; or sign up for a track day (although there the corners probably won’t be quite so slow).
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Old 11-27-2020, 03:25 PM   #13
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Old 11-28-2020, 05:31 PM   #14
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If you’re trying to figure out the cause, first, as Holeshot says, determine which end slid. His question is useful to that end.

Second, can you describe what you were doing with the controls when the bike slid?
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