A first little ride up Page Mill to Skyline...

[Rom's]

Funny story... Be prepared for a good laugh...

Yep, I've had my bike for 5 days now (awesome EX650R). Decided to go for a ride with Mr Pastafarian (and his beautiful red 250R) today. The plan: meeting at 5PM sharp today at Palo Alto foothills park.

After leaving at 4.30PM from S Mountain View and getting lost (embarrassing!) for over 45 minutes on Magdalena avenue (BTW, I would like to confirm it does NOT connect to Page Mill whatsoever!), I'm finally on Page Mill.

I start to climb Page Mill after I cross Foothills park... definitely NOT for a newbie like me!


Well, first of all... got passed by 3 (yes three!) bikes on a curve, while trying to make it alive. So much for my ego! Worse, I didn't even saw them coming, as I was simply trying to stay on the road!!! Lucky I didn't do any sudden stupid move.

Then on the way back, downhill from Skyline, I got really uneasy: so steeeeeep, and those crazy curves... I had to swallow my pride and stick to the 2nd gear! I'm glad there was no car behind!

Anyway, this is a nice reminder how much I have to learn: I'm always slowing down way too much on curves and don't really lean when I should lean. Downhill is particularly scary! Anyway...

This makes me wonder: as much as the MSF class is great and priceless about safety, I feel like I learned to drive a moped on a parking lot! Having a nice 650cc and real-world traffic situation is quite a different story!

Any advice on learning more about traffic, position of the bike on the highway, when it's safe to pass on the right? How to evaluate the "right" speed on a curve you've never been to? When to split lanes? What about slowly going straight to the traffic light when both lanes are packed with cars?
And what about being stuck behind that stupid car on the left-most lane driving way slower than the traffic?

Yes, you got it, Newbie questions!!
-Romain

 

[YanaBanana]

s

Congrats on the bike and taking the MSF!

I'm moving this thread to General for more input from others (be gentle, please!)

My : Page Mill is not newbie-friendly by any means! Practicing daily in parking lots and on quiet town streets will slowly guide you to limits where you'll be better able to judge cornering speeds, etc. (best to go into them slowly and gradually accelerate out of them).

There are a lot of drills one can work on - breathing being paramount (no, really!), relaxing the upper body while gripping bike with thighs (esp. on downhills), looking beyond the turns, not looking down, etc, etc.


When to pass anything on the right? NEVER! Even if a car doesn't take a pull-out lane, if you do, they may swerve into you at the last minute!

Leave splitting/sharing lanes to a later time as well, when you and the bike are more synched. Don't become a statistic.

Learn to ride fast s-l-o-w-l-y --- focus on skills and smoothness first, the rest will follow.


Yana

p.s. If you can get a ChatterBox, I'll gladly give you some pointers - PM me.

 

[Cycle61]

+1 on all the above. Page Mill scares me even now, I crashed a bicycle descending that hill and left a lot of skin on the pavement.

But that's probably not the message we want to spread here.

 

[EEL]

+2

Downhill can be scary. Definitely not for the faint of heart. I used to avoid that road like the plague but now I love it. It will grow on you once you get better.

My biggest worry about page mill is the manhole covers in the middle of the road that you have to avoid while going downhill. Bad idea to be hard on the brakes while going over one of those. Not to mention that the fog rolling over them in the evening makes them pretty slippery.

 

[Rom's]

Thanks guys. The first section of Page Mill from 280 to Palo Alto Foothill Park is quite enjoyable.

Still cannot believe those 3 guys who overtook me full speed on a curve! Impressive! (well, I now realize "full speed" is a relative term considering the crawling speed I was riding up there!)

So never pass anything on the right, what's the strategy for making the car in front of you move?
What about moving in front of vehicles that are waiting at the traffic light? Very tempting, tried it several times with success.

Romain

 

[Ant]

If you felt comfortable on Page Mill up unto the park then I have a mellow route for you with twisty's and up/down hill that would be great to learn on and fun to ride.

Look at google maps for Altamont road behind foothill college and Arastradero road off of Page Mill.

I'd go from Altamont to Page Mill, make a right and go down hill, left on Arastradero and that will take you to Alpine road then turn around and do it again.

