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Dave Moss at MotoGP with On The Throttle

C

crs tuning

New member
Joined
Jun 21, 2009
Location
Richmond
Moto(s)
RVF428, VFR800, GSXR 750
Name
Dave Moss
Early morning start today at 6am to see the lay of the land, who is where and where the best cup of coffee is! There's no track time this morning to shoot so we will be walking around setting up with crew chief to work on this weekend's topic:- ergonomics.

This will be all about getting the rider comfortable, why use aftermarket parts vs stock (adjustability) and how much real time is spent modifying levers and controls to make sure th the rider is 100% comfortable.

I will be cruising around the hot pits during practice this afternoon noting chassis and suspension changes made and will report back later today

Should be interesting......

Live comments at www.onthethrottle.com in the Twitter section of the home page, bottom left.
 
interviews this morning with.....

Met with the following to discuss ergonomics:

Tyler Odom:
Crew chief Martin has been moving his handlebars out/forward in an attempt to give Tyler more front end feel as he has been plagued with low end low sides. Result - less crashes to the point that he had an incident free weekend at Road America!

Chuck Warren and Blake Young:
Chuck spent a lot of time with Blake testing prototype handlebars for angle and location at the start of the year. Now that they have all of the data for Blake's ergonomics, when they do a frame up build or a frame strip and rebuild everything goes back to the original and required position via specific tooling they made.

Mike Canfield and Martin Cardenas
Mike will change handlebar position and foot peg location as needed for Martin. He stated that to date this year, every race has seen small changes that have been made to make sure Martin is comfortable on the bike and given his results, that seems to be a very important factor.

The track goes live in 30 mins or so, and I am off to tune for Privateers in Daytona Sportbike and American Superbike.
 
Dunlop conversation.

Interesting chat with Dunlop today concerning their AMA tires.

This years slick is last years NTech slick in carcass design and compounds, so cold/hot pressures are the same.

The 09 AMA spec tire is 23 hot for the rear and 27 hot for the front irrespective of soft or hard compounds. Hot pressure is critical so calibrating your tire gauge is essential !!!!

The tearing problem of the soft compound close to the joint of the harder compound may be a thing of the past as they tested a new soft at Sears with good results and will be doing back up testing here. The new generation soft may become available shortly to AMA and then to us lesser mortals.

There was an urban rumor that using purely nitrogen was not a wise thing to do and that was completely squashed with a loud burst of laughter. Interestingly enough, Dunlop uses an air dryer mechanism to avoid water vapor in their lines when they inflate tires so that there will not be a temperature spike or cold to hot gain that would cause carcass overheating.
 
Ohlins TTX sock tech info

In talking with The M4 techs I noticed they were using a precision tool for measuring TTX shocks that were sitting off the bike on the work tables. In watching what was happening they were measuring all shocks for overall length before they were put into the tool box to go to the pit wall.

The reason for measuring each shock is to ensure they have exactly the same length making sure that the rear geometry of the bike is a constant for each rider.

Why?

The TTX shock has a top out spring in it that will depending on installed preload, allow you to lift the tail of the bike up 15mm or so until the shock is truly topped out. So, every spring must be installed with exactly the same amount of preload (ie: 12 to 15mm shorter than if it was sitting on the bench) so that when a rider tests the shock spring for edge grip under hard acceleration there are no variables that creep into the equation to give a false read.

Details, details, details.....................
 
crs tuning said:
Interesting chat with Dunlop today concerning their AMA tires.

This years slick is last years NTech slick in carcass design and compounds, so cold/hot pressures are the same.

The 09 AMA spec tire is 23 hot for the rear and 27 hot for the front irrespective of soft or hard compounds. Hot pressure is critical so calibrating your tire gauge is essential !!!!

The tearing problem of the soft compound close to the joint of the harder compound may be a thing of the past as they tested a new soft at Sears with good results and will be doing back up testing here. The new generation soft may become available shortly to AMA and then to us lesser mortals.

There was an urban rumor that using purely nitrogen was not a wise thing to do and that was completely squashed with a loud burst of laughter. Interestingly enough, Dunlop uses an air dryer mechanism to avoid water vapor in their lines when they inflate tires so that there will not be a temperature spike or cold to hot gain that would cause carcass overheating.
Click to expand...

I just put on a set of the June 09 AMA spect GP-A's and had the same advice from Dunlop. I checked directly with Dunlop after setting the rear at 31 hot and suffering cold tearing after a couple of sessions at Thill on Jun 22nd.
 
Chassis and Suspension Tuning notes from Daytona Sportbike and American Superbike

Matt Bergen # 152
AMA Spec Tire
4 laps to get tires hot, set pressure to 23 rear & 27 front with calibrated gauge
4 laps focusing on T11 for hard braking. Forks bottom added all available preload
2 laps on T11 still bottomed add 1/4 turn of compression
2 laps on T11, too stiff and removed 1/8th turn of compression -much better
Rear tire showed rebound was too slow and bike would not finish corner
Removed 3 clicks of shock rebound
4 laps evaluating drive out of T3
Bike finished the corner but chattered in T9 with neutral throttle
Removed 1/2 turn of rebound
No chatter T9.
Chassis working well, no issues.


