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Lane Sharing on an MP3 cycle? Yes or no?

jimboecv said:
Thanks everyone. I don't have time to digest this whole thread now, but one customer in particular pointed out that an M1 is designed for a two wheeled vehicle, not three, so he's thinking he needs a C endorsement.
Remember scooter folks ain't hard-core two-wheeled addicts and are generally very, very concerned for legality and safety. Thanks again, it's all helpful.
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. . . :rofl
 
Anyone remember these guys?

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vespa_mod300px.jpg
 
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Nick said:
Is it even possible to get an M1 without an A, B, or C class license? I've always heard it as an "M1 endorsement."
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It's possible, yes, but the DMV doesn't like it. In fact, I planned on doing so but at first the employee claimed I couldn't, and then when I came back with a printout from their web site saying I could they said it was some test that nobody there had given. You have to ride around the block while they watch in order to show you know how to use turn signals, as well as the standard written test.


I think that an M1 should be enough for an MP3, but a C should be required for a sidecar. Why? Because an MP3 is ridden like a motorcycle/scooter, whereas a sidecar is much more like a car (or so I've heard, in both cases). I know I tried to ride a bicycle with a sidecar and couldn't get the damn thing to turn without thinking REALLY hard about just turning the bars in the right direction. Of course, that doesn't mean that the law agrees with that or that it would be easy to implement.
 
Junkie said:
It's possible, yes, but the DMV doesn't like it. In fact, I planned on doing so but at first the employee claimed I couldn't, and then when I came back with a printout from their web site saying I could they said it was some test that nobody there had given. You have to ride around the block while they watch in order to show you know how to use turn signals, as well as the standard written test.


I think that an M1 should be enough for an MP3, but a C should be required for a sidecar. Why? Because an MP3 is ridden like a motorcycle/scooter, whereas a sidecar is much more like a car (or so I've heard, in both cases). I know I tried to ride a bicycle with a sidecar and couldn't get the damn thing to turn without thinking REALLY hard about just turning the bars in the right direction. Of course, that doesn't mean that the law agrees with that or that it would be easy to implement.
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+1


i was told when i was 16 that to get my M1 i HAD to get my C first... *stupid DMV lady*


and the MP3 although it IS a 3 wheeler handles MUCH more like a 2 wheeler then it does a sidecar/trike
 
Oddjob said:
the M1 is a semi-automatic rifle, the M2 is a grenade launcher. I think the license required for a three wheeler is called an MF, or maybe a PMS, something like that.
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:rofl
 
I think its okay to lane share with a Peterbuilt, as long as you do it the right way.
 
Oddjob said:
the M1 is a semi-automatic rifle, the M2 is a grenade launcher. I think the license required for a three wheeler is called an MF, or maybe a PMS, something like that.
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Lemme know when it gets up to MP5, like the one in my collection...:wow
 
NorCalBusa said:
There are no lane sharing laws, that's been covered aud nauseum.
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Sure there are. Even getting past the semantics of 'laws in general that could be applied to lane sharing' this IS a law on the books specifically about lane sharing:

21714. The driver of a vehicle described in subdivision (f) of
Section 27803 shall not do either of the following:
(a) Operate the vehicle in any lane established under Section
21655.5 as an exclusive or preferential use lane for high-occupancy
vehicles.
(b) Operate the vehicle in either of the following:
(1) The area on, or immediately adjacent to, the striping or other
markers designating adjacent traffic lanes.
(2) The area between two or more vehicles that are traveling in
adjacent traffic lanes.

27803 is the helmet law...for reference:

27803. (a) A driver and any passenger shall wear a safety helmet
meeting requirements established pursuant to Section 27802 when
riding on a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle, or motorized bicycle.
(b) It is unlawful to operate a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle, or
motorized bicycle if the driver or any passenger is not wearing a
safety helmet as required by subdivision (a).
(c) It is unlawful to ride as a passenger on a motorcycle,
motor-driven cycles, or motorized bicycle if the driver or any
passenger is not wearing a safety helmet as required by subdivision
(a).
(d) This section applies to persons who are riding on motorcycles,
motor-driven cycles, or motorized bicycles operated on the highways.
(e) For the purposes of this section, "wear a safety helmet" or
"wearing a safety helmet" means having a safety helmet meeting the
requirements of Section 27802 on the person's head that is fastened
with the helmet straps and that is of a size that fits the wearing
person's head securely without excessive lateral or vertical
movement.
(f) This section does not apply to a person operating, or riding
as a passenger in, a fully enclosed three-wheeled motor vehicle that
is not less than seven feet in length and not less than four feet in
width, and has an unladen weight of 900 pounds or more, if the
vehicle meets or exceeds all of the requirements of this code, the
Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards, and the rules and regulations
adopted by the United States Department of Transportation and the
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.
(g) In enacting this section, it is the intent of the Legislature
to ensure that all persons are provided with an additional safety
benefit while operating or riding a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle,
or motorized bicycle.


These laws were enacted because of the Corbin Sparrow, which is registered as a motorcycle.
 
Traq said:
Sure there are. Even getting past the semantics of 'laws in general that could be applied to lane sharing' this IS a law on the books specifically about lane sharing:

21714. The driver of a vehicle described in subdivision (f) of
Section 27803 shall not do either of the following:
(a) Operate the vehicle in any lane established under Section
21655.5 as an exclusive or preferential use lane for high-occupancy
vehicles.
(b) Operate the vehicle in either of the following:
(1) The area on, or immediately adjacent to, the striping or other
markers designating adjacent traffic lanes.
(2) The area between two or more vehicles that are traveling in
adjacent traffic lanes.

