Negotiating with private seller without blowing the deal

ToAdventure · Apr 1, 2015

You've all given me a lot of great advice and I am VERY grateful.
I've shifted my search from dealers to private parties and have found a bike that seems perfect for me. I'd love your input on how I should handle the negotiation process with the seller without being off putting. Here are the plain facts:

*I'm newly licensed
* I am approved for a motorcycle loan for $3000

( I realize now that I should have asked for more but I was delusional and thought I could get something for 2500 all in)

* The asking price of the bike is 4000.
* It's a Ninja 250 with less than 2k miles
* Multiple upgrades : Slip on, Sliders, LED Tail lights

It's beautiful. I love it.

I'm taking my brother with me, just so I don't get too excited and agree to sell my first born just so I can have a test drive.

But I'm worried. As I mentioned, I'm new to this. It's more than I intended to spend ( But not more than I can afford) and I think the fact that the seller has to go the bank might be off putting.

So my question is this:

What's the best way to approach this? The seller is asking for 4k because they want 4k. If I offer 3k is that insulting? What about 3500? My initial reaction is to just lay it all out :

"Hey man, I am in love with this bike. It's what I have dreamed of.
I can easily do 3000."

If he says no, I could come back with 3500, .. go from there. I DO have some cash I can give to supplement the loan .. I'm just trying to stay within what my initial budget was. I have learned now that NADA and KBB are more of an advisory than a absolute but they have retail priced as 2800-3700. Surely the seller has some wiggle room?

And then.... We come to the loan nonsense. My bank requires him to come in and sign the papers over at the branch. Which, luckily is not TOO far away. But I can see how he might want to hold out and wait for someone else to show up with cash.

Any advice would be appreciated. I know that I'm already overly excited about it and am having a hard time having the " If its not this one it will be another attitude."

Oh and since I have yet to address it... I know a lot of people have said that I should save money and pay out right.. I know that I will get flak for this but.. I don't want to. I'm currently in flight school and I save the majority of the money I earn ( That does not go to bills ) for flight time and I know that trying to save for a motorcycle would drag the process of experiencing both riding and flying out by quite a bit. Plus.. I'm hoping to use the bike as a commuter.

Cincinnatus · Apr 1, 2015

Just slightly off-topic, but have you considered asking the bank to increase the loan amount?

Have you budgeted for gear and insurance?

russ69 · Apr 1, 2015

Old guy here. My best advice is to save up your money until you can pay cash. There are a lot of bikes out there and shopping will be better in the fall/winter.

P.S. Concentrate on your training, bikes can come later.

aminalmutha · Apr 1, 2015

Can't tell you if $4k is a "good" price or not because we don't know how old it is, condition or mileage. Personally, I think $4k for a Ninjo 250 is absurd no matter the age/condition/mileage.

I'd offer him $1500 and a boot to the nuts, personally. Won't happen, but I'd definitely go lower or just pass on a-holes asking too much money.

Oh, and another pro-tip: "upgrades" don't add value to the bike. They actually detract in most cases. You want a bike close to stock as possible unless you're trying to get a race bike or something. And in those cases, re-sale values are abysmal, but that's another story.

ToAdventure · Apr 1, 2015

I have priced insurance and already have all my gear.

And, I KNOW that it would be better to save and wait. But.. to be honest. I don't want to.
I'm tired of riding on the back, The weather is amazing now, I want to use it to commute and.. as I mentioned, I'm in flight school. Paying a monthly note for insurance is a lot different than trying to save a large amount of money to buy a bike outright.

ToAdventure · Apr 1, 2015

aminalmutha said:
Can't tell you if $4k is a "good" price or not because we don't know how old it is, condition or mileage. Personally, I think $4k for a Ninjo 250 is absurd no matter the age/condition/mileage.

I'd offer him $1500 and a boot to the nuts, personally. Won't happen, but I'd definitely go lower or just pass on a-holes asking too much money.

Oh, and another pro-tip: "upgrades" don't add value to the bike. They actually detract in most cases. You want a bike close to stock as possible unless you're trying to get a race bike or something. And in those cases, re-sale values are abysmal, but that's another story.

It's a 2011 Ninja 250 with less than 2000 miles. I think it's a lot too- but
I posted a question about getting a 250 for 2,500 and most responses said I was delusional.

ToAdventure · Apr 1, 2015

So what's a good starting point then? 3k? I don't want him to feel like I am low balling him and then get pissed and not want to sell me the bike.

boilovepho · Apr 1, 2015

id start at 3500

stan23 · Apr 1, 2015

I'm probably better equipped to answer this question than 90% of the people here, as I buy and sell a lot of bikes.

As a seller, if i'm asking $4K, you don't want to email me $3K as that will get you on my instant ignore list.

Don't talk price -- yet. Go see the bike, talk to the owner, feel him out. If it is indeed everything he says it is and your gut feeling is telling you to go for it, then ask him if he is reasonably negotiable. Don't just blurt out this is what I have-take it or leave it. That will turn sour real quick. I've declined to sell a bike to someone for $1 less than what i'm asking because I didn't like the guy.

If you stay within reason, i'm certain a $4K asking price bike can become $3650ish.. But the selling price depends on many variables. Like how many responses the seller has, how soon they need cash, market value, etc...