Sahar Zvik # 161
AMA Spec tire
4 laps to get tires hot, set pressure to 23 rear & 27 front with calibrated gauge
4 laps focusing on T11 for hard braking. Forks too stiff removed 2 turns of preload
2 laps on T11 still too stiff, 1 turn out of preload
Chatter on the brakes in T11 and T5, removed 1/2 turn of rebound
2 laps still had chatter removed 1/ turn of rebound
2 laps, chatter gone.
4 laps not turning in adequately removed 3 clicks of shock rebound and added 2 clicks of low speed compression
4 laps much better but still pushing (session ends)
NOT: remove one turn of preload at a time to help the front end ride lower every 2 laps during Saturday morning practice.


Brad Puetz # 45
Dunlop NTech slicks
4 laps to get tires hot, set pressure to 26.5 rear & 35 front with calibrated gauge
4 laps focusing rear shock wallow in T3 & 4
remove 3 clicks of rebound, 3 clicks of ow speed compression
4 laps bike still standing up on exit
add three clicks of rebound remove three clicks of low speed compression
4 laps bike finishing better but still standing up
remove 1 turn of preload
6 laps bike drifting and sliding predictably
NOTE: spring may be too stiff at 575lbs, try 550 tomorrow.

That's it for today folks - time to start some interviews and log/capture todays video clips. Any going to Peets?
 
Dave Moss, one of the hardest working people in the paddock, shown here in slacks, and colored shirt
:twofinger
 

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Mick-e:- everyone will think you photo shopped that...... :) see you later today in the Moto GP hot pits
 
Day two at Laguna with an 8am start!

Good morning everyone!

Having been kidnapped by friends and subjected to the requirement of consuming a large quantity of Old Speckled Hen, it is a slow start this morning...... such is the hospitality and frivolity of campers at Laguna!

With the track open at 8am this morning, there's a lot happening so I will try to report back on various interesting occurrences.

Last night we watched Factory Yamaha techs perform a frame swap on Josh Hayes' R1. No idea why and we will try to catch up with him this morning. They started at 7pm and were back at the hotel by 10pm. Such is the skill level of race techs.......

One very interesting note was once the radiator came off, we could see that there were three pieces of tape totaling about 3' in length placed strategically on the radiator. Most are used to seeing that on 2 strokes where combustion chamber temperature is critical. There's no difference with 4 strokes and due to the volume and size of the factory radiator, too much air flow was creating too much cooling and the engine was running too cold. Therefore, add the tape and block the wind flow and the engine temp will go up.

Ambient temps will be much the same today so the tape will stay in place!

Now, where's the coffee??
 
American Superbike morning Practice

Brad Puetz # 45

Soft spring installed, zero preload on the remote preload adjuster. Sag set at 25mm

4 laps in to set tire pressure to 35 front and 27 rear

4 laps to focus on drive T3 & 4

Tire tearing in one small spot, removed 3 clicks of rebound

Tear got worse, put rebound back added 2 turns of preload

Tire started to heal.
 
Great Thread! Thanks Dave!
 
Daytona Sportbike Practice

Sahar Zvik # 161
Need more turn in and front end feel.
4 laps hot tire pressure set 23 rear 27 front
2 turns of preload removed - 3 laps
wrong way, three turns of preload added plus 2mm of rear ride height - 2 laps
better feel, turn in add another 2mm of rear ride height - 2 laps
better turn in, not as good on the brakes, remove 1mm of rear ride height
ready for qualifying - no changes during qualifying

Matt Bergen # 152
Evaluate turn in and rear edge grip
4 laps hot tire pressure set 23 rear 27 front
change fork compression to 3/4 out and add 3mm rear ride height - 3 laps
forks bottomed, removed three turns of preload - 2 laps
too much compression on braking change to 1 out
better front end feel
edge grip consistent
ready for qualifying - no changes during qualifying
 
end of day 2

More ergonomics interviews with Team LTD ( Puerta, Pascarella and Nash) and Josh Herrin and Crew Chief Curtis Tom.

All tuning work is complete and all but 1 qualified for their respective races!

Several hundred video clips to sort and file and then some sleep before heading off first thing in the morning to Thunderhill to set up for the week starting with Keigwins Monday & Tuesday event. I am not fighting GP traffic even though there are very meager crowds here - threadbare might be more appropriate!

It has been a great 2 days and this project has been a lot of fun. I hope you all enjoyed it and perhaps even got some insights that made sense to you :)

Look for the ergonomics interviews to start appearing on www.onthethrottle.com within the next few weeks and remember that new programming is posted every day!

Happy 4th!!

Dave
 
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