84 Honda CB700SC Nighthawk S still problem after numerous "fixes" at mc repair shops

[tranquilride]

This is becoming twistedly comic or comicly twisted, this friggin motorcycle and money shelled out to repair shops to fix them to no real good.

Long story short, Ive posted on another thread longer version, I bought an old 1984 Honda CB700SC Nighthawk S a few months back from a dealer on consignment sale.
The dealer said the bike was in excellent mechanical condition. Bike seemed to run fine on the test ride the owner after the seller set it up for me to test ride.
So I bought it gratefully, anticipating with enjoyment finally having a bike which could serve me well as a reliable commuter and for some trips.
Within one day and night after buying it, I parked it for a few hours and it would not start when i came back to it. Towed to a shop, where owner looked over it, charged me money for tow and inspection, but did not do anything really other than said it looked fine and i probably left brake light on, though i am still sure I did not.

Basically it did same thing again very soon after, towed again. More money. No fix.
So I installed new battery, new spark plugs, new headlight, spark plug wires, changed oil myself hoping at least they would be useful.

Then took it to another motorcycle shop upon suggestions, after bike would sometime start with a bit of challenge, but then if i stopped it for gas, etc it would often not start again.
The shop called me back same day, to say it was fixed. Broken ignition coil
And for less than expected, financially. Yeah.
But alas, I discover bike still having same problems of very tempermental starting, and not starting again once stopped.
So when i have a bit more money i bring it in again. Leave it for a little over a week for troubleshooting, diagnosis & repair.
Call back saying its fixed again with installation of new starter motor, and a new rear tire was put on as i requested as well.
Yeah. I have no money left now, but its okay as its fixed, and with reliable motorcycle transport I will be saving some cash with it as transport instead of the truck.
So i come out today to enjoy my bikes reliable riding for the first time since i bought it. Ride over the bridge into SF for a few things, havent gone more than 10 miles or so when something feels off. Oil light comes on, then off.
Then suddenly the left clutch lever feels like there is no resistance to it. Bike starts running weird, it slips into neutral and takes multiple hard shifts to bring it into 2nd as Im coming off the bridge in heavy traffic. Finally get it into 2nd and thinking it was just a weird anomoly as it was just looked over and repaired yesterday, I continue riding but am feeling like maybe i should head home in case. Then suddenly the left clutch lever has no resistance. Not shifting out of first while riding but suddenly lurches and instantly dies in the street.
I was able to restart it right away, and try to get home but it does this a couple more times and I cant get past first gear. So eventually i was able to pull into a parking lot, and called the owner of the shop i just got it back from again. Called him a few times to let him know what was happening, and for suggestions on it there might be some fix, if temporary to at least get it home or back to his shop? He was empathetic and helpful with suggestions, though past closing time for him.
Hes been very congenial to deal with, and I was thinking great he was able to fix the issues with the bike. At this point, Im feeling a bit frustrated honestly. I dont make boatloads of money at all, pretty little actually trying to get my own very small ( 1 person, me ) business up and viable. End up having bike towed for 3rd time in a few months, back to his shop with money that was meant for space i was in process of renting. Nothing left now, financially. Some people probably dont know what that is like, assume people are lazy or whatever if we dont always have excess money laying around. But some of us work diligently, honorably but do not have such financial abundance to keep spending on fixes that dont really fix, and apparently create or at least overlook potentially life threatening problems.

Mechanic suggested taking off the resevoir for the clutch at left handlebar and filling with brake fluid as temp fix if possible to at least help get the bike back to the shop or home. The right box, brake fluid resevoir is easy to remove but fuxitall, this left one is essentially affixed together, screws seem to be made of tinfoil as they instantly started stripping so i stopped before totally destroying them. Unable to get it open.

I noticed there is a lot of fluid covering the bottom of the bike, but was told that may just be normal fluid residue from use. Or sitting around.

