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Honda Elite running problem

Petelite

Petelite

I broke it :-(
Joined
May 4, 2009
Location
DC
Moto(s)
SV, DR, electric ZX6e
1987 Honda Elite 150. 14000 miles and pretty ratty. This problem is odd and difficult to explain, so bear with me.

Example: scooter is running great, then I let off the gas and compression brake to a stop. Nine times out of ten it's fine, but one time out of ten the moment I let off the gas the compression braking is much stronger than normal, and the scooter vibrates a lot more. When I accelerate again, power is down by half, and the top speed is 35 mph. The engine heats up as well. But, if I shut off the engine and start it again seconds later, it rides like normal.

This only occurs on longer rides (10+ miles, this is long for a scooter) It never occurs while cruising, only when I let the throttle all the way off.

Any ideas? Pic for fun:

81a7253c.jpg
 
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I'm an idiot and don't know anything, so disregard this idea:

Could the centrifugal clutch be sticking? Rust on the springs or on the bosses (that the weights rotate on) might not permit the weights to fully return to resting position as the scoot decelerates. Or maybe the drive face and driven face are sticking together, but that would probably cause an outright stall...

Guess I just proved my earlier claim. Good luck!
 
barlow said:
I'm an idiot and don't know anything, so disregard this idea:

Could the centrifugal clutch be sticking? Rust on the springs or on the bosses (that the weights rotate on) might not permit the weights to fully return to resting position as the scoot decelerates. Or maybe the drive face and driven face are sticking together, but that would probably cause an outright stall...

Guess I just proved my earlier claim. Good luck!
Click to expand...

Actually that's a good suggestion. It has a centrifugal clutch and a variator, so even if the variator didn't come down to the low ratio the centrifugal clutch would release and the engine wouldn't stall. But I figure if the variator was sticking, the engine would be screaming at 35 mph, which it's not - it stops accelerating like it's out of power.

I'm riding without the variator cover now, so the next time it occurs, I'll check the pulleys. Thanks! :thumbup
 
Here's where i come screeching in on my 1986 150cc Honda Elite and crash into your garage cause the rear brake is in the wrong place! AGGGGHHHHH!!! "BOOOM"
 
Petelite, any luck with the variator? Did anything look amiss when you removed the cover?

I thought of something else that might cause your symptoms, but I have no idea if it's even mechanically possible, especially in an intermittent fashion. If the exhaust valve does not fully open, the engine would have to work harder during the exhaust stroke to evacuate the chamber (increased engine braking) and you would see reduced power. But I don't know if it's possible for a valve to not fully open without having things like bent rocker arms, broken tappet adjusters, etc. Valves that fail to fully close would give you a reduction in engine braking, but that's not what you described.

Just a thought.
 
Dude- the reason he's having problems is cause he's riding without that cover! :laughing

barlow said:
Petelite, any luck with the variator? Did anything look amiss when you removed the cover?

I thought of something else that might cause your symptoms, but I have no idea if it's even mechanically possible, especially in an intermittent fashion. If the exhaust valve does not fully open, the engine would have to work harder during the exhaust stroke to evacuate the chamber (increased engine braking) and you would see reduced power. But I don't know if it's possible for a valve to not fully open without having things like bent rocker arms, broken tappet adjusters, etc. Valves that fail to fully close would give you a reduction in engine braking, but that's not what you described.

Just a thought.
Click to expand...
 
Yeah, the brakes on this thing suck, a cable driven front drum is nothing like hydraulic dual disks, and that dumb foot pedal is hard to control wheelies with. :thumbdown (I've totally wheelied this thing!) :thumbup

All this talk makes me want a real bike again...

Today I pulled the top of the carb off, and the vacuum piston diaphragm thingy is fine, so the problem I linked to in post #2 isn't the issue.

I haven't ridden it enough to create the problem yet - I should be able tomorrow. I'll check the variator then and post back.
 
barlow said:
Petelite, any luck with the variator? Did anything look amiss when you removed the cover?

I thought of something else that might cause your symptoms, but I have no idea if it's even mechanically possible, especially in an intermittent fashion. If the exhaust valve does not fully open, the engine would have to work harder during the exhaust stroke to evacuate the chamber (increased engine braking) and you would see reduced power. But I don't know if it's possible for a valve to not fully open without having things like bent rocker arms, broken tappet adjusters, etc. Valves that fail to fully close would give you a reduction in engine braking, but that's not what you described.

Just a thought.
Click to expand...

I should check the valves, they're a bit clattery and it backfires sometimes, but this isn't new on old worn out Hondas :p
 
Welp I took it up Empire Grade at several hundred mph and was unable to recreate the problem. I'll try again when/if it gets hotter today :ride


f9eee6ca.jpg
 
Several hundred mph? Awesome. I want one of those scooters!
 
Ironbutt said:
Here's where i come screeching in on my 1986 150cc Honda Elite and crash into your garage cause the rear brake is in the wrong place! AGGGGHHHHH!!! "BOOOM"
Click to expand...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't those all have a right foot rear brake pedal? I see one in the OP's photo.
 
cynner said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't those all have a right foot rear brake pedal? I see one in the OP's photo.
Click to expand...

Exactly right, and isn't that in the wrong place? It's caused me many calamity.

Actually I DO like that you can lock the rear brake on and not worry about it rolling off the kickstand.

Edit: I guess it's the same-ish as all (most) motorcycle rear brakes, but the position is really awkward, and you kinda have to pick up your whole leg to put your foot on it.
 
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