Interesting "risky business" article in latest MCN (USA)...specifics on HD and BMW...

[GAJ]

and generalities about "all other" brands as HD and BMW evidently are the only two brands with some detail available from the FHTSA's FARS (Fatal Accident Reporting System.

2012 Moto Deaths per 1000 units:

BMW = .24
HD = .55
All others = .46

2012 Moto Deaths involving .01-.07% alcohol:

HD = 8.9%
All Others = 9.1%

2012 Moto Deaths involving .08%+ alcohol:

HD = 38.4%
All Others = 26.4%

2012 Moto Deaths involving any alcohol:

HD = 47.3%
All Others = 35.5%

"However, it is worth noting
that the BMW rate is notably lower—less than that
for drivers of heavy trucks,
about the same as sports car
racing participants (SCCA),
and only 60% greater than
all vehicle operators as a
group (including automobile drivers). Unfortunately,
the difference between Harley-Davison and all others is
statistically significant.
I looked at motorcycle
single-vehicle crashes and
crashes involving motorcycles and other vehicles
and did not find significant
make-to-make differences.
Single-vehicle motorcycle fatal crashes
are about 70% of all fatal crashes involv
ing motorcycles."


http://neobmwclub.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/motorcycle-consumer-news-article-may-2014-issue.pdf

 

[Abyss]

Where's DataDan to explain this in a way my monkey brain can comprehend?

 

[GAJ]

Where's DataDan to explain this in a way my monkey brain can comprehend?

That half of HD moto deaths involve alcohol set me back a bit to be honest.

But, then again, 9 times out of 10 if I see a moto outside a bar it's an HD.

As to lower fatality rates for BMW riders...more conservative riders on more conservative bikes most with ABS, (the S1000rr notwithstanding) ???

I've owned three BMW's; the only one I hated had ABS.

 

[VicTim]

I think if you throw all the bikes together the fatality rate is about 50% for drinking alcohol. This doesn't surprise me.

 

[kongjie]

[insert your quip about BMWs not running long enough to kill their owners here]

 

[Archimedes]

And I'll bet if you adjust that for mileage the BMW rate would be even farther from the average, as the average BMW sees more miles than most other makes.

 

[Cincinnatus]

[Insert quip about HDs] is more like it.

1906 verse about HDs:

"Harley-Davidsons, made of tin.
Ride them out, and push them in."

 

[redtail]

[Insert quip about HDs] is more like it.

1906 verse about HDs:

"Harley-Davidsons, made of tin.
Ride them out, and push them in."

I thought it went like this:
"You'll never wear out, the Indian Scout, or it's brother the Indian Chief.
They're built like rocks to take hard knocks, it's the Harleys that cause the grief."

 

[VicTim]

I thought it went like this:
"You'll never wear out, the Indian Scout, or it's brother the Indian Chief.
They're built like rocks to take hard knocks, it's the Harleys that cause the grief."

 

[Stormdragon]

You ride a Harley: You ride the best.
You ride a mile: And walk the rest.

 

[WWWobble]

And I'll bet if you adjust that for mileage the BMW rate would be even farther from the average, as the average BMW sees more miles than most other makes.

Talking "HD" can get complicated. Once you get out of the Bay Area, things sort of change. Lots of Harleys, and lots of different Harley rider types.

I just got back from a trip into the states of Nevada, Wyoming, Utah, Colorado, New Mexico and Arizona. LOT'S of HD riders seen, in spite of and temps from 35 to 48F with rain and gusty wind. Talked with a couple different guys with odometers showing well over 100k.

Don't think BMW wins the long mileage award based on what you see in the SF Bay Area. There's a bunch of Harleys out there that are really ridden.

You might ask why... as I do, but that doesn't change the data. There is a sub-group of HD riders that REALLY ride, they are not posers. I dunno how large that subgroup is.... but I suspect it may be larger than we might think.

WWWobble

 

[DataDan]

Where's DataDan to explain this in a way my monkey brain can comprehend?

and generalities about "all other" brands as HD and BMW evidently are the only two brands with some detail available from the FHTSA's FARS (Fatal Accident Reporting System.