Guess this wasnt so short. Im really frustrated, out of money to keep pouring into this believing its been fixed & finally actually rideable when it immediately shows numerous times it has not been. Now i owe even more money on top of repairs earlier this week that maxed me out financially, for the tow from it breaking down the very next day!

And I dont know what the hcek to do with it. It was towed to the same mechanics shop by a friend of his who does towing. But though hes nice, this really affected my trust in his competence. I tend to want to believe the best of people, and he seems like a good person. But I was almost run over twice due to the motorcycles sudden failure tonight. And paid more money for tow because of it, i cant afford.

Any suggestions as to mechancially what the heck might be going on with this thing?
I dont want to part with it in a way as these bikes are supposedly very good quality motorcycles, even for its age. And it has under 20,000 miles on it. I really like it power, handling and style wise - aside from the major mechanical problems of course. But Im not willing to keep pouring money and time into a motorcycle that Ive yet to reliably ride.

What can cause sudden loss of the clutch like this? It is not something that I have experienced before with this motorcycle.

 

[bb sue]

I'm gonna do some cut and paste here, 'cuz it's the only way I can address what seems to me like a blown (or blowing) motor along with a bad clutch.

... I bought an old 1984 Honda CB700SC Nighthawk S a few months back from a dealer on consignment sale.
The dealer said the bike was in excellent mechanical condition. Bike seemed to run fine on the test ride the owner after the seller set it up for me to test ride.
So I bought it gratefully, anticipating with enjoyment finally having a bike which could serve me well as a reliable commuter and for some trips.

Never trust a dealer. I'll make you a deal, this runs like my aunt Ethyl's gazelle... purrs like a kitten, roars like a lyin', er, lion, never one lick of trouble...

RULE #1 : ALWAYS look a bike over B4 you buy it. If you see oil under it or places unusually clean, it's a warning sign. If you're not a bike wrench, take one with you.

Within one day and night after buying it, I parked it for a few hours and it would not start when i came back to it. Towed to a shop, where owner looked over it, charged me money for tow and inspection, but did not do anything really other than said it looked fine and i probably left brake light on, though i am still sure I did not.

How do you leave a brake light on? Cross this shop off the list. You don't have to be standing in the cow pasture to smell the BS there...

Basically it did same thing again very soon after, towed again. More money. No fix. So I installed new battery, new spark plugs, new headlight, spark plug wires, changed oil myself hoping at least they would be useful.

Well, yeah, because the bike was broken and the person who didn't fix the bike before didn't fix it. Notice I didn't use the term Mechanic, as he weren't one. At least you started throwing parts (yourself) in the right direction. SO you know you have a good bat (may help) and tune up parts (not helpful in this case but who knows)... Sounds like the battery was gone, as this straightened it up there. But it didn't end...

Then took it to another motorcycle shop upon suggestions, after bike would sometime start with a bit of challenge, but then if i stopped it for gas, etc it would often not start again.

Coil shot too? Or bad points? Or compression or valves or carburetion or... OK...

The shop called me back same day, to say it was fixed. Broken ignition coil
And for less than expected, financially. Yeah.

Yep, it happens. So new bat, new coil. WHy do I suspect it endeth not here...

But alas, I discover bike still having same problems of very tempermental starting, and not starting again once stopped.

So it WASN'T the coil. Scratch mechanic 2 off the list for throwing parts, but not the right ones.

So when i have a bit more money i bring it in again.

To the same guy? Trusting sort, aren't you!

Leave it for a little over a week for troubleshooting, diagnosis & repair.
Call back saying its fixed again with installation of new starter motor, and a new rear tire was put on as i requested as well.

If the bike's not FIRING, it's not a starter. In a bit I'll explain what happened. Betcha your starter was OK. But you went to the same guy who DIDN'T fix the bike...

Yeah. I have no money left now, but its okay as its fixed, and with reliable motorcycle transport I will be saving some cash with it as transport instead of the truck.

