got sandwiched while lane splitting

[Jay600]

on my way to work and I got sandwiched between two cars lane splitting. The driver almost wiped out another rider that was in front of me lane splitting as well but he was lucky enough that there was a gap in between on the left lane beside him to dodge the car. I unfortunately had no where else to go and hit his rear quarter panel and ping ponged in between a van and the idiot driver. luckily I only sustained a bruised knee and a sprained wrist. it could've been worse.

 

[machete]

did the driver say anything to you when he stopped? he stopped yes?

what speed were you going? slow, or moderately fast? I ask, because sometimes I see people get stuck between cars, because they are concentrating too hard on missing the car, and not focusing on their forward movement enough. seen a few people practically come to a stand still between two cars trying to maneuver past.

glad you are fairly okay.

is there anything you would do differently?

is there anything that you saw, leading up to this incident, that you would pass on to people to try and avoid this type of scenario?

 

[Jay600]

the driver stopped. I also had a witness. the witness said the driver was close to hitting his car. it was traffic on the freeway, cars were going about 20-25. I was going about 30-35. i might have going a little bit too fast but I think that's a good speed for lane splitting. there was no way I could avoid it. he just didn't give me enough room. I might have been too close to the other rider to react. I shouldn't have followed him to closely. that was a mistake right there

 

[HIglesias]

how far ahead were you looking? if you saw that he was closing the gap before you got there you might have been able to avoid it. OR, did he suddenly move over when you were already there?

 

[Flying Pig]

It's kind of a double edged sword. I feel safer being between cars than if there is an open space for a car to move into figuring that most cars see other cars pretty well. But if they start to drift inwards, my only exits are gas or brake. I try to not spend more than 2-3 seconds between cars, and never right next to them. Either stay far enough back where you can hit the brakes, or far enough forward where you can gas it out.

 

[Ironbutt]

I have this feeling you were a little too close to the rider in front of you.

You can't properly SEE or SPIDE if there's a rider directly in front of you or even several car lengths ahead.

Scan
predict
identify
decide
execute

 

[AOW]

the driver stopped. (1)i might have going a little bit too fast but I think that's a good speed for lane splitting. (2)there was no way I could avoid it. (3)he just didn't give me enough room. (4)I might have been too close to the other rider to react. (5)I shouldn't have followed him to closely. that was a mistake right there

Numbers 1, 4, & 5 all negate #2, "there was no way I could avoid it".

3. it is up to YOU to create the space/room you needed to be and feel safe. Sometimes that may mean NOT lane splitting for a mile or so.
When splitting behind another cycle, there is a fine line between being too close and not close enough. The distance you allowed between you and the cycle in front of you gave you the comfort zone to avoid a collision with that rider, but also gave the illusion of enough room for the idiot cager.

Nice to hear you are O.K., assuming your were ATGATT

 

[Darwin]

traffic on the freeway, cars were going about 20-25. I was going about 30-35. i might have going a little bit too fast but I think that's a good speed for lane splitting.

Your experience is contrary to your opinion.

Agree with other poster, several issues with not leaving enough room. Especially at the speeds you're going, not much time to react to a hazard that is only inches away. Slow down, leave yourself more space, consider not lane sharing at those speeds.

If you truly believe there is no way you could avoid it, then I would suggest you stop riding. History is rich with lessons. But those who do not learn from history are bound to repeat it. Next time you might not be so lucky.

 

[splat]

It is up to you yo ensure that you can safely navigate between vehicles without breaking any laws. To say that you couldn't avoid it, then to say that he didn't give you enough room doesn't seem reasonable at all.

If he almost wiped out another rider, and that rider barely missed a collision, and in the same instance you were taken out by the same car, at 25mph, it could safely be assumed that you were following too closely.

Did the driver do an evasive maneuver? What about the one in the van? Are you going to file against his insurance company? What did you learn, and what would you do to avoid a similar incident like this in the future?

 

[SlideSF]

It's kind of a double edged sword. I feel safer being between cars than if there is an open space for a car to move into figuring that most cars see other cars pretty well. But if they start to drift inwards, my only exits are gas or brake. I try to not spend more than 2-3 seconds between cars, and never right next to them. Either stay far enough back where you can hit the brakes, or far enough forward where you can gas it out.

You might feel safer between two cars, but you aren't. I like to spend as little time between vehicles as I can. If there is a gap in front of either car big enough for a car to change lanes into, then you can occupy it yourself. This is often the problem splitting when traffic is at more than a standstill or slow/go. The spaces between cars in the same lanes widens, and other cars want to move over, thinking they'll have a better chance in another lane. And that's about the point I decide it's better to get in a lane and go with traffic. Stay near the line, and you can always split again if traffic bogs or if someone comes up too fast or close behind you.

