night riders?

[jimichanga]

hopefully this post doesn't get all insane! lol so i took all the good advice i got here last time and got serious seat time in over the past month & a half-ish (seriously, like 800 miles) and i'm back for more! lol i haven't gone down just yet and i got a way better grip on my clutch control and shifting. i'm interested in taking baby steps into night riding now (something i'm sure i'll need to learn sooner or later) and i'm wondering if anybody does this regularly that would be willing to take me around a couple times or if anyone has tips on how to go about this vs. day time riding? i'm in no rush, but it seems like it could be a lot of [dangerous] fun to do once in a while so i'm curious. thanks!

 

[Ol' Gravy Leg]

Welcome back. Glad that thread didn't scare you off. It got a little crazy.

 

[jimichanga]

haha thank you i'm a wee bit tougher than i look. but i got exactly what i needed from the thread, despite all the unnecessary stuff. so i'm still regarding this site as a fantastic resource haha

 

[quicksparks]

Zeroth: Increase following distance.

First, adjust your headlight so the low beam illuminates as far ahead as possible without blinding oncoming traffic.

Second, when available, use the headlights of cars around you to see more of the road surface.

Third, have a smudge-free, scratch-free, clean-as-possible shield.

Fourth, accept that hitting potholes and other crap is inevitable.

Edit: I keep thinking of more stuff, but here's the last one for now: flick on the high beam when leaning, in almost all cases, for all but slight bends, even with cars around you. The exception would be if you know for sure you're blinding someone and if you're not leaned over far.

 

[ST Guy]

Zeroth: Increase following distance.

First, adjust your headlight so the low beam illuminates as far ahead as possible without blinding oncoming traffic.

Second, when available, use the headlights of cars around you to see more of the road surface.

Third, have a smudge-free, scratch-free, clean-as-possible shield.

Fourth, accept that hitting potholes and other crap is inevitable.

Edit: I keep thinking of more stuff, but here's the last one for now: flick on the high beam when leaning, in almost all cases, for all but slight bends, even with cars around you. The exception would be if you know for sure you're blinding someone and if you're not leaned over far.

Good advice.

And consider some aftermarket driving lights. Good ones cost money, but the extra lighting can be well worth the expense. And remember, you can always take the lights off and keep them for your next bike when you upgrade.

 

[revnort]

Same as the day except adjust for less visibility. Just like in the day don't out ride your sightlines, in this case it is usually as far as your headlights go.

I assume you are talking about city riding, and not twisties. Twisty rides at night would be ill-advised for all sorts of reasons at this point in your riding.

If you decide to do the headlight adjustment suggested above, please do it while you are sitting on the bike and have someone else check its height. When you sit on your bike it changes the angle of the light.

 

[crick]

Same as the day except adjust for less visibility. Just like in the day don't out ride your sightlines, in this case it is usually as far as your headlights go.

I assume you are talking about city riding, and not twisties. Twisty rides at night would be ill-advised for all sorts of reasons at this point in your riding.

If you decide to do the headlight adjustment suggested above, please do it while you are sitting on the bike and have someone else check its height. When you sit on your bike it changes the angle of the light.

twisties at night isnt so great. I live up mt. hamilton. Deers love coming out at night and jumping out at you, then stare at you till you hit it.

my beam gets cut off in the corners so visibility is really reduced. The biggest thing tho is making sure i'm visible to others. night driving is hard enough with low visibility and astigmatism.

i do it tho cuz i have to for commutes from work. you're doing it for fun?

 

[MCSFTGUY]

I am a motorcycle commuter and I work the night shift so I ride home every work day at night. I don't change my riding style between night and day. My night riding is freeway and city environment so there is always plenty of ambient light around. If you go out into the country or areas where there is no ambient lighting, I would slow down a bit.

Adjusting the headlight is not a bad idea, but the fact of the matter is motorcycle headlights are just plain crummy.... the collision reconstruction community actually takes the time to map vehicle headlights for their lighting patterns and luminosity at different heights and the intial info is the motorcycle headlight as really bad. So... adjustment is not really going to fix something that is bad to start with. Put all of this another way, don't expect your motorcycle to light up the road like your car does.