 

[sv2007]

...
I start to climb Page Mill after I cross Foothills park... definitely NOT for a newbie like me!
...
Then on the way back, downhill from Skyline, I got really uneasy: so steeeeeep, and those crazy curves... I had to swallow my pride and stick to the 2nd gear! I'm glad there was no car behind!

Anyway, this is a nice reminder how much I have to learn: I'm always slowing down way too much on curves and don't really lean when I should lean. Downhill is particularly scary! Anyway...

This makes me wonder: as much as the MSF class is great and priceless about safety, I feel like I learned to drive a moped on a parking lot! Having a nice 650cc and real-world traffic situation is quite a different story!

Any advice on learning more about traffic, position of the bike on the highway, when it's safe to pass on the right? How to evaluate the "right" speed on a curve you've never been to? When to split lanes? What about slowly going straight to the traffic light when both lanes are packed with cars?
And what about being stuck behind that stupid car on the left-most lane driving way slower than the traffic?
...

Page Mill isn't an easy road for even experienced riders. I believe in using the right tools for the job, and a sportbike like yours isn't the right tool for Page Mill. Best do what I do and just to avoid that road if possible, no need to bring on unnecessary unfun drama.

As for advise on the questions you asked. Mainly, just go based on what youre comfortable with and remember that car-vs-bike the car always wins.

 

[Burning1]

Page mill tends to require better use of the eyes than some of the faster roads in the bay area. If you're not used to looking all the way through a corner, it can be very intimidating.

Generally, I'd advise newer riders to stay away from Page Mill and Alpine unless you have a lead you really trust. The roads are poorly marked, and inconsistent. It's easy to get into a grove just in time to be surprised by a particularly sharp corner.

Particular memories: The dust cloud as my father crashed, trying to follow me. The 2008 GSXR-1000, abandoned on the side of the road with a broken frame.

 

[sportsluvr]

Best do what I do and just to avoid that road if possible,...

On the contrary, by riding PMR and Alpine (back and forth) I'm gradually learning the tricks to riding such roads: slow release of clutch, smooth throttle application, looking where you want to go, and being relaxed, very relaxed.

Edit: I was too excited to add my experiences and forgot that Yana has covered all the bases for us already.

 

[Ant]

On the contrary, by riding PMR and Alpine (back and forth) I'm gradually learning the tricks to riding such roads: slow release of clutch, smooth throttle application, looking where you want to go, and being relaxed, very relaxed.

Yep

Page Mill scared the crap outa me so each ride I did just what you said and ventured farther and farther as my comfort grew.

 

[VaderSS]

Shoulda' seen me the first time I hit Wooden Valley Road on my GL1800A. Old ladies in SUVs were passing me. And then I hit Monticello... That was with 20+ years of Texas and Louisiana riding to prepare me, AKA, no preparation at all...

I got the book Total Control, and a couple of months later I am doing the Little Dragon on 49 and in heaven and taking 250 miles of hills and curves the next day. Even downhills don't faze me now.

 

[bshum]

Shoulda' seen me the first time I hit Wooden Valley Road on my GL1800A. Old ladies in SUVs were passing me. And then I hit Monticello... That was with 20+ years of Texas and Louisiana riding to prepare me, AKA, no preparation at all...

I got the book Total Control, and a couple of months later I am doing the Little Dragon on 49 and in heaven and taking 250 miles of hills and curves the next day. Even downhills don't faze me now.

Wow... I should transpose those words into a tv commercial advertising Total Control

 

[louemc]

Funny story... Be prepared for a good laugh...

Yep, I've had my bike for 5 days now (awesome EX650R). Decided to go for a ride with Mr Pastafarian (and his beautiful red 250R) today. The plan: meeting at 5PM sharp today at Palo Alto foothills park.

After leaving at 4.30PM from S Mountain View and getting lost (embarrassing!) for over 45 minutes on Magdalena avenue (BTW, I would like to confirm it does NOT connect to Page Mill whatsoever!), I'm finally on Page Mill.

I start to climb Page Mill after I cross Foothills park... definitely NOT for a newbie like me!


Well, first of all... got passed by 3 (yes three!) bikes on a curve, while trying to make it alive. So much for my ego! Worse, I didn't even saw them coming, as I was simply trying to stay on the road!!! Lucky I didn't do any sudden stupid move.

Then on the way back, downhill from Skyline, I got really uneasy: so steeeeeep, and those crazy curves... I had to swallow my pride and stick to the 2nd gear! I'm glad there was no car behind!

