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3 seconds decides who goes down "Deer-vs-Bike" - Swanton Rd

so what is the deer signal you gave? do we have one for others on motorbikes?

can we come up with one to warn riders going the other direction that we seen a deer?

kinda like the head tap for police?
 
.....However in my first deer/bike collision where the impact was dead center, mid-torso, on a 100 lb+ deer standing broadside in the roadway, the much greater speed (and holding the throttle on hard) resulted in splitting right through the center of the animal (cutting it into two equal-sized pieces) and the bike actually staying up on two wheels for quite some distance past the impact point...

if i could go back in time to witness an event, this would be it.
 
so what is the deer signal you gave? do we have one for others on motorbikes?

can we come up with one to warn riders going the other direction that we seen a deer?

kinda like the head tap for police?
right now, use your hands to make antlers, thumbs near ears, fingers spread wide. got it?
on the bike, just use your left hand.
I use that for deer, cattle, boar, etc.
 
Just how thin the "roll-the-dice" line is that can separate between being a deer/bike collision statistic, or not, was (unfortunately) brought home again on a post 4th of July holiday ride on Swanton Road ...... in the Santa Cruz mountains.

The totally unavoidable nature that can be at the core of such collisions, despite the absolute most defensive, safe and skilled level of riding, was also clearly confirmed.

At the time of this deer/bike incident I was riding with a friend that I'd just happened to cross paths with, in a totally unplanned meeting at the Pescadero lunch stop.

After a ride down to the coast, and the trek down Hwy 1, we'd turned off and taken the Swanton Road loop. Just prior to the incident, we'd crossed the top of the hill on Swanton Road, passing by the residences at the standard totally chill one-handed, 20 MPH pace.

After passing those homes, only a few turns down the hill, while leading the way at was still a very chilled (maybe 30 MPH or less?) pace, I suddenly saw a small deer come darting out onto the roadway from the lefthand side, coming up from a steep blind embankment. I saw it early and slowed while observing it's actions and planning for whatever evasive action seemed best.

While dealing with the currently visible obstacle, as much of my focus was devoted to rapidly scanning the scene in anticipating the appearance of another animal showing up close behind, and putting an adjusted plan into action for avoiding collision with that deer.

Immediately after the deer had run to the far right side of the shoulder and into the brush, I reached up and gave a quick warning signal of "DEER AHEAD" to the rider behind me.

Almost the moment I'd put my hand back on the bar, and returned a glance to my rear view mirrors, my stomach was clenched by the sight of a bike and rider being instantly slammed to the ground in a sliding spray of sparks.

I immediately slowed and made a quick U-Turn to return to the crash site. Upon dismounting my bike, the scene showed a dead deer (small, only being about 40 lbs?) lying in the roadway on the left half of the lane, a crashed Ducati lying on its right side, in the right portion of the roadway about 20 feet past, and the rider lying in a fetal position in the right side grass ditch, moaning loudly and reeling in pain.

Thanks to the kind assistance of a local resident that has a house at the top of the hill, we were able to get the bike lifted up, and ultimately ridden up the hill for temporary storage. Together we were able to attend to the injured rider, eventually assisting him in getting to his feet and walking over to a more safe and comfortable sitting position, on the opposite side of the road.

Ultimately due to the pain level, and uncertainty of the injuries (by the rider's decision), the Cal Fire team and paramedic/medical teams were dispatched. As per what's become pretty standard protcol lately, despite the non-life threatening condition, he was ultimately flown out to Stanford for evaluation.

Despite the air flight method of transport (that the medics again decided upon) the good news ended up being that his injuries were liimited to the one item I'd already diagnosed at the scene ....... being a badly broken right collarbone. After only a few hours of total time at the hospital, he ended up riding back home with his Wife in their car, with nothing more than a sling and a prescription for some good pain killers.

Due to the help of the very cool folks at two separate residences near the top of the hill on Swanton Road, the bike and his riding gear were separately kept safe until I returned an hour or so later with my truck to retrieve all. Really good people!!! :thumbup

I believe the deer that took him out was the same deer that had crossed in front of me. The impact occurring when that same deer, likely out of fear in wanting to return to from where it came and perceived safety of its parent, leaped back into the roadway from right-to-left, at the exact moment my friend's bike had reached that location.

EPILOG:

Having been the human victim of 3 different bike/deer collisions in the past (two with crashes and injuries, and one staying upright), the fact that only a few seconds separated the outcome of my friend being the unfortunate rider to be in the position to be taken out in this case ....... versus me adding a fourth pair of antlers to the tally sheet .... really spotlighted how it's totally roll-of-the-dice luck that often determines whether these things happen to you or not. Much moreso than the impact that even the highest level of defensive riding skills, or most conservative level of riding pace will produce in avoiding being taken out by one of these fur-covered heat-seeking projectiles.