Time passes... note the bike has not been ridden 100 miles... :|

So i come out today to enjoy my bikes reliable riding for the first time since i bought it. Ride over the bridge into SF for a few things, havent gone more than 10 miles or so when something feels off. Oil light comes on, then off.

Remember I said you didn't need the starter? Maybe because your motor was starting to sieze and it was making the starter try to scrape parts together... Oil light on and off when running is a BAD thing. Bad bad bad...

Then suddenly the left clutch lever feels like there is no resistance to it. Bike starts running weird, it slips into neutral and takes multiple hard shifts to bring it into 2nd as Im coming off the bridge in heavy traffic.

Because your engine is going out of spec and tolerances and nothing is lining up and barely keeping itself running...

Finally get it into 2nd and thinking it was just a weird anomoly as it was just looked over and repaired yesterday,

(note - it wasn't.)

I continue riding but am feeling like maybe i should head home in case. Then suddenly the left clutch lever has no resistance. Not shifting out of first while riding but suddenly lurches and instantly dies in the street.

I was able to restart it right away, and try to get home but it does this a couple more times and I cant get past first gear.

You're lucky it started. Someone was looking over your shoulder.

So eventually i was able to pull into a parking lot, and called the owner of the shop i just got it back from again. Called him a few times to let him know what was happening, and for suggestions on it there might be some fix, if temporary to at least get it home or back to his shop? He was empathetic and helpful with suggestions, though past closing time for him.

Yeah, tow it, don't ride it, get it to the sho where we'll jerk the motor and see where it's coming apart... At least he hung in there, too bad it was still broken...

Hes been very congenial to deal with, and I was thinking great he was able to fix the issues with the bike.

I worked for someone like that 20 years ago, nicest guy in the world, too bad his motors lasted 100 miles... But he was awfully nice...

At this point, Im feeling a bit frustrated honestly. I dont make boatloads of money at all, pretty little actually trying to get my own very small ( 1 person, me ) business up and viable. End up having bike towed for 3rd time in a few months, back to his shop with money that was meant for space i was in process of renting.

And you expect what?

Nothing left now, financially. Some people probably dont know what that is like, assume people are lazy or whatever if we dont always have excess money laying around. But some of us work diligently, honorably but do not have such financial abundance to keep spending on fixes that dont really fix, and apparently create or at least overlook potentially life threatening problems.

Ya know, maybe the problem was elusive, but if he didn't catch the original prob on diagnosis or the test ride then WTF???

Mechanic suggested taking off the resevoir for the clutch at left handlebar and filling with brake fluid as temp fix if possible to at least help get the bike back to the shop or home. The right box, brake fluid resevoir is easy to remove but fuxitall, this left one is essentially affixed together, screws seem to be made of tinfoil as they instantly started stripping so i stopped before totally destroying them. Unable to get it open.

I recommend towing the bike to a good shop that knows these bikes, and not f***ing around any more.

I noticed there is a lot of fluid covering the bottom of the bike, but was told that may just be normal fluid residue from use. Or sitting around.

By who?? The mechanic? on a HONDA??? Dude... maybe on a harley or an old POS or a VW, but on a Honda?

Guess this wasnt so short. Im really frustrated, out of money to keep pouring into this believing its been fixed & finally actually rideable when it immediately shows numerous times it has not been. Now i owe even more money on top of repairs earlier this week that maxed me out financially, for the tow from it breaking down the very next day!

And it's still not fixed.

And I dont know what the hcek to do with it. It was towed to the same mechanics shop by a friend of his who does towing. But though hes nice, this really affected my trust in his competence.

No doubt!

I tend to want to believe the best of people, and he seems like a good person. But I was almost run over twice due to the motorcycles sudden failure tonight. And paid more money for tow because of it, i cant afford.

Bet he'll "fix" it again. You gonna let him?

Any suggestions as to mechancially what the heck might be going on with this thing?
I dont want to part with it in a way as these bikes are supposedly very good quality motorcycles, even for its age. And it has under 20,000 miles on it. I really like it power, handling and style wise - aside from the major mechanical problems of course. But Im not willing to keep pouring money and time into a motorcycle that Ive yet to reliably ride.

