Lane position: blocking?

[ST Guy]

In summary, I tend not to subscribe to any advice that sounds inflexible. There are a thousand ways to get yourself killed and just as many to stay safe.

 

[Bravnik]

I still can't believe people believe it's safer to ride in the right of the #1 lane. The reasoning is that they're more visible. This makes a lot of assumptions:

1. That the driver actually looks.
2. That the driver actually registers in his brain what his eyes see.
3. That the driver actually has their rear view mirrors adjusted properly.

Those are huge assumptions. And what do you give up for that? Your time to react and a buffer zone between you and the brain-dead cagers.

That's a piss poor trade off.

Not really if you think about it. It's only safe to not ride on the right when there is nobody in front of you. If you are in the left lane in traffic then odds are the guy in the number 2 will never see you even if they do look. If they do see you its just before they make their move.

If you ride in the number 1 lane in traffic (I'm not talking where you have a good distance in front of you) riding the center line then cars can see you if they look in their mirrors at all 10+ cars in front of you. It also allows you to see situations before you get up to them and provides you an out if cars come to a halt quickly.

If you're in the number 1 lane in traffic on the left side and traffic comes to a screeching halt your only out is to go onto the left shoulder which is exactly the same thing every car in front of you is thinking.

I'm all about outs and cars seeing me. Hugging the left in the number one lane is only a good idea for me when I have nobody in front of me. By that I mean at least 10+ car lengths or more. Then and only then do I ride hugging the left.

There is more to it than that for sure as I change the way I ride depending on the situation. For example; I will slow down to make room in front of me and move left when approaching a known heavy merge point like approaching the Decoto exit while on 880 during rush hour. This is to protect me from the jumpers I know who will be there.

 

[terdog55]

I still can't believe people believe it's safer to ride in the right of the #1 lane. The reasoning is that they're more visible. This makes a lot of assumptions:

That's a piss poor trade off.

Your the one making assumptions. Im playing the odds. I have no delusions that this is a cage proof method, and I never said it was.

And what do you give up for that? Your time to react and a buffer zone between you and the brain-dead cagers.

Your assumeing that
1-your going to react any faster cause of your location. Somebody coming from your rt rear qtr will be less likely to be seen, as they may be blocked by your blind spot..
2-you have actually DECREASED your buffer zone by the distance between the right and left sides. You buffer to your left is smaller.

The OP is the biggest argument against this method, as I recall him paying the price.

 

[ST Guy]

HOV/Carpool - I will hug the left side of the number one lane only when there is nobody in front of me in the HOV/Carpool lane and the number 2 lane is moving much slower and is more congested. The reason is lane jumpers. When I'm doing 80MPH in the HOV lane and the number 2 is crawling at 50mph I want the distance from the number 2 for jumpers.

Doing this has saved my ass. It gave me the extra fraction of a second to just miss the left rear of his bumper. I was on guard for jumpers, I was too the left of the lane, I was covering my brakes and without all three of those things, I would have been seriousl injured or dead.

 

[ST Guy]

Your assumeing that
1-your going to react any faster cause of your location. Somebody coming from your rt rear qtr will be less likely to be seen, as they may be blocked by your blind spot..
2-you have actually DECREASED your buffer zone by the distance between the right and left sides. You buffer to your left is smaller.

The OP is the biggest argument against this method, as I recall him paying the price.

1: I'm not going to react faster, though it's certainly possible. Being a bit more to the side gives you a better view of their hands on the wheel, the front wheels of the vehicle, and also their head. But all that aside, being to the left doesn't give you any more time to react than being to the right. What it does do, though is give you more space and therefore more time between you and the offending vehicle before contact is made. Think about it. You're riding next to a four door SUV and you're abreast of the rear door. The driver makes a sudden dart to the left. Which position is going to give you more time to react? Riding in the right part of the lane where you might have 4 or 5 feet between you? Or riding in the left part of the lane where you have an additional 6 feet or more? That extra space can make the precious difference between going down or having the space (and time) to get on the brakes or swerve and avoid contact. Or this example: If I'm trying to punch you out, do you have a better chance of dodging my jabs if you're standing within a forearm's length of me or if you're standing within a full arm's reach of me.