For anyone that thinks "Oh, that'd never happen to me", because:

1) "I ride at a chill pace all the time"

2) "I'm always very attentive to what's on the road ahead of me"

3) "I have great defensive riding skills"

4) "I never ride at early morning, or late afternoon/evening dusk times"

....... guess again! A deer/bike collision can happen to YOU TOO! This incident happened at 2:30PM, on a warm and sunny afternoon, on a clear day, when riding at a very conservative speed that anyone, on any bike type, would have potentially been doing at the time.

Short of absolutely never riding a motorcycle on any road, highway, or freeway where there's the slightest chance of a deer presence, there is absolutely nothing you can do in your riding to totally prevent the potential roll-of-the-dice going wrong outcome from making you another deer/bike collision statistic. :mad

Keep your eyes open, expect the unexpected, and keep a four-leaf clover in the pockets of your leathers for luck. That's about the best you can do.


Totally agree with your well observed and writen post...except for one thing...Three seconds would be a luxury, even one second is a long time usually. I'd say millisecond or micro second should be in there, because it can be just that.

In the close calls and Hits for me...I have to look at it as there is no "rule" as far as what deer will do..they will (or can) do what is beyond all logic. (the suicidal little basturds).

I've come to one conclusion though..In the last nano-second and collision is in motion, stop braking...and do as much on the gas as can be done in that last nano-second. That can make all the difference between going down or not going down.
 
Whoa, your luck is holding Gary! Especially with the amazing amount of mileage you've accumulated in the mtns. Sounds like your friend came out basically pretty good (could have been worse).
 
When you least expect it, they will get you. It doesn't matter how careful how staid, how conservative you ride, they will get you.
Once your bike tastes blood you will find yourself in an undeclared war with wildlife.
The winged beasts are their own separate nightmare.


:thumbup Truth Girl :thumbup Some day (don't want to derail this thread) I'll tell about a Vulure that vomited on me :laughing (sure I can laugh now, but then it was the grossest thing evah)
 
Scary story man! Not much more could have been done to avoid this tho :(
 
It's the only thing I've ever seen that scares them the hell off the road. works too. I've done this several times and they always tear off into the bushes.
You must have a different and/or louder horn than me. I'm on those roads almost every day and I've encountered hundreds of deer. I've tried the horn thing and I've tried not using the horn and I seem to get the same response both ways. Sometimes they run, sometimes they don't. At least 5 times I've had deer standing in the roadway, forcing me to come to a complete stop and I've sat there 5' away laying on the horn and the deer just stood there looking at me like "What the hell is your problem?" In fact, one of those incidents was just last week on Stage Rd.

I still use the horn some times because it can be a little cathartic, but I'm not at all convinced that it does any good at all.
 
Deer always seem to hang out in packs so once you see one look for his buddy for they are always close behind
 
if i could go back in time to witness an event, this would be it.
:rofl

Honestly, with the speed of travel (lets just say "fast freeway speeds"), total broadside pending point of contact on the 100'ish lb. deer, and force of the impending unavoidable (at that point) collision, visions of this being the end point to my final Earthly ride flashed into my head right before impact.

With the only longshot to my survival that I could see for potentially staying upright after impact, I did the following. Got my body low on the bike, braced myself against the tank and bars, and literally pegged the throttle (on the little 400cc sportbike). The idea being to either drive right through the animal and potentially survive, or at least not go down without a final fight.

It must have worked, as not only did I survive the incident, I did so with only a single broken bone and toe on my right foot (from the deer's lower torso slamming my foot into the footpeg as its body split in two and folded around the front of the bike), and a sore left knee for a few weeks (from the upper torso coming back and impacting into my lower leg), was the total injury list. :shocker

I'd certainly never wish to repeat this event, or have anyone else ever experience it ...... but as that I was faced with it once in my life ... it would have been pretty amazing to have captured the whole thing on video!

Maybe someone else will volunteer to do a sequel and repeat the incident, and we can get it down on tape? :rofl
 
so what is the deer signal you gave? do we have one for others on motorbikes?
Guess there's no "official" sign, but the one I personally use/used, it putting my hand on top of my helmet and extending my fingers to simulate the antlers of a deer.

Not sure if everyone, or how many, would understand what it means, but it's what I typically use to try to warn fellow riders in our group when I spot those critters, FWIW.
 
Totally agree with your well observed and writen post...except for one thing...Three seconds would be a luxury,.
Agreed. Think you may have misunderstood my use of the time of "3 seconds" in my title. Let me explain.

This 3 seconds was not in reference to the warning interval between sighting to impact (as my friend basically had a 0 second warning in this case), it was intended to relate to the fact that the rider behind me had passed by the point of the deer's leaping into the road about 3 seconds after I'd crossed that very same spot.