 

[smm]

Since everyone else is beating on you about following the other rider too closely, I'll jump on the speed issue. 35mph is (or was, I haven't read the handbook in quite awhile) a CHP guideline for maximum speed when lane splitting. And a 10mph delta is also toward the maximum end of the scale. A slower delta gives you more time to evaluate the situation ahead of you (and gives drivers more time to notice you). A slower absolute speed means that lateral acceleration (the motion that produces a "squeeze") happens slower.

Aside from a 2011 join date, you don't mention your experience level. If you're just starting out, I think a 20 mph limit with a 5mph delta for the first year or so is much more prudent. That speed collects the lion's share of the benefit while exposing you to roughly 30% of the force should things go wrong.

 

[sanjuro]

Numbers 1, 4, & 5 all negate #2, "there was no way I could avoid it".

3. it is up to YOU to create the space/room you needed to be and feel safe. Sometimes that may mean NOT lane splitting for a mile or so.
When splitting behind another cycle, there is a fine line between being too close and not close enough. The distance you allowed between you and the cycle in front of you gave you the comfort zone to avoid a collision with that rider, but also gave the illusion of enough room for the idiot cager.

Nice to hear you are O.K., assuming your were ATGATT

BTW, riders can never create space for themselves. You should seek it out, but don't expect cars to cut you a break.

 

[DefyInertia]

Thanks for posting your experience.

So were you hard on the brakes when you made impact?

Sucks that the driver made a move like that, but that happens a lot each day on our highways...you either avoid it or you don't (not claiming that I would have, just saying).

 

[Jay600]

I braked hard enough not to lock up the wheel but as soon as the other rider dodge the car, I already knew I was gonna hit him. I just couldn't react quick enough. things I would've done differently is prolly keep my distance if I'm lane splitting behind another rider so I can see obstacles ahead of me to give myself time to react and go a little slower. as soon as that rider dodge that car, I literally had a couple of seconds to see what I was dealing with when it was too late. but I've held my m1 for a few years. been on and off of riding. and I forgot my other password on my other account so I made a new one.

 

[Jay600]

and the driver never made an evasive maneuver after almost hitting the other rider. the van I got sandwiched in-between braked when the rider cut him. I've already contacted my insurance. just waiting for them to contact me. but I will use this as a learning experience and everyone's cmoments, opinions helped me out on what I should and shouldn't do. apreciate it!!

 

[Pking]

I was told by a leo (biker chp) that if traffic is at a standstill, you should split no more than 5 to 10mph. If traffic is moving less than 20mph, you should split no more than 5 to 7 mph over the flow of traffic. He said that way you have a better chance of either stopping or at least be able to maneuver away from cager too close to the line. Splitting 30mph or more gives you almost a zero chance to avoid a crash, plus you come up so quickly on cagers who want to change lanes, that they don't recognize you in time.

 

[sanjuro]

Following is always a dangerous proposition. Put it this way: if you were caging it, would you follow another car with less than a half second reaction time on a road with 12 inches of clearance?

As for how I split, I approach slow, pass quick.

The problem with splitting at high speeds is how badly you get hurt.

 

[thenewwazoo]

where did this happen?

 

[iehawk]

the driver stopped. I also had a witness. the witness said the driver was close to hitting his car. it was traffic on the freeway, cars were going about 20-25. I was going about 30-35. i might have going a little bit too fast but I think that's a good speed for lane splitting. there was no way I could avoid it. he just didn't give me enough room. I might have been too close to the other rider to react. I shouldn't have followed him to closely. that was a mistake right there

I think the better way to see it is to treat lanesharing like crossing an open intersection, you wait until there's space on the other side before crossing, because you don't want to end up at the intersection. Yes, that means having more space between you and the bike in front of you, but it emphasizes more on making sure that you have a space to go after passing between the 2 cars, instead of hanging in between them longer than you need to be.

I do agree that there's time where you're somewhere in between that there's nothing you can do if one car 'decides' to close over, maybe not realizing there's a car next to him/her let alone there's a bike between them. It happened to me once where one side drifted and closing the gap fast; luckily the driver realized he was drifting over and corrected his line.

When the traffic is slower or slowing down, it's actually even more dangerous, especially when the difference of speed between the 2 lanes are significant. This is when one should pay attention to cars that would 'jump' for a quick pass, trying to figure out which lane is faster for them.

Anyway, it's a very volatile situation. Glad you're okay and it means one lesson to learn from.

 

[kurth83]

Sorry you got hit dude.

I admit I am a chicken when it comes to splitting. If I have to be moving faster than about 25 I don't split, 35 mph is too scary for me.

I once followed a guy while splitting (a long split on 17, big accident), and I noticed that cagers would move into the split area after a bike had passed, like they had moved way to the right for a police car and then felt compelled to move back into their lane as far as they could.

So I never follow anyone closely when splitting now.