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Tire pressure - confused - websites say low front high rear - riders do the opposite

canyonrat

canyonrat

Veteran Knee Dragger
Joined
Aug 9, 2002
Location
Santa Rosa, California
Moto(s)
2014 Aprilia RSV4-RR
Name
Mark
I was reviewing the BARF board over tire pressure. There are all sorts of variables. The weather temp. Style of riding. Weight. Suspension settings. Etc.

This link discusses lower pressure on rear than front: http://www.bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100361

This link discusses weight and pressure ranges: http://www.bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=317950


In conclusion, for the street, I find that the rear tire should have less pressure than the front for normal street riding. For track riding, it is recommended by some to have less pressure in the front. I will theorize that (what ever it is called) “canyon” or “sport” or “hypersport” or “spirited” street riding style, is likely in between street and track and that both tires should probably be equally pressured. As for the exact pressure…32 to 36 pounds seems about correct.

Remember, the lower the pressure the more vague the handling and slower to turn the bike will be.

May the force be with you and the police force be far behind you.


Supporting data:

This sites shows higher pressure on the rear than the front for almost all bikes: http://www.drivegreen.com/Motorcycle_Tire_Pressure.htm

Sport Rider Magazine says no track pressure on the street and stick with tire manufacturers recommendation for the street: http://www.sportrider.com/tech/tires/146_0206_motorcycle_tire_pressure/index.html

This site recommends tire manufacture recommendations on the street: http://www.motorcycleanchor.com/Katana/kat_tires.html




Bridgestone recommends not exceeding max tire pressure:
http://www.motorcycle-karttires.com/tires.aspx?LookupID=1

Dunlop low front higher rear pressure:
http://www.dunlopmotorcycle.com/fitmentguide.asp
http://www.dunlopmotorcycle.com/infocenter_tirecharts.asp

Michelin recommends bike manufacturers pressure recommendations:
http://www.michelinmotorcycle.com/pubs/brochure2011.pdf
http://www.michelinmotorcycle.com/index.cfm?event=tirecatalog.view

Metzler low front higher rear pressure:
http://www.us.metzelermoto.com/web/default.page

Pirrelli says use bike manufactures pressure recommendations (as a low) on the street but not to exceed their recommended max pressure rating. They recommend different pressures for the track:
http://www.us.pirelli.com/web/motorcycle/tyres/tyres-technology/tyres-care/Tyre_Pressure.page


NOV 20, 2011 UPDATE:
http://moteroweb.eresmas.com/racetirepressures.htm


This sight just shows some basic "tire 101" terminology:
http://www.maxxis.com/MotorcycleATV/Motorcycle-Tire-School.aspx#motorcycle_speed_ratings
 
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I pretty much go with the factory recommended pressures as I don't track any of my bikes.

They're all over the map, as you can see.

Here are the factory pressures:

BMW F800ST: 36.3/40.6 (as you can see the Germans are a bit anal!)

Suzuki TL1000S: 36/36

Suzuki DRZ400SM: 25/29

The only bike that seems particularly sensitive to pressures is the TL1000S where a lower rear pressure seems to make the rear tire a bit "squirrely" in fast tight turns.
 
Street pressure take into account tire wear, and potholes that bend rims, as well as two up riding.

If you put in 45 psi, the bike will turn VERY easily (it just won't have much traction). That is not handling. It's not hard at all to turn a bike with 24 psi rear cold and 30 psi front cold on the track. The reason pressures are lower there is mostly to improve traction with a bigger footprint. Tire wear is not important on the track.
 
I can't think of a single street bike that recommends a lower pressure in the rear. And unless I'm mistaken, most bikes on the track are set up similarly, though I'm sure there are exceptions.
 
For a race tire at the track start with the recommended pressures, then adjust until you get the bike to slide on both ends at the same time. I call that the neutral point. You shouldn't be too far from recommend race pressures, maybe a pound or so. Adjust in 1/2 pound increments.

Street pressures are a bit more flexible. I set my rear so it will just step out if I squeeze on just a bit too much power (on the bikes that have enough power to step out). Control and grip is what you are looking for.
 
I normally run 25 rear 27 front on a 600rr with power ones. Played around at the track and tried a few different pressures. Found 24-30 to work well for me. YMMV


for shits and grins run your pressure through a range of recommendations. Cut your speeds and get a feel for the difference. I think those with less hours on the track, like myself, will find that your tire pressure is unique to you, your bike, your weight and your riding style.
 
what people are doing on the track has zero applicability for street riding.

on the track they're dealing with a tire or a choice of tires engineered to work extremely well but at the cost of increasingly narrow operating temperature ranges... and in the premier classes they have sensors that give them real time data regarding tire temperatures

plus the tire/tire pressure/ temperature combination they decide on is only expected to be used for 30 or 40 minutes on a few miles of uniform pavement

when I pull out of my driveway I may be riding for hours on a dozen different grades of concrete, tarmac, even gravel and also experiencing inland valley heat in the 90s and an hour later coastal fog and temperatures in the 60s

I generally set my pressures right in the middle of the manufacturers spec, and I don't bother to check the tire pressure all that often. If a tire is significantly low (or high as happened once) I'll notice it within a block.
 
Depends on what they do on the street I suppose.

My VFR is handled just as you stated with the exception of canyon carving. I will dial my pressure back a little. Everyday city putt putt, set and forget until you feel it. Dont forget the mandatory pre ride inspection..
 