What can cause sudden loss of the clutch like this? It is not something that I have experienced before with this motorcycle.

OK. My semi-professional diagnosis on this mess, NOT having looked at the bike.

You had major electrical issues right off the bat which spelled some kind of problem. Following that line, with what happened later, I bet your timing may be off (bad hall unit, bad points, wobbly crankshaft, whatever) which can cause your motor to go south. Considering the appaling condition this bike was in when you got it, It sounds like a shadetree mechanic was futzing with it, busted stuff, f'd up the valves and timing and who knows what else, then had his bud patch it to sell it to some sucker. Sorry, but seen it before. But that's kinda moot point. You now have a cooked motor. That much I can guarantee, while I don't know to what extent, this is not gonna be a cheap or easy fix, hon.

If I were you, I'd (1) find a good mechanic. NOT one of these Friend of the tow guy mechanics, but someone who other bikers on running good bikes can vouch for. Talk to people in your area who have had experience with a wrench and can vouch for how good he is, ask the amazing people here to PM you recommendations on who and what they do, you know...

(2) call Cycle Salvage and find out how much a new used motor for your baby is. Best to find that out now.

(3) Have yon TRSTWORTHY wrench (i.e.NOT the ones you've gone to, OK?) do a real estimate on your f***ed up bike (and tell them EVERYTHING that happened), to see if it can be brought back to life for less than the motor, and when you get the money together have the motor and clutch repaired OR swapped out.

(4) Save your pennies, and when you can, either get the replacement motor or have the wrench fix yours.

Short of that, and I hate sayng this, sell the bike as salvage, lick your wounds, and next time, check the next bike carefully (take your new found mechanic bud with you, pay him if necessary), both before you buy, and if it's worked on, immediately after (and not a shop bay to roll up door test ride, either).

I am so so so sorry you got burned. This sucks big ugly nasty hair-covered stone shaped dustball lemons. ANd there's not much more I can say than good luck, hon!

bb

 

[afm199]

Honestly, just stop throwing good money after bad and buy a newer bike.

 

[RcrBoy]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That was long............

My Brother had one of these and loved it. We took a 5813 mile road trip through 10 states back in 1988. I was on my KZ900, brother in law on a ZL900 Eliminator, and my brother on his Nighthawk.

Reading your post brings back memories of his bike on that trip.

The hydraulic clutch was prone to acting up when the engine got hot as in stop and go traffic to the point of not shifting at all. Let it cool down and it would work normally again.

Hot soak restarts were also a hassle.............

And it would sometimes vapor lock on long, high speed runs down deserted New Mexico highways


If you're fed up with it and it is a Red/Black model my brother might take it off your hands...........


Mark

 

[GhostRider]

I'm sorry to not be of any constructive help here - but - you just learned a valuable lesson:

as stated above: DON'T TRUST ANYONE who is SELLING you something. anything. anyone.

and secondly: DON'T (never, ever) BUY a bike that's more than 10 yrs old, unless you're ready (and able) to wrench on it yourself.


As someone at a shop once told me: There is NO bike cheaper than $3500. period.
The ones on CL selling for less than that, you can be sure that the difference in price has to be made up in "initial service", fixes and parts.

I have bought MANY, MANY used bikes. I won the "lottery" ONCE. i got a $1000 (dirt) bike, and beat my odds.... for only another $100 i had a perfectly running bike - but - that was only because i had a welder to straighten up some bent brake/shift levers.

So - what's my advice to you.....

...... basically.... be prepared to learn a next lesson, which will also help you with your business in the long run.

look up "SUNK COST": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost

in this case: cut your losses!
unless you have a friend, who you can make work for "free" on the bike - you're screwed.

any "real" mechanic, like Alan, will not touch your bike.
not because they're mean - but - because they know that the equation makes no sense:

(value before service) + (cost of service) < (value of bike after service)

or, in plain english: to get this problem diagnosed, and fixed by a competent mechanic costs you WAY more than what the bike is worth in the first place.


well - what are your options?

