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BST wheels?

A buddy of mine is an independent motorcycle rep and traveled extensively on a ZX-6 equipped with BST's. He put over 50K miles on that bike without a single issue with the wheels (and believe me, the rest of the bike was shagged).

I had quite a few customers from Scud West using them without incedent as well. Changing tires on those wheels can be an ass puckering experience though.
 
aciurczak said:
Setting aside the durability or safety issue (it always degenerates threads like this to a point where one side never convinces the other side), the only reason they aren't on my sportbike yet is simply the cost for the expected performance gain. The fastest motorcyclists in the world, whose class rules allow for carbon wheels, still don't use them. Not in MotoGP, WSBK, BSB, AMA SBK, you name it. These people fight for tenths, and have the money to replace the entire bike each weekend if the need arises, so the longetivity issue simply doesn't apply in their case.


I never realized that! Is this because they have a better/different in-house solution, or are the commonly held beliefs in their benefits bs?
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Naysayers would say that those beliefs aren't commonly held. Some of the MotoGP teams have tested with carbon fiber wheels, but for whatever reason, none of the teams use them. Outsiders might never learn why that's the case, but all that can be reliably inferred is that there must be some reason or reasons why all teams came to the same conclusion.
 
aciurczak said:
Naysayers would say that those beliefs aren't commonly held. Some of the MotoGP teams have tested with carbon fiber wheels, but for whatever reason, none of the teams use them. Outsiders might never learn why that's the case, but all that can be reliably inferred is that there must be some reason or reasons why all teams came to the same conclusion.
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Sponsorship might have something to do with it.

I also know that at one time the AMA did not allow CF wheels but I'm not sure if this is still the case. The absolute lightest wheels are magnesium I think but these wheels would not be a good choice for the street because they probably would not pass the DOT tests.
 
The reason ama doesn't allow cf wheels is a safety issue, the only way to check for cracks is to xray the wheel, by the way bst wheels are way stronger then any forged wheel, and i am running cast marchesinis handles way better, but if i had the money i would get the bst wheels.
 
gixxerboy55 said:
The reason ama doesn't allow cf wheels is a safety issue, the only way to check for cracks is to xray the wheel, by the way bst wheels are way stronger then any forged wheel, and i am running cast marchesinis handles way better, but if i had the money i would get the bst wheels.
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AMA allows non-DOT approved wheels right? BST's are DOT approved so I don't understand their safety concern. AMA regulations don't always make sense to me.
 
BLU_G.6K said:
AMA allows non-DOT approved wheels right? BST's are DOT approved so I don't understand their safety concern. AMA regulations don't always make sense to me.
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gixxerboy is correct, I was mistaken. AMA specifically bans carbon and carbon fiber rims in all road race classes, so no teams do have a choice to use them. This isn't the case in other series, though. Here's a link to the latest AMA rulebook:

link to pdf file...
 
gixxerboy55 said:
CF wheels are very strong, but they don't give much or bend like a metal wheel they either crack or break.
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CF can be brittle or flexible, it depends on the layup. it's quite conceivable that the lip section of a CF wheel is more flexible and impact tolerant than a metal rim while the spokes of the CF rim are are stiffer than the metal counterpart.

X-ray is the way to check for small defects from manufacture such as voids in the layup. damage from an accident is going to be obvious, like a visible break, or an internal delamination. delams are easy to find by just tapping on the part with a quarter (nickel, penny and dime are my backups in order of preference. 50 cent piece is just showing off as is a silver dollar)
 
So magnesium is the material of choice for the factory teams and privateers?
If so, that doesn't necessarily mean CF is wasted money for mortals.
 
You could crash on a set of Magtans, bend one up a bit and still finish the GP, get one point, be world champion. Similar crash on a CF wheel could result in no damage, but it could result in a pile of shards and no chance of resuming the race. GP teams spend a lot of resources making the bikes relatively crash worthy, wheel choice is part of it.
 
BLU_G.6K said:
AMA allows non-DOT approved wheels right? BST's are DOT approved so I don't understand their safety concern. AMA regulations don't always make sense to me.
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probably a $$$ issue... forged magnesium wheels design are reasonably priced and everyone has access to the same stuff (except when Honda cheats :teeth )

Right now no one has any incentive to really push carbon fiber wheel technology but allowing exotic composite materials could open up a whole new arms race. Within a couple years you might see wheels 1/3 the weight of the DOT legal BSTs but they might cost $40k each too.
 
Kameron808 said:
You could crash on a set of Magtans, bend one up a bit and still finish the GP, get one point, be world champion. Similar crash on a CF wheel could result in no damage, but it could result in a pile of shards and no chance of resuming the race. GP teams spend a lot of resources making the bikes relatively crash worthy, wheel choice is part of it.
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Good point; I have to admit that hadn't occurred to me. But they could still use something very different for last lap qualifying compared to a more crash-worthy race-setup; if the carbon wheels would truly provide a 0.2 second advantage over non-carbon, I still don't understand why they aren't used at the same time they put the 1-lap qualifiers on.
 
For those of you who've been able to put on significantly lighter wheels, how did you're suspension settings need to change?
 
Not much a little less damping is needed, ride is a little better, the biggest change is high speed handling and the brakes work better less flywheel effect.
 
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gixxerboy55 said:
Not much a little less damping is needed, ride is a little better, the biggest change is high speed handling and the brakes work better less flywheel effect.
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+1 to all of the above. I had BSTs on my RC51 (sold to a fellow RC51 owner when I sold the bike), then bought BSTs again for my ZX10R. Both bikes saw street and track duty, even some commuting to SF. Not a single problem. Just my personal experience, but so happens to echo so many others. Only thing holding me back now is the cost vs. my current income generation. :cry
 
I think the "Safety issue" isn't about the wheel crashing better or worse than Mags. It's about the perceived danger to other riders or spectators. If a rider crashes a bike with CF wheels the rider will be no worse off than if he crashed a bike with Mag.s. However said crash could render the track completely unrideable for the rest of the weekend. Plus CF shards are cancerus and a biohazard.

Also the small amount of flex of Mag shrapnel might be the difference between life and death to spectators and track workers.

These are non factors in street use but present a risk that race promoters may not be willing to take.
 
FYI, a while back they were starting to use CF on just about every component on MotoGP bikes (back in the 2-stroke days).

They actually had stability problems when using the CF wheels along with carbon disks, forks and sliders. Not to mention they managed to get well under the minimum weight very easily, which isn't much help if you have to strap some lard on somewhere else.

If you want to see a return of carbon and similar exotics on larger components in racing, then ask the racing bodies to reduce the minimum weights.

There were a handful of notable failures YEARS ago with carbon wheels. They've come a long way since then.

If Terry's Gixxer can put up with my fat ass railing on Pescadero and Alpine, then they can probaly withstand anything :twofinger

Might want to look up Dunlop's crash at the IOM, on mag wheels...

If you use short-circtuit wheels on the street, you're asking for it, no matter what they are made of. Get wheels made for the street, and you should be fine. I've seen stock street wheels crack after being run over a railroad tie, so staying with the (relatively) heavy stock clunkers is no guarantee of durability if you abuse em...
 
BLU_G.6K said:
If you actually understood anything about CF wheels you would also know that CF does not bend out of shape, therefore you would never have to worry about being able to straighten the wheel back. :rofl
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having held 2 bent ones in my own hand during last seasons AFM races shows you have no clue what you're talking about.
 
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