Downshift when coming to red light

[bojangle]

You've missed shifts into first? I didn't think that was even possible.

A few times I've experienced a bike not wanting to shift from neutral into first, and took a bit of rolling forward to make it happen. I think this has occurred mostly when I've maneuvered my bike, backing it into a corner of my garage while in neutral. Sometimes it won't want to drop right into first without rolling it forward a bit.

Either way, the delay of dropping into first might be the difference of getting hit or not. 99% of the time, I stop in first gear, holding in clutch, left leg down, and right leg on rear brake. Also positioned either between stopped cars, or in a manner I could quickly get to an escape route.

 

[stangmx13]

Don't forget- the clutch does not need to be an on-off switch. Slipping it can have a large impact on shifting during downshifts and how the chassis feels when decelerating quickly.

 

[dravnx]

A few times I've experienced a bike not wanting to shift from neutral into first, and took a bit of rolling forward to make it happen. I think this has occurred mostly when I've maneuvered my bike, backing it into a corner of my garage while in neutral. Sometimes it won't want to drop right into first without rolling it forward a bit.

Either way, the delay of dropping into first might be the difference of getting hit or not. 99% of the time, I stop in first gear, holding in clutch, left leg down, and right leg on rear brake. Also positioned either between stopped cars, or in a manner I could quickly get to an escape route.

Same here. I also angle the bike either to the left or right or stop outside the line of cars but inside my lane depending on logistics. Every little bit helps.

 

[tzrider]

I'd always been told when driving a car that riding the clutch would prematurely wear the throwout bearing. In cars, I leave in in neutral until it's time to go.

Regardless of whether the above is true for cars, I've always left my bikes in gear at lights and have had no issues with any part of the clutch. I can't think of a mechanical reason to not leave the bike in gear and it does make is a little quicker to get out of there if you need to.

 

[Gary856]

It may not feel safe for some but I've had no problem being in neutral while waiting at the light. When the light cycle's really long I've turned off the bike to avoid over heating. You need to be situational aware and make your own judgment. When I'm between stopped cars I see very little risk.

Shifting into first and taking off when the light turned green has never been a problem on my own bikes. What's notable was when I rented a KTM 790 Adventure R, I stalled it at the light 3 or 4 different times through out the day, when I didn't pay as much attention letting out the clutch; not sure if that bike had a light flywheel so easy to stall or what. Obviously stalling at take off was iffy when I was at the front of the line.

P.S.: I just remembered - that rented KTM had a Camel ADV one-finger clutch kit, which was consisted of a longer actuation lever at the engine end. Due to the longer lever arm, the clutch pull became lighter but longer, so that probably threw off my clutch timing and caused the unexpected stalling. It wasn't a problem when I was just a little more careful, and the lighter clutch lever pull was great.

 

[motomania2007]

I'd always been told when driving a car that riding the clutch would prematurely wear the throwout bearing. In cars, I leave in in neutral until it's time to go.

Regardless of whether the above is true for cars, I've always left my bikes in gear at lights and have had no issues with any part of the clutch. I can't think of a mechanical reason to not leave the bike in gear and it does make is a little quicker to get out of there if you need to.

Probably true, in a car. But not true on most motorcycles because throw out bearing parts are actively lubricated in most motorcycles where they are not lubed in most cars.

MSF PREVIOUSLY, back in the 80's, recommended being in neutral at traffic lights because the clutch cable might break and cause the bike to unintentionally launch into traffic ahead.

The California motorcycle handbook used to recommend that as well.

Those of us that used to ride bikes in the 80's and earlier knew the clutch cables broke a lot.

Most modern bikes with cable operated clutches have clutch cables that usually last a lot longer.

I haven't had a clutch cable break on any 90's and later bikes I have owned

With more reliable clutches, the safety benefits of being ready to escape a threat from behind changed the recommended practice.

 

[dravnx]

And now you know the rest of the story.

 

[ScottRNelson]

I'd always been told when driving a car that riding the clutch would prematurely wear the throwout bearing.