I would recommend - bring it to a cheap shop, have them patch it up with duct tape, and then let them sell it on consignment.
Hey - it worked the first time, didn't it??

then take the money - save up the difference to $3500, and get yourself a recent, decent bike.

with a bike that's newer, 1) the chances of a catastropic failure are much smaller, and 2) fixing it is easier since there is still people alive and walking among us who know the technology of the bikes. (e.g. your nighthawk has hydraulic valves. i CHALLENGE you to find a shop who knows how to replace them, and HAS STILL ALL THE special TOOLS needed for this job)


so - sorry to bring you down, but PLEASE C U T Y O U R L O S S E S now!



(btw: i made the same mistake, and i ended up GIVING AWAY (as in FREE) two 1984 650 Nighthawks to a "shade tree mechanic" with unlimited time as a project bike.... and HE couldnt even fix it up cost efficiently....)

 

[afm199]

I more or less agree with the above post, though you can pick up a decent used SV650 or GS500 for less than $3k.

 

[mototireguy]

You seem like a nice, well spoken guy but as much as we would like to help we can't diagnose or fix your mysterious chronic bike problems over the internet, sorry.

Alas maybe now is the time to finally stop throwing good money after bad and kiss this problematic bike goodbye? Maybe donate it to some Harley biker rally where they still do the 100ft Honda drop from a crane?

Chalk this bike up to lesson learned and move on already.

 

[RcrBoy]

I'll give you 50 bucks................




Mark

 

[tranquilride]

Thank you everyone for your replies.

Im too tired about it all to do much of a reply, other than the mechanic ive taken it to the last couple of times was actually recommended on here forum by some other BARFers as being one of the few SF Bay area mechanics who can & will still work on these older Honda bikes.

He said last night he was going to look over it again if i brought it back to him, at no charge.
Well, yeah, of course! Im hoping he will at least pay me the $125 i had to shell out to his friend to tow it again because of his unfixed "fixes". But not really expecting it will happen.

Really sad to have to get rid of this bike too. Havent had over $1600 at one time for a newer bike, so maybe I will not be riding after all for some time?

Oh, and the brake light being left on possibility mentioned, I was told was from possibly turning the key in ignition too far to the left when turning it off and leaving it. Thus leaving a light on, but Im pretty sure I never did that.
Mute point now, other than being aware of not doing so in future.

For the hell of it, I will hear what the mechanic has to say about the bike and if by some good grace he really does manage to fix it right this time without charging me more money, Ill keep it.
If not, deadhorse Ill try selling it to someone interested in working on it. But not sure what I can get for a bike in this condition? Damn place i bought it at wouldnt take it back when i called them the first day after buying it when problems started showing up. Consignment reason they said.


Thanks for all your help & suggestions.

 

[GhostRider]

He said last night he was going to look over it again if i brought it back to him, at no charge.
Well, yeah, of course! Im hoping he will at least pay me the $125 i had to shell out to his friend to tow it again because of his unfixed "fixes". But not really expecting it will happen.

Please don't "blame" the mechanic, and don't be upset if he doesn't refund your money.

You have to understand - issues on old bikes are SUPER hard to trace.
There may be multiple intermittent failures.
Each one of them may be easy to find - but the combination of both makes it impossible.

e.g. if your Valve Timing is off - it may work for a while, until your spark coil goes too, then both fail - and no matter what you fix, the other will still act up.
Oh, and once you fix the coils, now the engine will run hot and seize.

endless opportunities of failures.....
.... it can be as easy as a rattled loose ground screw at the rectifier, all the way to a blocked oil passage in your valve train.


Bikes that age, and with an uncertain maintenance record - are a nightmare to work on.
It's not the fault of the mechanic, but he got bills to pay too, and - he has a choice of working on your bike for free - or helping a squid put frame sliders on a 2008 bike, charging top $$.

