That's a bit of a weird way of looking at it. Half of all power actually is produced close to, or in urban areas. And for things like hydro, these aren't owned by rural people. Nor are large numbers of rural people required to show up at their local dam every morning and pedal a stationary bicycle for 30 minutes. Rural people are not doing a bunch of dirty work to keep the power on in the cities.
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Yay datacenters...driving up electricity costs
- Thread starter Climber
- Start date
That's a bit of a weird way of looking at it. Half of all power actually is produced close to, or in urban areas. And for things like hydro, these aren't owned by rural people. Nor are large numbers of rural people required to show up at their local dam every morning and pedal a stationary bicycle for 30 minutes. Rural people are not doing a bunch of dirty work to keep the power on in the cities.
littlebeast
i feel… motivated
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does this take into account the produce that can be sent for processing? consumers may want perfect looking but downstream things like jams, salsas, sauces, condiments, etc. - not so much. no clue the economics of this particular producer, but it sorta sounds like they may have gotten out over their skies on their harvesting overhead. risky thing to do considering the unpredictability of AG markets.
You’re right…moving on.
Eldritch
is insensitive
Did you google to confirm, or just default to 69'ing with the guy because confirmation bias? More than half are open loop and the closed loop systems use even more electricity. It's all well below the bar of good, or neutral. It's like a conversation about rape and bragging about how you use quality lube, it's still all well below the bar of good or neutral behavior. Thanks for using the lube though, god bless you mister!
Climber
Well-known member
The thing about closed system cooling is that the heat has to go somewhere. I've read that the ones that use a closed system heat up the air around them, so now you're using a ton of electricity, you're putting noise pollution into the air and now you're heating the air around you.
Doobz
Well-known member
Should I feel bad I just took a job thats swamped with work w/building data centers for the next 5 years 
DynoSoarUs
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My household and neighbors noticed that we are paying 20% more this year. We are hardly using the AC now and switched to electric fans in the summer. Before this, we always had AC on.
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alien
For the hottest day I used to run the AC at night in order to sleep but have since switched to a spare bedroom that has a patio door I leave open. This brings down the temp down to perfect sleeping conditions. Of course it helps a lot that Im not living in an Arizona like climate. Just so lucky to have a cheaper and more quiet option.
Got a feeling these data centres are going to be the biggest waste of resources since the pyramids
When AI is the tool that enables breakthroughs in cancer research and treatment which result in the eradication of cancer- will they still be a waste of resource?
Extrapolate that along any other deep-research-needed topic and ask yourself- "is this going to be improved by a tool which can have awareness of vast sums of information that can be queried by researchers using simple english language queries?"
There isn't a field that won't be impacted. Many already have been. Radiology is using AI to process X-rays and other diagnostics with a detection rate much better than that of humans. Meterology is using it to forecast the weather with greater accuracy. It's being used EVERYWHERE.
I get the concerns about datacenters and the environment, the impact on power markets, water availabilty , etc. Those are all manageable impacts- they can be addressed by regulating datacenters rather than letting them operate as they do today- buying up huge swaths of power at discounted rates for years, joining municipal water systems and paying discounted rates to the system for the water they consume, all in the name of "incentivizing business growth" in cities (which never manifests, as "business" used to mean jobs, and now it doesn't.) Instead, tax those things- tax the heat they emit, tax the water they consume, tax the power they use- and over time, ratchet up requirements until they aren't a negative impact at all.
But to look at AI and say "we shouldn't even try this, because the planet" is like looking at the first man to create fire and saying "but should we burn the whole world?" and deciding that nah, fire's a bad idea.
Extrapolate that along any other deep-research-needed topic and ask yourself- "is this going to be improved by a tool which can have awareness of vast sums of information that can be queried by researchers using simple english language queries?"
There isn't a field that won't be impacted. Many already have been. Radiology is using AI to process X-rays and other diagnostics with a detection rate much better than that of humans. Meterology is using it to forecast the weather with greater accuracy. It's being used EVERYWHERE.
I get the concerns about datacenters and the environment, the impact on power markets, water availabilty , etc. Those are all manageable impacts- they can be addressed by regulating datacenters rather than letting them operate as they do today- buying up huge swaths of power at discounted rates for years, joining municipal water systems and paying discounted rates to the system for the water they consume, all in the name of "incentivizing business growth" in cities (which never manifests, as "business" used to mean jobs, and now it doesn't.) Instead, tax those things- tax the heat they emit, tax the water they consume, tax the power they use- and over time, ratchet up requirements until they aren't a negative impact at all.
But to look at AI and say "we shouldn't even try this, because the planet" is like looking at the first man to create fire and saying "but should we burn the whole world?" and deciding that nah, fire's a bad idea.
tuxumino
Purrfect
AI is a tool, knowing how to use it takes some work. It's a lot like scientific calculators in the 70s and 80s, they took some time to learn but once you did you could save bunches of time.
Offsetting the environmental and social impact of AI probably won't happen until a big oops happens.
Offsetting the environmental and social impact of AI probably won't happen until a big oops happens.
Abacinator
Unholy Blasphemies
There are legitimate use cases for "AI" and it has the potential to be an extremely powerful tool. But we don't need to inundate rural communities with data centers to facilitate little Jimmy generating nude pics of his English teacher to share with his friends. The vast majority of AI output is worthless slop. The amount of resources being consumed so chat gpt can spit out wrong answers is totally unnecessary.
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alien
I didn’t read the whole thread but I doubt anyone said anything like that and that AI should be abolished and anyone pushing it should be exterminated.
Climber
Well-known member
As much good as AI may do in our society, it will also do at least as much bad.
How many jobs will be eliminated? How much of your financials will be considered when Amazon and others are deciding how much you should pay for something, or how much your flight should be, or how much you should pay for drugs?
Then there is AI deciding if you should be rounded up and put into a concentration camp.
If you're going to talk about the good, you also have to acknowledge the bad. Contrary to what the worlds richest man claims, if AI does all of the work for society, everybody isn't going to be living a full, rich life. Not even close.
How many jobs will be eliminated? How much of your financials will be considered when Amazon and others are deciding how much you should pay for something, or how much your flight should be, or how much you should pay for drugs?
Then there is AI deciding if you should be rounded up and put into a concentration camp.
If you're going to talk about the good, you also have to acknowledge the bad. Contrary to what the worlds richest man claims, if AI does all of the work for society, everybody isn't going to be living a full, rich life. Not even close.