As for getting the cash from a bank vs. straight cash - i've done those too. It's not a big deal for me as a seller.

mototireguy · Apr 1, 2015

Worth a try bargaining down on the $4k asking price but $3.5k is a stretch.

True a 4yo Ninja 250 might only be worth closer to $3k but you aren't going to magically charm/persuade the seller on this. Don't get bummed out or angry if the seller says thanks but no thanks.

Keep your eyes open for a bike priced at your $3k budget, plenty of other right priced fish in the sea.

aminalmutha · Apr 1, 2015

ToAdventure said:
It's a 2011 Ninja 250 with less than 2000 miles. I think it's a lot too- but
I posted a question about getting a 250 for 2,500 and most responses said I was delusional.

Well, unfortunately, Ninja 250's are highly over rated and therefore over-priced on the used market. EVERY n00b wants one, so there is a higher demand for them than for most particular models. I think you're correct in regards to what they should be priced, but reality may be different.

I know people will call me all sorts of names, but you don't HAVE to start on a 250. I wouldn't recommend a CBR600RR or anything like that, but a GS500 or something like that would probably be fine. I haven't looked lately, but I would be surprised if they were cheaper than Ninja 250's.

aminalmutha · Apr 1, 2015

ToAdventure said:
So what's a good starting point then? 3k? I don't want him to feel like I am low balling him and then get pissed and not want to sell me the bike.

Like someone said, don't make any offers via email. I've sold a bunch of bikes and don't negotiate via phone or email. In person only. If he doesn't take your offer, there are other bikes out there. Don't get attached to one particular bike.

Junkie · Apr 1, 2015

russ69 said:
Old guy here. My best advice is to save up your money until you can pay cash. There are a lot of bikes out there and shopping will be better in the fall/winter.

P.S. Concentrate on your training, bikes can come later.

This.

Full coverage for a new rider won't be cheap. Liability only will cost a hell of a lot less. You'll need full coverage for something financed.

sanjuro · Apr 1, 2015

It is going to be a tough negotiation if you want a seller to come down 25%.

Think of the seller's perspective.

He has a bike which I presume is well maintained with some nice upgrades. If Bluebook range is 2800-3700, that means he expects at least $3700. BTW, if you saw a bike that was priced for $2800, you would see the difference in maintenance.

Most pricing strategy is put up a high price. A sucker may pay that price without negotiation, and it gives even more haggling room.

If this bike is listed for $4000, then his real starting price is probably $3900 and what he will accept is $3800.

From his perspective, this is the bike buying season, especially for beginner bikes. Negotiations also involves other potential buyers. If you do not offer the price he finds acceptable and believes someone else will, what is his incentive to sell at a much lower price?

Usually sellers will only sell 15-20% below their asking price because they are afraid they will be stuck with their bike. It might be the case in November not April.

stan23 · Apr 1, 2015

My biggest tip to a buyer, is just show INITIATIVE.

Emailing me a million basic questions, or a simple take it or leave it offer, is not going to make me bend in your direction.

IF you like something, and the price is within reason, just get the number, pick a public meeting place at their convenience--preferably the same day, have $$ ready and be ready to make the sale.

Most folks are willing to accept a lower price for convenience and a quick painless sale alone.

I've gotten many great deals just because I show up prepared and ready to buy.

aminalmutha · Apr 1, 2015

aminalmutha · Apr 1, 2015

stan23 said:
I've gotten many great deals just because I show up prepared and ready to buy.

Yep. I have literally sold every single bike to the first person who actually showed up and have always got damn near my (fair) asking price with little haggling.

Bach415 · Apr 1, 2015

I agree with that list of cl's ads. Or you can just increase that loan amount and use it towards a brand new 2014 ninja 300. They are going on sale around the bay area and at least you dont need to deal with carbs on those.

RickM · Apr 1, 2015

stan23 said:
My biggest tip to a buyer, is just show INITIATIVE.

Emailing me a million basic questions, or a simple take it or leave it offer, is not going to make me bend in your direction.

IF you like something, and the price is within reason, just get the number, pick a public meeting place at their convenience--preferably the same day, have $$ ready and be ready to make the sale.

Most folks are willing to accept a lower price for convenience and a quick painless sale alone.

I've gotten many great deals just because I show up prepared and ready to buy.

+1

If it's not too far away and you want the bike, just show up and negotiate in person. I think around $3k for the '08-'12 ninja 250 is realistic. Maybe just wait and find one that is listed for under $3.5k. $4k for the 250 is too high imo.

stan23 · Apr 1, 2015

aminalmutha said:
Yep. I have literally sold every single bike to the first person who actually showed up and have always got damn near my (fair) asking price with little haggling.

Exactly. I'm usually FIRM on my pricing since I know the market well and what will something sell for, but I have a soft spot for someone like me who shows initiative.

I got a smoking deal on my R1200GS because I showed initiative.

It was a Saturday morning, the guy was in LA, and I said I can be there in 6 hours. Hopped in the car, and drove to LA right then and there.

Now keep in mind I did feel out the owner, asked him all the pertinent questions, and rolled the dice.

Negotiating with private seller without blowing the deal

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