Maybe - with some time on your hand - you might be able to fix the problem yourself.

Have you considered getting a "factory service manual", and just "bringing the bike back to spec"?
It's a tedious process, pretty much a complete tear-down, but - you'd learn A LOT!
You'd still spend $$$ on parts - but - at least your time is "free"

 

[bb sue]

You have to understand - issues on old bikes are SUPER hard to trace.
There may be multiple intermittent failures.
Each one of them may be easy to find - but the combination of both makes it impossible.

e.g. if your Valve Timing is off - it may work for a while, until your spark coil goes too, then both fail - and no matter what you fix, the other will still act up.
Oh, and once you fix the coils, now the engine will run hot and seize.

endless opportunities of failures.....
.... it can be as easy as a rattled loose ground screw at the rectifier, all the way to a blocked oil passage in your valve train.

Bikes that age, and with an uncertain maintenance record - are a nightmare to work on. It's not the fault of the mechanic, but he got bills to pay too, and - he has a choice of working on your bike for free - or helping a squid put frame sliders on a 2008 bike, charging top $$.

Maybe - with some time on your hand - you might be able to fix the problem yourself. Have you considered getting a "factory service manual", and just "bringing the bike back to spec"?
It's a tedious process, pretty much a complete tear-down, but - you'd learn A LOT! You'd still spend $$$ on parts - but - at least your time is "free"

Wow, what an EXCELLENT post!! +rep for you!!

It's why I *like* working on older bikes - it's a detective story to get them right!

bb

 

[Sidewalk]

Have you considered public transportation? I started commuting by bicycle and train (pedal 20-26 miles per day) when my Nighthawk started acting up in November.

Sounds like you may have a failed clutch slave cylinder. That may be where the leaky fluids and low oil pressure light is coming from (maybe).

I agree with the general consensus; anything this old and/or cheap is a project.

 

[tranquilride]

The mechanic whose shop I had the tow driver take the bike back to and left in ( the tow driver apparently is good friends with him and rents part of space in his shop) just called me.

Said the clutch fluid was filled with "gunk". He refilled it, put new brake fluid in, added some more oil as there was apparently about a quart of oil low then took it for a "long test ride" with no problems. Said it was working fine when he looked at it this morning :| and now. And its ready to come pick up again.

I mentioned the possibility mentioned here of points or timing, and he said it could not be that on this bike.

After picking it up today or tomorrow, will let you know what happens.

 

[Sidewalk]

Stop!

Low on oil and the mechanic didn't catch it before? That is on of my first checks!

 

[bb sue]

Stop!

Low on oil and the mechanic didn't catch it before? That is on of my first checks!

Hmmm.... I remember saying something... up somewhere... on some post...

Originally Posted by ocean
Nothing left now, financially. Some people probably dont know what that is like, assume people are lazy or whatever if we dont always have excess money laying around. But some of us work diligently, honorably but do not have such financial abundance to keep spending on fixes that dont really fix, and apparently create or at least overlook potentially life threatening problems.

Replied to by bb sue
Ya know, maybe the problem was elusive, but if he didn't catch the original prob on diagnosis or the test ride then WTF???

Why didn't he look in the clutch res in the beginning? How did he miss a quart of oil? If a swallow is flying perpendicular to the Thames, into a 15 MPH sidewind from the NNE...

Before I took it out of the shop, I would be ALL OVER that bike with a fine tooth comb. I would listen to that motor like I were a heart surgeon. I would check things you wouldn't think of checking.

Sorry, but this wrench is already kind of a -1 rep in my book. JMO...

 

[bb sue]

Stop!

Low on oil and the mechanic didn't catch it before? That is on of my first checks!

Hmmm.... I remember saying something... up somewhere... on some post...