2. Sure, the buffer is decreased to the left, but that's more than offset by the buffer to the right. Think about it. If you ride to the right, yes you've increased your buffer to the left, but you're gambling that you'll actually have the time to use it. It's no sure thing, as we all know they'll often just dart out, regardless. Your buffer to the left is not what you think it is because is compromised by the assumption that the driver will see you and therefore not change lanes. The buffer to the left is not all that people think it is.

If you ride to the left, that buffer is always there. Regardless.

And think of this: If someone does lane jump and you have to take evasive maneuvers, are you limited to the lane width? Often not. Regardless, you have a limited amount of space to react in. If someone is lane jumping, they've committed and they're going all the way. So, ride left or ride right, the car's coming over the same distance. And it's going to happen in a split second. They're going to be occuping your space whether you like it or not. So, would you rather be to the right where your time to evade is shorter? Or to the left where you have more time? Is it better to be to the right and have to immediately swerve and then/simultaneously apply your brakes? Or is it better to be to the left and gain some time for straight line braking and then serve if necessary? Which one give you more control of the bike?

One of the failing points of the ride to the right and leave a buffer on the left is the assumption that you'll have the time use that buffer. And what is forgotten is that an evasive manuever performed from the left side of the lane involes less dramatic swerving.

 

[vorhese]

I always ride right-side in the fast lane. You can be seen easier, you don't blend in with the separating wall. And when traffic slows down you can zip into lane-splitting. As for the other lanes, it varies, depending on what traffic is doing. Experience will tell you where to go.

 

[Carlo]

HOV/Carpool - I will hug the left side of the number one lane only when there is nobody in front of me in the HOV/Carpool lane and the number 2 lane is moving much slower and is more congested. The reason is lane jumpers. When I'm doing 80MPH in the HOV lane and the number 2 is crawling at 50mph I want the distance from the number 2 for jumpers.

Doing this has saved my ass. It gave me the extra fraction of a second to just miss the left rear of his bumper. I was on guard for jumpers, I was too the left of the lane, I was covering my brakes and without all three of those things, I would have been seriousl injured or dead.

Man. I would never ride 30 mph faster than the lane next to me unless I was tucked in behind several cars doing the same thing.
In which case, I'd be behind the left side of the car in front of me.
Chances are, that's a really rare situation where the lane you're in can really go 30 mph faster than the next lane over, unless it's the HOV lane.
Even if it was the HOV lane, I wouldn't go that much faster than the next lane without one or more cars running interference for me.

 

[ST Guy]

I always ride right-side in the fast lane. You can be seen easier, you don't blend in with the separating wall. And when traffic slows down you can zip into lane-splitting. As for the other lanes, it varies, depending on what traffic is doing. Experience will tell you where to go.

Again, you're assuming that someone will look and actually see you. Do you think that people somehow magically know you're riding to the right and therefore will have their mirrors adjust properly, actually use their mirror, actually turn their head for another look, and then see you? You're sacrificing reaction time and a buffer zone for the vain hope that someone will actually look properly before darting out. Good luck with that.

As for being positioned for lane splitting, what's the big deal about moving to the right from the left position and then slotting in between the cars. Lane splitting isn't something you generally want to do quickly anyway. The last thing I'm going to do is continue my pace and slip in between the lanes of traffic, just when it suddenly starts to slow ahead. I tried that once many years ago and learned very quickly that the reason things were slowing is that 3 cars ahead, someone had slowed to merge to the right. It's best to wait a few seconds, assess the situation ahead, and then split if it's appropriate. While you're slowing and assessing, you can then be moving to the right if you want.

 

[ST Guy]

Man. I would never ride 30 mph faster than the lane next to me unless I was tucked in behind several cars doing the same thing.
In which case, I'd be behind the left side of the car in front of me.
Chances are, that's a really rare situation where the lane you're in can really go 30 mph faster than the next lane over, unless it's the HOV lane.
Even if it was the HOV lane, I wouldn't go that much faster than the next lane without one or more cars running interference for me.

FYI, the first part of your quoting is not me. And yea, a 30 mph differential is crazy. 10 to 15 can be reasonable. If you're travelling too fast, lane position, readiness, skill, it all becomes useless at some point.

 

[JakesKTM]

My real issue comes from this:

Source: http://www.sgi.sk.ca/pdf/motorcycle/04.pdf

What do you guys/gals say?

