Went to dirt school

[berth]

Last weekend, I went to an off road training school down here in So Cal.

The place is called Moto Ventures, and it was really an excellent facility and the staff was top notch, friendly, and helpful. Large, all sorts of terrain. It's in Anza CA, which has some altitude. I don't think I'd go in deep summer. But this weekend was beautiful. Couldn't ask for better weather.

The local BMW dealer, Irv Seaver, was sponsoring some BMW training, and set up a camping weekend, bringing down their staff and a chef to cook meals. The Irv Seaver guys were great too.

For me, it didn't go that well though.

I had a very ignominious start.

My plan was to do two days of training, the first day using one of their bikes, and the second day with my 750GS. Sounded like a great plan. Get some skills and a bit of experience on Sat, they follow up on my bike to get some more experience, and confidence.

I was going to stay at a local Hotel/Casino, so I came down Friday afternoon. I found the Casino, and passed the course area on the way in, less than a mile back. So, I simply turned around and wanted to check in and find out more about what was going on with the camping and meals and such.

I arrived at the site, and then discovered that the entry road is quite sandy. I was certainly not expecting that, and I'm on my bike with 100% street tires (the plan was to air them down for the course later). But, I decided to press forward and...dumped the bike.

This did a couple of things. First, it leveraged the "easy break" part of the clutch level, so now I have a shorty. But, worse, it trapped my foot under the bike. It was pinned by the mounting point for the luggage.

I struggled quite a bit with this, managed to get a phone call into the host of the training, who called the folks camping at the site (less than a 1/4 mile away).

By the time they got to me, I was finally able to dig out my foot. But I must say, it was a scary moment. I was stuck 10-15m (it felt like) working my way out.

They helped me right the bike, and we moved on from there.

This pretty much ruined my weekend. I was never comfortable on their bike. Every twitch felt like the brink of disaster. It also told me that any idea of actually using my bike was utter folly. Not just now, but even in the future.

My hope and dream was to be able to use this as a springboard to try and explore simple fire roads. Not looking to do X games or single track or anything like that, just explore some fire roads. You know, "adventure" bike. But this demonstrated, to a point, the worst that can happen. I wasn't even hurt, but I was legitimately trapped. If I wasn't pinned against some sand that was easy enough to dig out, I'd have been in real trouble if I'd been out in the wild.

But it also made me ask, skipping the whole disaster part, "When does this get fun?"

It was exhausting, I'll say that. Part of that was the school bike didn't fit me, and when we were doing stand up riding, I was in a pretty bad position, and that just wrecked me energy wise.

But even then, maybe it's more fun when it's a bit faster. Running around in first gear doing technical drills, eh. Not that speed is the goal, but my theory is if you go a bit faster, then the twitches smooth out, feel less disastrous. At slow speed, always feels like I'm losing something or other.

I dunno. It was not a good experience for me. When I went home after the first day, I knew I was done when I was watching a TV ad for paint and the guy with the roller swerved a little bit. Just seeing that triggered some latent anxiety. I contacted the school and told them I wouldn't be back the next day.

Make no mistake, this was all me, the staff and facility and BMW guys were 10/10, top drawer.

I don't know what to do now, I don't know if I'll try this again or not.

 

[Butch]

Dude, get back on that horse!

Dirt is really, really good training for all types of riding. Humbling at times perhaps. Work and exercise at times too. A challenge that may not be for everyone. But, the skills mastered could save your life.

I rode with those guys, Gary LaPlant, specifically, years ago. Huge fun. The current world trials champion was doing a photoshoot at the time, so that was fun.

I think Doc Wong has them coming up here, to Hollister, to do some big bike training. Next weekend?

Training can save your life.

 

[zanshin]

IMHO. If you are just getting into dirt, you should use an actual dirt bike, so you can learn techniques that presuppose a bike that weighs 250 lbs that you can throw around like a big mountain bike and save with your foot.