Anyway, this is a nice reminder how much I have to learn: I'm always slowing down way too much on curves and don't really lean when I should lean. Downhill is particularly scary! Anyway...

This makes me wonder: as much as the MSF class is great and priceless about safety, I feel like I learned to drive a moped on a parking lot! Having a nice 650cc and real-world traffic situation is quite a different story!

Any advice on learning more about traffic, position of the bike on the highway, when it's safe to pass on the right? How to evaluate the "right" speed on a curve you've never been to? When to split lanes? What about slowly going straight to the traffic light when both lanes are packed with cars?
And what about being stuck behind that stupid car on the left-most lane driving way slower than the traffic?

Yes, you got it, Newbie questions!!
-Romain

That's quite a lot of area of question (That's good that you see the need) You might want to attend all the Doc Wong clinics, he covers a lot of subject territory. And it sounds like your pretty close to where they get held.

and .... Congratulations on picking such a great bike.

 

[PageMillPlaya]

pagemill is the shiettt

 

[sportsluvr]

You might want to attend all the Doc Wong clinics, he covers a lot of subject territory. And it sounds like your pretty close to where they get held.

Well, this month's Doc Wong ride is tomorrow and I will be there. IMHO, it is not a truly newbie-friendly ride. You, OP, could do it after you have a few thousand miles under your belt.

 

[Underdog]

2nd gear downhill is not that bad an idea at all, btw. Especially if you're still learning the route.

As other said above, it's not really a beginners route; kudos on NOT crashing, though-- always play within your limits. Ride safe now.

 

[YanaBanana]

So never pass anything on the right, what's the strategy for making the car in front of you move?

I use my highbeams to get their attention, and/or my horn - in a friendly "toot-toot" manner, not a long angry blast...

Either a friendly "thank-you" wave or at least a head-nod afterwards is nice.

What about moving in front of vehicles that are waiting at the traffic light?

Do it when you're comfortable and there's plenty of room, otherwise don't take the chance - clipping car mirrors = and .

Beware of being the first one off the light too -- many get hit by cars running the just-turned-red light in the opposite direction!


Yana

 

[moto-rama]

Yep, I've had my bike for 5 days now (awesome EX650R).

I am sure you'll get plenty of advice around here, being a noob and all...so I will spare you my own volume of "jim's-motorcycle-advice-isms" .

So just practice and practice and practice what you have learned already, and when you're ready to expand your repertoire, get Kieth Code's book, Twist of the Wrist II, and Proficient Motorcycling.

And don't forget to wear all your gear, all the time.

 

[DataDan]

Any advice on learning more about traffic, position of the bike on the highway, when it's safe to pass on the right? How to evaluate the "right" speed on a curve you've never been to? When to split lanes? What about slowly going straight to the traffic light when both lanes are packed with cars?

Good questions, which could have come from a syllabus for "Riding 102--After MSF".

I'm not sure what you mean by passing on the right. If there's only one lane in your direction, it's basically never safe to pass on the right. If there are 2 or more lanes, you need to pay attention to opportunities the car in the left lane has to turn or pull off the road. Try not to put yourself between a cage and an offramp.

A good way to judge speed for an unfamiliar curve is a technique called The Vanishing Point (link to 1Rider thread). I encourage you to read the whole thread, but the first post and the photo sequence illustrate the basic idea. Try it yourself and, if you have any questions post them up and I'll try to answer them.

The relative safety of lane-splitting comes from riding between two lanes of bumper-to-bumper traffic moving in the same direction. Presence of cars in the other lane keeps drivers in their own lanes, and you don't have to rely on them seeing you.

When there's a gap in one of the lanes that allows cars in the other lane to swerve across the lane-splitting channel, you're asking for trouble if you continue to split. There are at least 15 BARF threads in the past few years about crashes that have occurred in exactly that situation.

For the same reason, never split to the left of the far left lane or to the right of the far right lane. You're depending on drivers who could turn or pull off the road to look for you. Don't give them that much credit.

Never split alongside a large truck. Of the 11 lane-splitting deaths in the Bay Area in the past 4 years, 8 have involved large trucks.

For more discussion about riding attitudes as well as particular riding decisions look through the 1Rider threads.

 

[cmetzenberg]

pagemill is the shiettt

word.