Originally Posted by ocean
Nothing left now, financially. Some people probably dont know what that is like, assume people are lazy or whatever if we dont always have excess money laying around. But some of us work diligently, honorably but do not have such financial abundance to keep spending on fixes that dont really fix, and apparently create or at least overlook potentially life threatening problems.

Replied to by bb sue
Ya know, maybe the problem was elusive, but if he didn't catch the original prob on diagnosis or the test ride then WTF???

(Sorry, it's that John Stewart Influence!)

Why didn't he look in the clutch res in the beginning? How did he miss a quart of oil? If a swallow is flying perpendicular to the Thames, into a 15 MPH sidewind from the NNE...

Before I took it out of the shop, I would be ALL OVER that bike with a fine tooth comb. I would listen to that motor like I were a heart surgeon. I would check things you wouldn't think of checking.

Sorry, but this wrench is ruight now kind of a -1 rep in my book. JMO... If he DID finally fix it, bully for him, and that's kewl. I sure hope he did. But by God, if it were me turning the wrench, I would be going through every possible inch I could think of on that biike to make sure it was right B4 I turned it over to the owner - long ride or not.

BTW, what constitutes a "long ride"? Around the block? Around town to the bank and back? The 580/24/13 triangle? Napa (or SF) and back? Sacto and back? Just wondering...

bb

 

[ST Guy]

Bummer that you're having so much trouble with the bike. As a bike gets older, it needs more maintainence more frequently. If it's been neglected and not properly maintained by the previous owner, it takes even more work to get it right. And if the previous owner has made modifications and "improvements" to the bike, then it gets even worse as the vast majority of shade tree mechanics out there don't know what the heck they are doing. So you end up with an even more "buggered up" bike.

At this point the smartest thing to do might be to either sell it for what you can get or keep it, pull the battery out and put it on a smart charger, and start going through the bike yourself. Overhauling the carbs, checking the charging system systematically, etc. But unless you are absolutely sure you have the time and the skill and the tools to do this, get rid of it and chaulk it up to experience.

Sorry your experience sucks.

 

[Stormdragon]

Why didn't he look in the clutch res in the beginning? How did he miss a quart of oil? If a swallow is flying perpendicular to the Thames, into a 15 MPH sidewind from the NNE...

Because it's an African sparrow! If it was an English sparrow....

 

[tranquilride]

update

Today I went and picked up my motorcycle from the mechanic at his shop.
He said he put new brake fluid in the clutch resevoir since it was "gunked", and added a quart of oil since I mentioned the light had come on.

I asked him if he had checked the oil the previous two visits over last month I had the bike at his shop, as he said it was a quart low on oil. Good to know if its burning oil, or if it was not filled all the way all along which may have been the case as it was way too full when i first bought it and some was drained off when I checked it a couple months ago. I thought I had refilled it to level but may not have myself.
He said he was not sure if he did, if he did he overlooked it being low. And said it was not his responsability anyway to check the oil or brake fluid as the issue I brought the bike if for was difficulty starting and its dying after starting.

When I called him the night after I got the bike back from his shop previous time when the bikes clutch went and it died in the road on me multiple times standing me in SF, he said to have his tow friend bring my bike back to his shop and he would look over the bike again at no charge given that it did this right after leaving his shop.
But when I got there today, he said I owe him another $40 for doing the clutch fluid & oil, even though he told me he wouldnt be charging me and did not call me before hand to confirm if im okay with him changing his decision to charge me for what he did!

On top of having to pay the $120 and the expenses of previous work he just did,plus expenses from two different people doing hit and run on my truck within past month and insurance not covering it ( because I have no one to hold the claim against since they dont have proof of who it was ) I had no money left and told him so the day I picked the bike up last time and when his tow friend picked me up. So at the least I feel it would have been alot cleaner and straight up to have called me before hand to confirm. After back and forth and reminding him a few times that he told me to bring the bike back to him and he would not charge me and did not contact me before deciding to do something he chose to charge me for to ask if i could do it now, he reluctantly agreed to just call it off and not charge me though he didnt feel it was fair to him. I said I'd pay him anyway as soon as I have more money again, since he did do a service.