I've had a throw-out bearing fail on a dry clutch Ducati ST2. I didn't know that was the issue until it destroyed the clutch slave and I had to ride from San Luis Obispo to Pleasanton (via Highway 1) with a barely working clutch.

Wet clutches have a lubricated throw out bearing, but dry clutch bikes don't.

Shifting into first and taking off when the light turned green has never been a problem on my own bikes. What's notable was when I rented a KTM 790 Adventure R, I stalled it at the light 3 or 4 different times through out the day, when I didn't pay as much attention letting out the clutch; not sure if that bike had a light flywheel so easy to stall or what. Obviously stalling at take off was iffy when I was at the front of the line.

The clutch on the 790R is no different than most other bikes that haven't been modified. When changing something related to the clutch, you'll nearly always improve one thing and make something else worse. That ST2 had a clutch slave that was supposed to make the clutch pull lighter, but the side effect was that it didn't release 100% when pulled all the way in, so neutral was hard to find when stopped. After I wrecked the slave I put a stock one back in. Slightly harder pull, but neutral was easier to find.

 

[motomania2007]

My old '96 900SS Duc ate clutch throwout bearings regularly. Luckily, I found a cheap source and just replaced them regularly. It was cheaper than having the push rod converted to a drill bit that spun it's way through the piston of the clutch slave cylinder.

 

[sk8norcal]

not sure if that bike had a light flywheel so easy to stall or what. Obviously stalling at take off was iffy when I was at the front of the line.

stalling is even more dangerous than being in neutral!
DCT for everyone!

Just kidding everyone, don't get out the pitchforks.

P.S.: I just remembered - that rented KTM had a Camel ADV one-finger clutch kit, which was consisted of a longer actuation lever at the engine end. .

i didn't know camel makes a 1 finger clutch, just ordered a righteous "stunt" lever for my drz, my poor weak index finger gets tired quickly at metcalf.

edit: i looked up the camel clutch release arm, ok I remembered that now, a little longer than stock. I actually just ordered a DR650 clutch arm for my DRZ. it's a little bit shorter. The throw on the DRZ is too long. Wish I have a hydraulic clutch...

 

[N4teTheGreat]

I try to keep an eye on cars coming behind me but odds are I'd get rear ended before I had time to react.

When it comes to stops, I generally roll off the throttle and get on the brakes while in gear, then pull the clutch as the engine revs get low and bang on the shifter to get into first.

For emergency stops it's muscle memory pull the clutch as I'm applying pressure to the brakes and just hold the clutch in. Focus is on building and managing brake pressure to stop without crashing in those cases.

 

[NoTraffic]

To the OP's question, one factor to consider is the type of engine and what your redline is. I would say engine braking is a personal thing, I started to do it more frequently after riding for 6-7 yrs. I will engine brake anytime I just need to slow down and not necessarily need to use brakes aggressively. It's all a conditional thing, same as in a car.

Same applies if I am coming down a hill, nothing in front of me but a stop sign 100 yards away. If I am in second, I will down shift to first and just use engine braking when I'm 30 yards away. These motors and transmissions are built for it, I do it a lot more with inline 3/4 than parallel engines due to its high rev capacity.

 

[rbrockmeyer]

I've been trying to break the habit of just pulling the clutch and downshifting to first when I'm coming up to a red light. While it's convenient, I worry about the scenario where I need to accelerate to avoid an hazard and get caught out of gear. Could definitely make the situation go from bad to worse.

 

[ST Guy]

I simply use my brakes and as I slow, I’ll also downshift so that no matter how fast I’m going, I’m in the proper gear to quickly accelerate should I find it necessary to do so. When sitting at a light I’ll usually be in first while keeping an eye on the traffic approaching. If enough traffic stops behind me so that I’m as safe as I can be, I may shift to neutral. But I still keep an eye on my 6.

 

[BadStorms]

I really enjoy rev-matching as I downshift. Nothing too aggressive, just a well timed blip and it is so satisfying.