I say the rider in that video should have moved the fuck over knowing there was a faster car behind him. I'm not sure why people in the fast lane seem to think that they have the right to that lane so long as they are going the speed limit?

Riding nearest the lane dividers is always best IMO. No matter what lane, it gives you the ability to switch lanes and clear out from in front of asshats, or get around them.

 

[flying_hun]

I tend to ride in the center of the lane no matter what lane I'm in.

center has more debris and oil/grease/car drippings.

That's the one part of the lane I almost never ride in, especially in heavy traffic.

 

[vorhese]

Again, you're assuming that someone will look and actually see you. Do you think that people somehow magically know you're riding to the right and therefore will have their mirrors adjust properly, actually use their mirror, actually turn their head for another look, and then see you? You're sacrificing reaction time and a buffer zone for the vain hope that someone will actually look properly before darting out. Good luck with that..

If you're in the left side, and a car is coming over, where are you going to go? Into the wall. If you're in the right, you have a buffer to make a arc and power forward and away. Being in the left side of the lane also makes cars mistake you for an open lane. And it feels icky.

 

[GAJ]

While "blocking" can be effective and a good thing to practice in certain situation, there are certainly plenty of times that it's not. I generally don't follow that advice as I think that keeping as much space between yourself and the braindead people out there is the best defense.

And when I'm in the #1 lane, I'm almost always riding to the left. Doing so surely saved my ass more than once.

 

[flying_hun]

First, realize that Canadian drivers are better than US drivers.

I just got back and I'm not convinced of that. There's plenty of driving suckage in both countries.

 

[Carlo]

FYI, the first part of your quoting is not me. And yea, a 30 mph differential is crazy. 10 to 15 can be reasonable. If you're travelling too fast, lane position, readiness, skill, it all becomes useless at some point.

Yeah, I know that wasn't you who originally said it. That's why I included the original post you were replying to.

 

[GAJ]

Actually, we can all agree that we will NOT all agree on that being the strongest plan.

Ride like you're invisible. They won't see you no matter WTF you do, so why on earth would you pretend they will?

That's exactly right.

BTW, your post from the California Handbook had nothing to do with "blocking" but dealt completely with lane sharing and why it's not a good idea for anyone!

So the Canadian info was drivel as is that particular piece of "advice" from the California handbook.

 

[GAJ]

If you're in the left side, and a car is coming over, where are you going to go? Into the wall. If you're in the right, you have a buffer to make a arc and power forward and away. Being in the left side of the lane also makes cars mistake you for an open lane. And it feels icky.

What nonsense.

If you're in the leftmost part of the HOV lane you have SPACE as ST Guy pointed out.

Space = Time to "arc" as you say or power forward, or brake...even if it means powering forward past a car that you are using as a "blocker."

Riding in the center, as someone suggested not only blocks your vision the most, (especially if the vehicle in front is tall), but gives you the perfect opportunity to brake on oil, maximizing your chances of a crash, swerve on oil, again maximizing your chances for a crash, but also the highest probability of riding over some debris.

We're all invisible and therefore choosing a lane position that maximizes your space and vision are your best bet.

Sure, if the traffic is very light and you're in the fast lane riding to the right side of the lane, (until you are about to pass a car, which is when you move left), is perfectly fine.

Heavy traffic?

No.

 

[Tharkûn]

I ride so far to the left of the #1 lane, theres been numerous times someone has lane changed me and I didn't have to do any changes to my direction or speed. Just rode the yellow line and had plenty of room as I passed them during their lane change, even if they had nearly completed it.

 

[flying_hun]

I ride so far to the left of the #1 lane, theres been numerous times someone has lane changed me and I didn't have to do any changes to my direction or speed. Just rode the yellow line and had plenty of room as I passed them during their lane change, even if they had nearly completed it.

It's always good to get input from a guy who knows what the hell he's talking about.

 

[Tharkûn]

It's always good to get input from a guy who knows what the hell he's talking about.

For one, I don't understand why it seems the number 1 rule of motorcycling is 'ride like you're invisible', then the only basis for riding in the right side of the #1 is to try to become more visible?

During motorschool they draw a four lane freeway up on the board and ask, how many lanes do you see? Even with a 'wide' bike like an RT you can turn that into 16, even more when you utilize the shoulders. I've said this before but always be prepared to cross that yellow line if you need to when avoiding a lane change or a quick stop.