Learning on a 500-600 lb bike is an exercise in misery. It doesn't ride anything like a dirtbike; it's a huge compromise, and the learnings this affords are limited.

 

[budman]

I would agree a smaller dirt bike would be much easier... and fun.

I bet there are sources down there given it is the home of offroad in CA.

Sorry to hear about the miserable experience, but good on ya for giving it a go.

 

[Butch]

So yeah, go back and do it on one of their REAL DIRTBIKES!
You’ll have fun and learn a lot. You can apply lots to riding an ADV piggy…

 

[Frisco]

I had a similar experience, but in reverse. I did a RideADV two day course on my T7 with a couple of friends this spring. It was a challenge, but I learned a lot and had fun. After the course we met up with a friend to put out new found skills to work in Death Valley for a couple of days.

Day 1 in DV was challenging, but fun. I got to see my off road technique prevent a crash in the sand by feathering the clutch and giving it some gas. This stuff really works! Day 2 in DV was not so good. Fatigue and taking a too challenging section (Mengel Pass) had me crashing and suffering a shoulder separation and fractured collarbone.

How do I feel now? As soon as the shoulder is fully recovered, I want to get back off road. I’ll be a little wiser about the route and I am not keen on riding in sand again. Also, I realize I’m too old to become an expert off road rider. Live and learn.

 

[anytwowilldo]

Sorry to hear this. What should have been a great weekend turned out to be a disaster. I ride quite a bit of dirt and 99.5% of the time I'm never alone and neither are my friends for this exact reason. A simple fall could be disastrous if you are trapped out there all by yourself. Even if you are not, picking up a 500 LB+ ADV bike by yourself can be at best difficult and at worst impossible.

I ride a KTM 990 Adventure off road and tires make a huge difference. I run about the most aggressive knobbies on the street so when I get to the dirt I have them.

I'm glad you did not hurt your foot. Hard luggage and mounts for hard luggage can hurt you. Often if you go down in the dirt your foot/leg will get swept back and under a hard box. I run soft luggage for just this reason. I also wear moto boots.

To really ride an ADV bike off road in rough terrain you should be standing. It puts more weight on the front tire and the bike bounces you around less, allowing you more control.

You ask "when does this get fun?" It gets fun when you can go out with your buddies and see stuff you would never from your car or go moto camping with your buddies. This Fire lookout is at about 5,000 Ft. in the NorthEast corner of Ca, down miles of fire roads. We had a 1200GSA, KTM 1190 and many other large ADV bikes there.

BTW, deep sand is very difficult! Unfortunately your entry into off roading started under the most difficult conditions. We all ride Dual Sports in deep sand in Baja. I doubt I would ride my 990 in it. A dirt fire road is much different.

I say wear the correct gear, mount the correct tires, and go get the training/practice. Like most things in life, you only get out what you put in. Get back on that horse and give it another shot.

 

[ratpick]

Better tires will make a big difference. You don’t need full on knobs but a good 50/50 tire would have helped in preventing the accident . They will still work well on the road unless you like to drag knee.

 

[Ironbutt]

It'll get more fun, you were out of your comfort zone.

I'd take your 'ankle breakers' off when you ride off road and just use a tank bag and or strap everything to the backseat. I'd run a knobby front and a trials tread on the rear; or some close together knobby. But a full on knobby.. you get used to the squirrelyness.

Another tip. Weight the pegs. Whether sitting or standing you can steer with your pegs, offroad and on road.. Don't sit in the seat with your legs limp. Old school ABS-> 'Always be standing'

There's a big fitness element to it. Getting old sux.. I run to keep my strength up.

C

 

[HadesOmega]

The important thing about riding dirt is your skill level and your bike. You have to be comfortable riding the terrain you will be riding on the bike you will be riding.

When I ride at Metcalf I will ride any trail in the park on my Sur Ron Light Bee or KLX140. But if I am riding my DR650 I stick to the green and blue trails.