If I'd left 3 seconds earlier from my last stop-off point during the ride, it's possible I would have been the bike/rider at that spot at the moment the deer leaped out into the road .... instead of my friend? Never know, but it just shows the total "fate/roll-of-the-dice" aspect that can determine the outcome of these deer/bike interactions.
 
Deer have taken out 2 riders already this year here.
One died in the hospital, the other was dead on scene.

It does seem that there are more deer round this year.
 
I think because of the rains early this year there's much more FOOD for the animals... I'm seeing a lot more rabbits, quail, deer, coyotes, wild turkeys, etc on my mtn bike rides
 
Guess there's no "official" sign, but the one I personally use/used, it putting my hand on top of my helmet and extending my fingers to simulate the antlers of a deer.

Not sure if everyone, or how many, would understand what it means, but it's what I typically use to try to warn fellow riders in our group when I spot those critters, FWIW.

If we develop a sign we can spread it. What about wrist to your helmet with your fingers extended, like a moose antler? Or is that what you meant.

(like this, except with the wrist closer to the head: http://www.cs.colorado.edu/ugrad/seniorproject/projects/shots/2501/moose.jpg)

I think it's worth making official, easy to remember, and if someone who doesn't know it sees it, and then sees a deer in a minute or two, they should be able to figure it out for the future.
 
If we develop a sign we can spread it. What about wrist to your helmet with your fingers extended, like a moose antler? Or is that what you meant.
You got it. That's pretty much the hand signal I use for warning of deer sightings.

The left arm's wrist against the side/top of the helmet, the fingers extended widely spread, and a slow wiggling of the fingers to add movement to draw attention to the gesture.

If you're ever behind me on a group ride, and you see that sign ........ be ready to try to win at the game of "deer-dodging"!! :shocker
 
Good sign idea....I wasn't being overly creative a couple weeks ago when a friend and I were coming home on Mines close to pre-dusk. I knew the deer were going to be out so we were going super slow, we came across several groups of deer, including a couple fawns. Other than slowing to an almost idle and tapping my brakes I wasn't sure how to warn my friend. This would have been useful, I shall start using it and spread the word!
 
Since I commute into Livermore every work day via Corral Hollow/Tesla Rd in the darkness of the early A.M. hours, I see a LOT of deer. Not so many over on the central valley side, but once I get into the area of all the horse ranches on Tesla there are lots of "pet" deer on the roads. I use the term pet because these deer are well fed, used to traffic and have very little (if any) fear of cars and motorcycles. They will walk right out in front of you, stop and blink.

I have kicked two of them in the rump in the last few months. (Oh yes, they do kick back..) My latest encounter was this morning, down much lower than usual and the little bugger that scared me was not the one I had my eye on but the little bastid that ran out of the ditch and across the road to join his buddy in the ditch on the other side of the road. I was down to almost walking speed because the one I was watching looked like it was going to bolt. When the one I didn't see made their mad dash it took me totally by surprise and I was checking my saddle bag when I got to work for deer hair. It was that close.
 
There are a lot of fawns, this year. Time to be extra careful. It's still our responsibility. They are just innocent, wild babies.

bullshit on innocent wild babies.

I think garyjs furry heat seeking missiles fits reality much more accurately.

anything that can and will kill you instantly without regard for its life is not innocent nor a baby.

survival of the fittest. if i dealt with this problem on a daily basis id carry a handgun in my backpack and any surviving furry baby or in other persons story....deer that wouldnt move off the road.... id blow a hole in its skull so big you could see daylight. then light a cig off its skull and ride leasurely off after.
 
Agreed. Think you may have misunderstood my use of the time of "3 seconds" in my title. Let me explain.

This 3 seconds was not in reference to the warning interval between sighting to impact (as my friend basically had a 0 second warning in this case), it was intended to relate to the fact that the rider behind me had passed by the point of the deer's leaping into the road about 3 seconds after I'd crossed that very same spot.

If I'd left 3 seconds earlier from my last stop-off point during the ride, it's possible I would have been the bike/rider at that spot at the moment the deer leaped out into the road .... instead of my friend? Never know, but it just shows the total "fate/roll-of-the-dice" aspect that can determine the outcome of these deer/bike interactions.


Thanks for clarifying that GaryJ, I had been reading the time part wrong. :cool

I can relate, because just a few weeks ago, as I'm heading East over Ebbetts pass, and dropping into Lake Alpine, There is a nothing special bank on one side of the road, casual drop off on the other. I can't see ground above the bank, even though is only like 7 feet high, and a deer flys from the bank (highside) to the no bank side, just about 12 feet in front of me and the deer's trajectory put it at my head and chest level as it was in that part of it's flight. How far time wise behind getting taken out with no warning? I don't know how much time does it take to go 12 feet when your casually going 45-50 MPH?

The good news was..It was a way cool view of a deer in flight :laughing
 
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