33F / 35R...set it and forget it (but re-check every once in a while). I don't think too hard about tire pressure.
 
Also depends upon the weight of the bike and rider. On my ST (725 lbs fully gassed with me at 260 without gear) I run 36 - 38 on the front and 38 to 40 on the rear. Honda recommends 36/42
 
russ69 said:
For a race tire at the track start with the recommended pressures, then adjust until you get the bike to slide on both ends at the same time. I call that the neutral point. You shouldn't be too far from recommend race pressures, maybe a pound or so. Adjust in 1/2 pound increments.

Street pressures are a bit more flexible. I set my rear so it will just step out if I squeeze on just a bit too much power (on the bikes that have enough power to step out). Control and grip is what you are looking for.
Click to expand...

Follow this advice at your own risk.
 
russ69 said:
For a race tire at the track start with the recommended pressures, then adjust until you get the bike to slide on both ends at the same time. I call that the neutral point. You shouldn't be too far from recommend race pressures, maybe a pound or so. Adjust in 1/2 pound increments.

....
Click to expand...

ya this is def wrong

race tire pressures should be set for optimal temperature and grip... and the suspension and geometry adjusted to make the bike ride the way you want it. theres a lot more that comes into it with the rider's effect on hot pressure, but thats far beyond the scope of this thread so far.
 
canyonrat said:
I was reviewing the BARF board over tire pressure. There are all sorts of variables. The weather temp. Style of riding. Weight. Suspension settings. Etc.

.....

In conclusion, for the street, I find that the rear tire should have less pressure than the front for normal street riding. For track riding, it is recommended by some to have less pressure in the rear. I will theorize that (what ever it is called) “canyon” or “sport” or “hypersport” or “spirited” street riding style, is likely in between street and track and that both tires should probably be equally pressured. As for the exact pressure…32 to 36 pounds seems about correct.

....
Click to expand...

all the info that youve found should lead u to 2 conclusions:
- everything said on BARF and the web should be taken with a grain of salt (incl me)
- street tire pressures really dont matter all that much within reason

anyone that claims they notice a 1psi different in their tires on the street is full of shit. there are too many variables in riding to make a direct comparison when changing tire pressure: road surface, ambient temp, road temp, everything the rider does, speed, weight, suspension, body position, etc etc. 31psi up front may be optimal one day in one canyon and 34psi may feel best on the freeway for your commute on another day. 32psi may feel great on Power One on a CBR with a 250lb rider, but that same tire on a GSXR when 2-up feels better at 38psi.

i think a lot of ppl approach this situation like its life or death... like if they dont have the perfect tire pressure they will crash next time in the twisties. to be honest, a 2psi difference in your tires will NEVER save you from a crash on the street when u chop the throttle going into a corner and/or target fixate into the dirt.
 
Meet me at Redwood Road. Rather than tell you I would prefer to show you that 2 pound can make a difference in the canyons. Confidence makes me a better rider. If searching for the right pressure results in better traction and increased confidence I am a better/safer rider.

No?
 
I usually run Mfgrs recommendation (32/36 on the Wee) but I check it before every ride. Twice I've discovered a nail in the rear tire by checking tire pressure before a ride. Wasn't totally flat, but down around 25 PSI... enough to be evident that something wasn't right. Would I have noticed it in a block or two? probably. Would I rather know it in my driveway? You betcha.
 
JPK said:
I usually run Mfgrs recommendation (32/36 on the Wee) but I check it before every ride. Twice I've discovered a nail in the rear tire by checking tire pressure before a ride. Wasn't totally flat, but down around 25 PSI... enough to be evident that something wasn't right. Would I have noticed it in a block or two? probably. Would I rather know it in my driveway? You betcha.
Click to expand...

Excellent point. :thumbup
 
Wormwood said:
Meet me at Redwood Road. Rather than tell you I would prefer to show you that 2 pound can make a difference in the canyons. Confidence makes me a better rider. If searching for the right pressure results in better traction and increased confidence I am a better/safer rider.

No?
Click to expand...

ahh, c now you are talking about confidence, not tire pressure. i agree that confidence is everything, but its relationship with tire pressure isnt what you think.

if u did a "lap" in the canyons, then i made a tire pressure change to your bike without telling u, and u did another lap... could you tell me what change i made? if i told you i was going to change something but didnt, would u feel an imaginary change? how about if i made a tire pressure change AND a beneficial damping change somewhere, what would u tell me?
 
Higher rear tire pressure recommendations - from Mfg

Manufacturer “Liability” is a big part of the reason for the higher numbers seen as officially recommended rear tire pressure by tire and bike manufacturers, for street tires.

Most bikes have accommodations to allow for putting the weight of a passenger on the back, and heading out onto the road. Added weight of a passenger requires significant increase in rear tire pressure (over solo riding) to properly handle the added load, without overworking and potentially damaging the tire from extreme heat build-up from excess carcass flex.

Running too low of a rear tire pressure in passenger-loaded situations could result in a catastrophic rear tire failure from overheating, with risk of serious injury or death.

As a result, to prevent this worst-case scenario, the manufacturers error on the side of caution in formally recommended rear tire pressures, compared to what would otherwise provide ideal grip and comfort/compliance for performance riding, when the bike is used in most other conditions.

A bit higher pressure may produce a bit less performance when solo riding in sporty use, but won’t create any real danger or risk beyond that. However running too low of a tire pressure (on a rear tire) during heavily loaded 2-Up riding, could create a very bad outcome and high liability situation.
 
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