I would look at wearing anything that is high vis or has reflective strips on the back.... look at the back of your motorcycle.... one little dinky taillight that can blend in with surrounding environment. A research paper that came out of Europe shows that when it comes to motorcycles, helmet and torso are the most visible to other drivers so anything in these areas that can get you seen in darkness is good.

Little critters that are out and about at night..... cats, small dogs, racoons possums, etc... if you do happen to encounter something of this size... run it over...... don't brake, swerve or slow... just run over small critters. make sure your motorcycle is straight up and down, and you are centered over it and just run it over.... My wife learned this lesson the hard way in some twisties she swerved to avoid a stinking squrriel and almost ran off the side of the road and down an embankments.... she listens to me more now about things having to do with riding..... True story, even the listening part!!!!

Lastly, trust your own instincts..... if you have been driving a car at night you know what the night time environment can be like. that environment is the same no matter what you are driving or riding, so ride in your comfort zone.

 

[pt65]

All good advice.

There are actually organized night rides. Maybe start with one of those. Safety in numbers, you know.

Critters were mentioned - nobody mentioned that Deer are friggin Zombies! And they come out just before the sun goes down. Maybe they are more akin to vampires lol.

And, seriously, avoid AT ALL COSTS riding at twilight / dusk. It is the darkest time of day. Shadows are blackest, lights blaze brightest, and critters stir the most.

 

[jimichanga]

great stuff guys, thanks! one question - in the MSF course, the coach told us that riding in the left labe was best on the freeway, is this true at night also?

I am a motorcycle commuter and I work the night shift so I ride home every work day at night. I don't change my riding style between night and day. My night riding is freeway and city environment so there is always plenty of ambient light around. If you go out into the country or areas where there is no ambient lighting, I would slow down a bit.

Adjusting the headlight is not a bad idea, but the fact of the matter is motorcycle headlights are just plain crummy.... the collision reconstruction community actually takes the time to map vehicle headlights for their lighting patterns and luminosity at different heights and the intial info is the motorcycle headlight as really bad. So... adjustment is not really going to fix something that is bad to start with. Put all of this another way, don't expect your motorcycle to light up the road like your car does.

I would look at wearing anything that is high vis or has reflective strips on the back.... look at the back of your motorcycle.... one little dinky taillight that can blend in with surrounding environment. A research paper that came out of Europe shows that when it comes to motorcycles, helmet and torso are the most visible to other drivers so anything in these areas that can get you seen in darkness is good.

Little critters that are out and about at night..... cats, small dogs, racoons possums, etc... if you do happen to encounter something of this size... run it over...... don't brake, swerve or slow... just run over small critters. make sure your motorcycle is straight up and down, and you are centered over it and just run it over.... My wife learned this lesson the hard way in some twisties she swerved to avoid a stinking squrriel and almost ran off the side of the road and down an embankments.... she listens to me more now about things having to do with riding..... True story, even the listening part!!!!

Lastly, trust your own instincts..... if you have been driving a car at night you know what the night time environment can be like. that environment is the same no matter what you are driving or riding, so ride in your comfort zone.

 

[jimichanga]

lane* yikes. and to adjust the headlights do i have to take off the cowl?

 

[Abyss]

Riding at night is the best, the cold air is denser and makes your bike get a higher compression ratio.

I love getting off work and zooming around, it's like riding a completely different (and more powerful) bike.

 

[jimichanga]

All good advice.

There are actually organized night rides. Maybe start with one of those. Safety in numbers, you know.

Critters were mentioned - nobody mentioned that Deer are friggin Zombies! And they come out just before the sun goes down. Maybe they are more akin to vampires lol.

And, seriously, avoid AT ALL COSTS riding at twilight / dusk. It is the darkest time of day. Shadows are blackest, lights blaze brightest, and critters stir the most.

yeah, a group night ride sounds like exactly what i'm looking for. i'm gonna go comb through that section and see what's offered. thanks

 

[jimichanga]

Riding at night is the best, the cold air is denser and makes your bike get a higher compression ratio.

I love getting off work and zooming around, it's like riding a completely different (and more powerful) bike.

yeah it seems great! and i put these cute pink tire lights on that are only getting time to shine when i'm in tunnels this goddamn Kavinsky song makes me wanna get out at night and just cruise haha

 

[MCSFTGUY]

great stuff guys, thanks! one question - in the MSF course, the coach told us that riding in the left labe was best on the freeway, is this true at night also?