When I am out adventure riding and I see a questionable trail or some kind road block. I have to stop and asses and walk/scout ahead if me and my machine can safely get through this. If not I turn around.

The bigger the bike the more skill it will take to ride certain terrain. When I was racing Virginia City Grand Prix there is an Adventure Bike class and I'll be moving right along on the Light Bee on some nasty trails and pass an adv bike on it's side or in a ditch and tell myself glad I'm not riding that.

Even when I am adventure riding when I plan my routes I try and make sure that I can pass them or if they are "Adventure Bike" friendly. The BDR maps have hard splits and adv bike splits.

Also I'm a solo rider, I adventure ride or dirt bike by myself. I make sure the bike I'm riding I can pick up. These adventure bikes are so heavy that if you drop them it's very difficult for one person to pick them up. That's why I don't own a large ADV bike because if I drop it I probably won't be able to pick it up. If you have a large ADV bike it's best to have a buddy to help you pick it up.

 

[bmwbob51]

I see folks do amazing things on 500 pound bikes, but if you exceide your talent level they will crush you! I think of all the times I've gone into the back woods on my GS not thinking how dangerous it is and now at 70 I think twice before venturing off the main road.

 

[Wolf]

Try to find a purely entry-level dirt course with dirt bikes.

I did a course in Boulder Creek with Garrahan Off Road, and it was great. You learn all the stuff that's different from street riding, which is a big help.... rather than a course which assumes you know the basics.

https://garrahanoffroadtraining.com/event/intro-to-dirt-april-16th/?instance_id=10491

 

[mitiasbikes]

+1 for Garrahan, I did their course and rented one of the smaller dirt bikes.
Totally would want to come back and do their intermediate, advanced classes. Possibly doing beginner course on my middleweight adventure
You do need to be in good physical shape to ride off road.
Its a lot more demanding than street riding.

 

[berth]

Thanks for all the replies.

I was using a dirt bike for my day. Some Yamaha 200 I think. The plan was to use the small bike on Sat and my bike on Sun, but that obviously didn't happen.

There were 3 folks on their 1250 and 850 GSs doing the course.

I may try it again. My mishap the night before just spoiled the whole show for me. That and I got exhausted, which made it no fun either.

I actually had a dream of off road riding the other night...that went really well! So I guess there's hope.

At the same time, karma has put two YT videos up, one of someone "quitting dirt riding" and another of someone doing going on an adventure to a ghost town, finding their friend trapped under their bike, and at the end, the friend said, "Well we had fun!" and the host saying "Did we?".

I mean, my motto has always been "An adventure is a bad trip remembered fondly." And this has all the elements of an "adventure", but I haven't got to the "fondly" part yet.

Going home Sunday was fun. The area was completely socked in with fog. A very wet fog. I was riding down the highway slow enough that the wind wasn't really clearing the facescreen, and riding with the screen open was just coating my glasses. I eventually stopped and took my glasses off until I got out of it. Stinging fog.

I will say, that getting off the dirt on onto the pavement with some real traction, boy did that feel good.

 

[NoobCorpse]

IMHO. If you are just getting into dirt, you should use an actual dirt bike, so you can learn techniques that presuppose a bike that weighs 250 lbs that you can throw around like a big mountain bike and save with your foot.

Learning on a 500-600 lb bike is an exercise in misery. It doesn't ride anything like a dirtbike; it's a huge compromise, and the learnings this affords are limited.

This X10000.

All those adv videos where guys are hustling KTM 1290 Adventure Rs, 890 adv Rs, R1250GSes around on rough stuff, small jumps, kicking the back end out, etc? They're dirt / hard enduro / trials riders who have been doing it since they were kids. Riding a big bike to learn in dirt is like punching yourself in the balls repeatedly to toughen yourself up. Also: don't listen to anybody telling you to "power through" or "falling builds character", those people can get fucked. Fall enough times while trying to learn shakes your confidence.