Im not sure how i feel about taking anything back to him now. I do feel he is a good person, and I just took the bike out for about 150 mile ride this afternoon with no problems. Starts up quite well now, and clutch worked fine. So he has done good work overall.

While I understand and in some ways agree with his statment about it not being my responsability, not his, to make sure my bike is in good running condition and that fluids are at needed levels and health, it seems to me that as a mechanic that people are taking their bikes to and paying in money & trust it would be both basic, good workmanship as well as respect for the fact that people are putting their lives in ones hands in many ways to at least take all of 5 or 10 minutes to do a simple fluid check just to be on the safe side.
Even if its a seasoned riders bike, rather than a newbie like myself, anomolies can happen which make it worthwhile to check the very basic lifeblood fluids as par for the course in even a situation where the issue is a non or difficulty starting bike.?
Does this seem ridiculous or expecting too much in others opinions?
Certainly I would not expect that somewhere i take a bike start going through the brake pads, shocks, carberator or other more involved systems when a customer is on a limited budget and has a specific issue like mine on an old bike. But a quick oil & clutch fluid check seems like a quick & reasonable thing to be on the safe side as par for the course so to speak.?

Kind of like taking vital signs in a hospital. When people come into a hospital for any reason obvious or mysterious, vital signs are always taken no matter what. Checking blood / fluid pressure, temp, pulse, resp, 02. Because such fluid is essential to health of so many other systems its a given to check them at no extra charge. Though hospital stays are notoriously expensive overall, unlike most other services in a hospital which are charged by service, such basic system checks are not charged for in any hospital I've been in or worked for.
I can understand his situation as well, that older bikes like this are more challenging to diagnose and repair given their age.

Nonetheless, the bike does seem to be running well now.
Will see how long it continues. Positive affirmating here.
I'm reading over the official honda shop manual for this bike, to become more familiar with what I can feel comfortable doing myself. Not ready for carbs on my own yet, but there are certainly many simpler maintenance I can do myself when I have the time & money for tools and parts.

Thanks all for the suggestions & input.
Oh yes, the mechanic mentioned something Ive heard at least a few times before, a strong suggestion to get a Ninja 250 instead.
To the point that he said he was considering refusing to work on my bike anymore unless its one of the ninjas. Easy to find parts, newer bike and some other reasons.
He said he feels I should be able to do a straight trade for one in good condition for this bike, as he seems to feel still its a solid, good bike.
They are attractive the ninjas. Not sure I would want the decline in power in a 250 though?
As I've grown quite used to and fond of the nimbleness and safety of being able to quickly get out of less attentive cagers this bike affords.

Im friggin persistant, maybe to a detriment sometimes. Sometimes to a benefit. But am going to keep this bike unless something major breaksdown with it again. Will explore more of the manual and do what I feel comfortable or safely competent in terms of maintenance with it.

And in a few months perhaps when I have saved up more money, maybe Ill buy a used ninja as well as a 2nd bike, if I can find a good one under $2000? Seem reasonable to be able to find one in that price range in good condition?
If one needs some work I will still be able to ride while working & learning on the other.

Ive included a pic from today of the motorcycle, when i rode it out to an acquintances home in petaluma area.

 

[afm199]

You need to dump that bike while it is running. If the brake (or clutch) fluid was "gunked up" you can bet there is corrossion in the master cylinder and slave cylinder or calipers. You can bet that replacing "gunked" fluid without thoroughly bleeding the lines is a waste of time.

Stop throwing money away. Next bike get a GOOD mech to look at it, not the nitwit you are using. And remember that the bike may "run good" now and have problems in two weeks. It is over twenty years old. Everything that moves or has a seal is suspicious, including the swingarm bearings or bushes, the head bearings, wheel bearings, cam chains, valves, the list is ENDLESS



What Ninja? Do yourself a favor and buy a bike newer than 2000. I suggest an SV650