The reason that gas is so HIGH is because they're EXPORTING gas and oil!!

[afm199]

anyone happen to know why it is that after they are done "drinking our milkshake" that they can't put the byproducts back down the hole?

Oilsands are not drilled. They are strip mined. They just strip the layer of top soil off and then start shelving down. They denude square miles of forest and strip mine down hundreds of feet. The sand is usually put back and everything is covered again. The toxins in the water remain in the water in the ponds.

 

[afm199]

Not you Ernie.....please say it's not so. Are you securely in the glass is half empty crowd? Are you against horizontal drilling and fracking?

I have followed petroleum production and gas production for many years. It's ending. In my lifetime. Meaning that the cost will continue to rise as the world population rises and energy consumption ramps up. People in the US don't think about the hundreds of millions of Chinese and Indians who are entering the middle class and starting to use energy like Americans. The glass is past half empty.

Horizontal drilling and fracking? Still waiting to make up my mind. If the ground water contamination claims are true, it's a disaster. If not, it's great. But remember one thing.... The Bakken area ( where much of our future production is supposed to come from) is huge. It takes thousands of wells there to produce as much energy as one small Saudi well....

There is most certainly an energy crisis, and it will pop up its ugly head soon enough.

 

[greener]

Someone's been drinking.

Worse! I was designated driver so I got home late and alert but not sleepy.
My only available companion was a barf thread

 

[planegray]

You have to stop calling it that when they're getting huge tax breaks, subsidies, etc etc etc, on the taxpayer's dime. Not to mention the US armed forces are spending their resources and soldier's lives to protect the foreign infrastructure.

For your 1st point:

Looks like "corporatism" to me


"Socialism is a system where the government directly owns and manages businesses. Corporatism is a system where businesses are nominally in private hands, but are in fact controlled by the government. In a corporatist state, government officials often act in collusion with their favored business interests to design polices that give those interests a monopoly position, to the detriment of both competitors and consumers."

http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul665.html



for your 2nd point:

Perhaps the single most active military officer in the Banana Wars was U.S. Marine Corps Major General, Smedley Butler, who saw action in Honduras in 1903, served in Nicaragua enforcing American policy from 1909-1912, was awarded the Medal of Honor for his role in Veracruz in 1914, and a second Medal of Honor for bravery while "crush(ing) the Caco resistance" in Haiti in 1915. In 1935, Butler wrote in his famous book War Is a Racket:

"I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banana_Wars

 

[CoolBDPhenom03]

"The rest of the story." (Paul Harvey)
Chevron had sales over $64b. They only made a 12% net return. And they paid $3.94 per share to all the 401ks, and little guys (like me) that own their stock.

Meanwhile, Apple, which makes everything overseas, had $6.62b in profits. A net return of 23.4%. They paid NOTHING to shareholders.

So who is the better citizen? Don't EVEN get started on the number of employees, taxes paid, and charitable contributions, when you start bashing one company over another. Things are not as ignorantly simple as they may seem.

does everyone need an iphone or ipad to get to work each day?
do you need an ipod to put food on the table?
do you have to buy an app to get to job interviews?

didn't think so

comparing a required commodity to a luxury one is ridiculous

What IS your point?

The point is that gas is a COMMODITY and Apple products are a LUXURY. No one forces you to buy an Apple product. There are many alternatives. Without getting into crap gas, your choices are only Chevron, Shell, and 76. All of which basically price-fix to "compete" with each other. Furthermore, Apple's pricing scheme is pretty simple and consistent year to year. Over time, their pricing actually drops. The price of gas never drops over the long-term.

 

[Arminius]

Worse! I was designated driver so I got home late and alert but not sleepy.
My only available companion was a barf thread

Your posts seemed a little sloppy and out of character so I thought you had a few.

 

[louemc]

It's all about profit and their supporter's have taken it hook, line and sinker!!

Uhh, there isn't a rock big enough to have been the rock lived under, and not know that's it's always been all about profit.

And these oil companies are not American..they are international.

 

[afm199]

The point is that gas is a COMMODITY and Apple products are a LUXURY. No one forces you to buy an Apple product. There are many alternatives. Without getting into crap gas, your choices are only Chevron, Shell, and 76. All of which basically price-fix to "compete" with each other. Furthermore, Apple's pricing scheme is pretty simple and consistent year to year. Over time, their pricing actually drops. The price of gas never drops over the long-term.