27803 is the helmet law...for reference:

27803. (a) A driver and any passenger shall wear a safety helmet
meeting requirements established pursuant to Section 27802 when
riding on a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle, or motorized bicycle.
(b) It is unlawful to operate a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle, or
motorized bicycle if the driver or any passenger is not wearing a
safety helmet as required by subdivision (a).
(c) It is unlawful to ride as a passenger on a motorcycle,
motor-driven cycles, or motorized bicycle if the driver or any
passenger is not wearing a safety helmet as required by subdivision
(a).
(d) This section applies to persons who are riding on motorcycles,
motor-driven cycles, or motorized bicycles operated on the highways.
(e) For the purposes of this section, "wear a safety helmet" or
"wearing a safety helmet" means having a safety helmet meeting the
requirements of Section 27802 on the person's head that is fastened
with the helmet straps and that is of a size that fits the wearing
person's head securely without excessive lateral or vertical
movement.
(f) This section does not apply to a person operating, or riding
as a passenger in, a fully enclosed three-wheeled motor vehicle that
is not less than seven feet in length and not less than four feet in
width, and has an unladen weight of 900 pounds or more, if the
vehicle meets or exceeds all of the requirements of this code, the
Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards, and the rules and regulations
adopted by the United States Department of Transportation and the
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.
(g) In enacting this section, it is the intent of the Legislature
to ensure that all persons are provided with an additional safety
benefit while operating or riding a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle,
or motorized bicycle.


These laws were enacted because of the Corbin Sparrow, which is registered as a motorcycle.
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First of all, this law only applies to three wheeled enclosed vehicles (like the Corbin Sparrow). It prohibits using the HOV lanes, wearing helmets, and lane sharing, which are allowed and required sections for 2 wheeled motorcycles. There are no lane sharing laws for 2 wheeled motor cycles. Also, I think this law dates back longer than the Corbin Sparrow. Cushman and other companied like it made 3 wheeled enclosed vehicles used for parking enforcement long before Corbin that would fall under the definition of a motorcycle.

Traq said:
What code would you cite?
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27803(a)/(b) V.C. The helmet law. :rolleyes The MP3 cycle is not enclosed, so therefore the helmet law applies.
 
Starshooter10 said:
i was told when i was 16 that to get my M1 i HAD to get my C first... *stupid DMV lady*
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I think if you're under 18 in california you do, or at least have to go through the driver training they require of under 18 drivers before you can get your M1. Not sure, but it's been discussed on here before.
 
Traq said:
What code would you cite?
Click to expand...

bojangle said:
First of all, this law only applies to three wheeled enclosed vehicles (like the Corbin Sparrow). It prohibits using the HOV lanes, wearing helmets, and lane sharing, which are allowed and required sections for 2 wheeled motorcycles. There are no lane sharing laws for 2 wheeled motor cycles. Also, I think this law dates back longer than the Corbin Sparrow. Cushman and other companied like it made 3 wheeled enclosed vehicles used for parking enforcement long before Corbin that would fall under the definition of a motorcycle.



27803(a)/(b) V.C. The helmet law. :rolleyes The MP3 cycle is not enclosed, so therefore the helmet law applies.
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What he said ^^^:thumbup
 
bojangle said:
First of all, this law only applies to three wheeled enclosed vehicles (like the Corbin Sparrow). It prohibits using the HOV lanes, wearing helmets, and lane sharing, which are allowed and required sections for 2 wheeled motorcycles. There are no lane sharing laws for 2 wheeled motor cycles.
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First of all, the quoted posted I was responding to stated flat out that there are NO laws that cover lane sharing. I was merely pointing out that there is, in fact, a law regarding lane sharing. Two wheeled/3 wheeled/enclosed/open are all irrelevant. The fact is that there IS a law on the books about lane sharing, but yes, you are correct that that law only covers a specific type of vehicle registered as a motorcycle. I never implied that it did not.

bojangle said:
Also, I think this law dates back longer than the Corbin Sparrow. Cushman and other companied like it made 3 wheeled enclosed vehicles used for parking enforcement long before Corbin that would fall under the definition of a motorcycle.
Click to expand...

You are incorrect. AB1029 in the 1997 session amended the helmet law to add this exemption.

This bill would exempt from the definition of motorcycle specified
above a fully enclosed 3-wheeled motor vehicle that is commonly
known as a "Sparrow." The bill would thereby exempt the specified
vehicle from the safety helmet requirement specified above.
Click to expand...


bojangle said:
27803(a)/(b) V.C. The helmet law. :rolleyes

The MP3 cycle is not enclosed, so therefore the helmet law applies.
Click to expand...

Is there a need to include the condescending eyeroll when answering a simple question? It was a valid question since it has been covered in this thread that an MP3 is not registered as a motorcycle and does not require a motorcycle endorsement to operate.

The question rephrased is, if it is not classed as a motorcycle, motor-driven cycle, or motorized bicycle, then why does 27803 apply?

I'll answer my own question from my own research on it now though...it is classified as a motorcycle even if it is not registered as a motorcycle.

It's pathetic that being polite and non-condescending was beyond you. :rolleyes
 
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saw an mp3 sharing yesterday morning on 80, it was doing fine, no wider than a goldwing.
 
I would be concerned that the extra width of the thing would possibly make the thing too wide to laneshare safely. Especially since buyers of the three wheeled thingie are probably not experienced motorcyclers, and lanesharing, as we all know, is a skills-intensive activity.
 
Traq said:
You are incorrect. AB1029 in the 1997 session amended the helmet law to add this exemption.
Click to expand...

Ok, I stand corrected on that one. I didn't know the Sparrow was the reason for the law. Only that there were other vehicles on the road long before the Sparrow that were also effected by the same law.
 
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