Don't get stuck on this is better than that or one thing is better to do than another. Let the roadway environment, traffic conditions and what is going on around you when you are riding tell you where to be.

Example.... two lanes in your direction of travel and a center divider seperating your lanes from the other direction of travel. Sprinklers in the center divider are on and the #1 or center lane is wet or has water running down the lane in spots.... I would probably ride in #2 lane to avoid the water, unless there was something about the #2 lane in this environment that I didn't like.

Two lanes again, only this time there are cars parked along the curb, I would tend to move to the #1 lane to give me the most time and space to see critters that might be out at night and under cars.

Research paper out of University of Oregon and a research paper published in TRR by Muttart, Guderian, et al.... the two papers looked at where riders look and by chance one group looked at new riders while the other had more experienced riders. Looking at the two papers, new riders tend to look down closer to the motorcycle where experience riders look up and down the road.... so... for night time riding, well for all riding but in particular at night, one of the best things you can do it to get your eyes up and look to see what is out in front of you.... Don't try to follow the arbitrary guidelines of 2-4-12 seconds ahead that MSF recommends.... let the environment you are riding in at the time tell you how far you can look ahead... just get your eyes up and look ahead to what is comfortable to your riding conditions....

Yes, yes I know I am going to take heat about the MSF stuff...... but go out and find the research that MSF used to set these distances and then come back and give me heat... in the mean time google search "6 seconds gap acceptance" and see what that tells you.

 

[pt65]

Where to look

Its not about looking down the road or just in front of you.

Try to see everything in your field of vision, while keeping your eyes scanning. Its a trick that can turn into a habit by sheer "practice". And the practice consists of simply being aware / paying attention...NOT daydreaming.

When I'm riding in town / traffic / rush hour, and especially at intersection / stops, I feel like a friggin Cylon robot - eyes constantly scanning, left right, ahead, mirrors, left right ahead mirrors leftrightaheadmirrors. You get the idea.

When I'm riding through woods / shrubs, I "split" my attention between whats ahead of me, the road surface and the tree / shrub line to the left and right of the road just in "critter hitting" distance ahead of me.

These are just 2 more examples of "adjusting to conditions".

Night rides are also posted at grouprides.net. There is a calendar where lots of rides are listed, so you can plan.

 

[kiltwearinfool]

I have found that the best night of the week to ride in my neighborhood is Wednesday. Fewer drunks and people pissed off about work.

Drill it into your head that you are more invisible at night than you are during the day. Stay where cars can see you, not in a blind spot.

Smaller group rides with people you have ridden with before (during the daytime) are recommended. Like the saying "too many cooks spoil the soup", too many kooks on bikes spoil the ride.

Start with smaller, short rides. Don't plan an hours-long trek to the dark side for your first ride.

Ride streets you are familiar with. It will help if you know where the road goes and what to look out for. That said, don't be complacent and think "I know what dangers lurk out there" as soon as you do, you'll get a surprise.

Lane sharing at night time should be avoided. Lane filtering should be done with care.

Be extra cautious when approaching oncoming left hand turn lanes. Cars think you are a car with a broken headlight. It is also more difficult for them to judge your speed and distance because of the single light source (even if there are two on your bike). They may turn left in front of you.

Get a hi-vis "dork vest" or other reflective gear. This will help with being seen from the rear. Supplemental lights like ST Guy recommended (mounted on your fork legs) can be beneficial during the daytime as well.

There's a huge debate over using the high beam all the time at night. I don't do it because I find it annoying when I'm coming the other way - even when I'm on the bike. Plus I look forward to getting home to my wife's high beams.

 

[Abyss]

yeah it seems great! and i put these cute pink tire lights on that are only getting time to shine when i'm in tunnels this goddamn Kavinsky song makes me wanna get out at night and just cruise haha

Then put on Nightcall and go show off those pink tire lights

 

[sanjuro]

I find target fixation to be a big problem at night.

Instead of 100 feet from the guard rail, now a darkened area is just 20 feet away. That same guard rail is still 100 feet, but now that you are staring at the dark spot, you shift over and now the rail is only 50 feet away.

 

[sanjuro]

FYI, I look much cooler at night