Uhh, commodities that have a diminishing supply can't drop in price as long as demand remains constant. The opposite is true.

 

[mlm]

Too many people choose to live miles from work so they can live in a bigger house, and then blame someone else when gas prices go up.

 

[Idontdotrix]

srsly? how about so they can afford ANY house?
then there's the whole thinking about your kids so they can have a decent neighborhood and a nice school...

 

[Arminius]

Too many people choose to live miles from work so they can live in a bigger house, and then blame someone else when gas prices go up.

You left out the part about them driving a gas guzzler too.

 

[matt1216]

Oilsands are not drilled. They are strip mined. They just strip the layer of top soil off and then start shelving down. They denude square miles of forest and strip mine down hundreds of feet. The sand is usually put back and everything is covered again. The toxins in the water remain in the water in the ponds.

I've heard that more energy is used to get the oil outta the sand than is gained by the oil. So basically it's not worth it.

I watched an interesting documentary recently called "Collapse" it's about the word economy collapse. And the man who is highlighted in the doc says the world is running out of oil.

 

[Idontdotrix]

if we're on the verge of a world without oil -which I've been hearing since I was a kid in the 70's- then why hasn't anyone come up with an alternative?

most of our military is oil dependent- you'd think if we were looking at a worldwide crisis, we wouldn't want to strand the majority of our forces for lack of transportation.

yet we're investing billions in sending a rover to Mars.
Mars.
we put a flipping man on the moon in less than a decade from the time the promise was made. but with all our vast resources, we're still using a resource that everyone claims is nearly gone?

why is it we can't come up with a different fuel source?

 

[mlm]

I guess all those people commuting to the Valley from their 3000sqft homes in Salinas were doing it for the good schools.

 

[Arminius]

if we're on the verge of a world without oil -which I've been hearing since I was a kid in the 70's- then why hasn't anyone come up with an alternative?

most of our military is oil dependent- you'd think if we were looking at a worldwide crisis, we wouldn't want to strand the majority of our forces for lack of transportation.

yet we're investing billions in sending a rover to Mars.
Mars.
we put a flipping man on the moon in less than a decade from the time the promise was made. but with all our vast resources, we're still using a resource that everyone claims is nearly gone?

why is it we can't come up with a different fuel source?

They have developed alternate fuel sources but nothing even comes close to the amount of energy, and the abundance, per kilogram of oil. If you want to see the situation get much MUCH worse let the government take over the industry and see what happens. All of those oil company employees will be replaced by incompetent lazy ass and unqualified federal workers.

 

[n10sive]

[tinfoil hat] I would bet there already is a source, developed by oil companies and/or the military (think magnets), but you will not see it until they milk the current problem for all it's worth. [/tinfoil hat]

 

[Idontdotrix]

pass me one of those hats please Dale

 

[Arminius]

[tinfoil hat] I would bet there already is a source, developed by oil companies and/or the military (think magnets), but you will not see it until they milk the current problem for all it's worth. [/tinfoil hat]

It makes a fun topic to talk about but I put this in the same category as the magic carburetors, from the 70s and 80s that would give a 1972 Buick Wildcat with a 455 50 mpg.

 

[afm199]

I've heard that more energy is used to get the oil outta the sand than is gained by the oil. So basically it's not worth it.

I watched an interesting documentary recently called "Collapse" it's about the word economy collapse. And the man who is highlighted in the doc says the world is running out of oil.

No, not true. It takes a lot of energy but amortizes around $45 a barrel. Basically 3 barrels water to one barrel oil are needed, and the obverse, one barrel energy to produce three barrels oil...Basically ALL of Canada's huge natural gas resources are used to steam clean oilsands in the production of oil. It's why the huge shale deposits in the US may never be used, it's even more environmentally disturbing than oilsands.

 

[n10sive]

The only reason I say that is that my Great Grandfather was an engine builder. He has the patent #1473486 for "The Internal Combustion Engine"

I remember as a kid him showing me an engine that was electo-magnetic. He had it in a go-cart that a great-uncle would test drive. His problems were around regulating the power. It would work extremely well these days with all these new CVT style transmissions. He was bought out of his patent by...guess who...