2012 Moto Deaths involving .08%+ alcohol:

HD = 38.4%
All Others = 26.4%

Lest we get too smug...

In the Bay Area 2008-2012, rider fatalities on both cruisers and sportbikes were about equally impaired: cruisers 37% @ .08+, sportbikes 36%. "Cruisers" in my analysis included both Harleys and metrics. Harleys alone (which include some full-dress tourers as well as cruisers) were 44% @ .08+. My percentages are going to be higher than MCN's because I ignore those for whom BAC is unreported (12% in this data).

"I looked at motorcycle
single-vehicle crashes and
crashes involving motorcycles and other vehicles
and did not find significant
make-to-make differences.
Single-vehicle motorcycle fatal crashes
are about 70% of all fatal crashes involv
ing motorcycles."

That's just wrong. I have kept track of single/multiple-vehicle fatalities for a long time, and it's been about 45% single-vehicle for years.

 

[Archimedes]

Talking "HD" can get complicated. Once you get out of the Bay Area, things sort of change. Lots of Harleys, and lots of different Harley rider types.

I just got back from a trip into the states of Nevada, Wyoming, Utah, Colorado, New Mexico and Arizona. LOT'S of HD riders seen, in spite of and temps from 35 to 48F with rain and gusty wind. Talked with a couple different guys with odometers showing well over 100k.

Don't think BMW wins the long mileage award based on what you see in the SF Bay Area. There's a bunch of Harleys out there that are really ridden.

You might ask why... as I do, but that doesn't change the data. There is a sub-group of HD riders that REALLY ride, they are not posers. I dunno how large that subgroup is.... but I suspect it may be larger than we might think.

WWWobble

That's why I said relative to the 'average', not relative to HD. I agree, some HDs see big miles. These statistics really aren't very useful if they're not converted to a per mile driven basis.

 

[wakked1]

Curious "all others" mean? I doubt Guzzis have the same crash rates as GXSRs.

 

[NTron3000]

Op describes why 'all other' are lumped together in the... Op.

But seems like the takeaway here is Harley rider are dangerous drunks and, oh, don't drink while doing something technical if a mistake on said technical device can kill you. Oh and couldn't suss it out from the posts but my immediate question is if you take out the booze how does the Moto fatality rate compare to the general (automobile) rate?

 

[mrmarklin]

The Harley Owners Group is largely a riding club. Every dealer sponsors one, and here in the Bay Area there is at least one ride a month for each chapter. It adds up to quite a bit of organized riding.

I'd venture to say HD riders are above average in the mileage category.

 

[Lucky13xx]

Difficult to prove, but I wonder how many riders survived a potentially fatal accident do to a few drinks in the system? That whole to relaxed to resist the impact. Might be extra beneficial in a motorcycle accident. Perhaps we've all been missing a key part in ATGATT.................

 

[GAJ]

Lest we get too smug...

Not smug at all.

Your data and the data presented in the article indicate that at least 1/3 of all riders that die have some alcohol in their system, (about the same as for autos from what I can gather).

I guess that wearing a helmet and not drinking alcohol are the top two things you can do to increase your chances of arriving back home safely after a ride.

 

[BluesCruiser]

I just got back from a trip into the states of Nevada, Wyoming, Utah, Colorado, New Mexico and Arizona.

WWWobble

So? Where's your ride report? Where are the pics??

 

[WWWobble]

So? Where's your ride report? Where are the pics??

Unfortunatley this trip was a "get there, be there" type of deal and I had to take the car. This hurts, because I'm trying to get my FJR past 100,000 miles this year just for "bragging rights" (and maybe to justify getting something new), but family and other requirements came first.

So, no pics. No report. But I saw a shit load of Harleys out there, plus a few BMWs and Goldwings. And one guy on a sport bike in Wyoming in the worst of it, about 35F with good rain and big gusts , but by God he was riding. Couldn't tell which make.

WWWobble