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Would a "last minute" trackday work?

30 riders at Laguna or Thunderhill is nothing, at Infineon it's a lot. At Miller you can't see them.

That's an opinion of which I am probably not authorized to comment on but what I want to understand is how has a safety issue such as rider safety due to numbers on track changed so greatly in only 4 years?

I'm not discussing yours or mine personal opinion about riders on track but rather how those who used to so adamantly argue that 30 was as far as they could go have over time raised the numbers to almost twice the number that was considered safe only 4 years ago?
 
That's an opinion of which I am probably not authorized to comment on but what I want to understand is how has a safety issue such as rider safety due to numbers on track changed so greatly in only 4 years?

I'm not discussing yours or mine personal opinion about riders on track but rather how those who used to so adamantly argue that 30 was as far as they could go have over time raised the numbers to almost twice the number that was considered safe only 4 years ago?

increasing track rental costs mebbe? :dunno
 
increasing track rental costs mebbe? :dunno

This is my point exactly, do you want choices in an enviroment such as track riding to be made by choosing money over safety, not that anyone is doing that currently, just a general question.

The comment that track costs influence rider safety concerns me greatly. I guess in the end it is mine and your choice to ride or not so in the end we are to blame for what we see as acceptable risk or not.

Still the thought that costs control safety is a scary one in the sport we are a part of.
 
This is my point exactly, do you want choices in an enviroment such as track riding to be made by choosing money over safety, not that anyone is doing that currently, just a general question.

The comment that track costs influence rider safety concerns me greatly. I guess in the end it is mine and your choice to ride or not so in the end we are to blame for what we see as acceptable risk or not.

Still the thought that costs control safety is a scary one in the sport we are a part of.

i don't really see a way around it unless you want to start up a tdp and make your own rules for sign ups... These guys need to make money in order to keep providing all of us days to ride the track. Either way, 50 riders at an open trackday is perfectly safe at thill...
 
50 riders at an open track day usually equates to 20-25 riders on track at the same time. It's usually empty. Part of why I love open track days.
 
i don't really see a way around it unless you want to start up a tdp and make your own rules for sign ups... These guys need to make money in order to keep providing all of us days to ride the track. Either way, 50 riders at an open trackday is perfectly safe at thill...

Agreed on all accounts and by the way I think they all do a bang up job at what is probably not an easy gig. If I had the pockets and the clients to get in and out at just even I would love to do that and run things a less crowded way but that aint going to happen and Dirty does a pretty great job all by himself.:thumbup
 
Agreed on all accounts and by the way I think they all do a bang up job at what is probably not an easy gig. If I had the pockets and the clients to get in and out at just even I would love to do that and run things a less crowded way but that aint going to happen and Dirty does a pretty great job all by himself.:thumbup

well if you started one, i'd sign up... :thumbup
 
The comment that track costs influence rider safety concerns me greatly..
Sorry for the threadjack, and this can be moved if desired, but just responding to existing content that's currently in this thread.

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No question the safety card has changed over the years, in terms of number of bikes/riders on track. Laguna Seca is a prime example of that.

For the first 10+ years that I attended/instructed at trackdays at Laguna, the track itself (or SCRAMP) had a 25 bike/rider limit on track. This was not open to negotiation by the trackday providers. As such, with a 3 group day, accepting 75 riders maximum for an event was cast-in-concrete.

Then suddenly a number of years back, the Laguna track management began to offer promoters the option of increasing the maximum group size by 5, or 10 riders. Each of the two options having an associated added cost to the promoter for the trackday rental.

Once that change of policy took over, 35 riders/group were now obviously being considered to be a "safe" environment on track. The exact same track, with the exact same riders, on the exact same bikes, that the same track management entity had previously deemed only safe up to a maximum of 25 riders.

So as to the question of whether the almighty $$ has been the unspoken driving factor resulting in increased rider limits applied at trackday events, at the expense of changes to "safety" perceptions; good or bad .... the answer is obviously "yes".

This is the reverse of situations where public roads that have been marked with a 55 MPH speed limit for over 30 years, are suddenly marked with 45 MPH speed limit signs. Same road, same vehicles, and suddenly the formal perception (by law) on what is a "safe" speed is changed?
 
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No question the safety card has changed over the years, in terms of number of bikes/riders on track. Laguna Seca is a prime example of that......

This is the reverse of situations where public roads that have been marked with a 55 MPH speed limit for over 30 years, are suddenly marked with 45 MPH speed limit signs. Same road, same vehicles, and suddenly the formal perception (by law) on what is a "safe" speed is changed?
I am sorry that senility has hit you too, Gary. You must connect the obvious dots, here, with your analogy: The more people, the slower you go. You have not adjusted your track speed for the extra riders. Pfffst.
By-the-way, that rider change happened when the county took a more active role in track management. The noise restriction also got tighter.

Dear Dan,

If I stop investing in stupid dead-end endeavors, I shall be free to jump in on any last minute event you happen to come-up with. Until that time, I shall watch with my older slower fanny parked on the corkscrew infield.
 
Good news and bad news. First the bad... both Sundays are spoken for. The good news is that Saturday, Feb. 5th, 2011 is ours if we want it. Sunday the 6th is Superbowl Sunday so that probably would not have been a good day anyway.

T-Hill management has been very accommodating. They have agreed to "pencil us in", meaning we don't have to commit to the day until the weather forecast is out (and looking good). If someone else wants the day, I'll have to either shit or get off the pot. Obviously I'm not going to commit to the day until the weather forecast is locked up, so if someone else wants the day between now and say... Feb. 2nd or 3rd, we'll just have to give it up.

So tell everyone you know who might be interested to pm me, post up, or email me their email address and I'll keep everyone updated. If we can get 60 riders total (30 or so per group) we can do it for $150. I think that's possible on a Saturday if the weather is nice. If we only get 30 riders it's going to be closer to $190. I know a few of my friends would come out, and I've received about 10 pm's so far, so we're off to an OK start.
 
interested for sure. Does the two group "ride at appropriate pace" rule apply to you too? :twofinger

You a funny man! If we get a good turn-out, I'll probably stay in the pits with the radio during one of the group's sessions, and I'll have someone I trust stay with the radio while I'm out with the other group. So I may not need to "ride at an appropriate pace". And if anyone is curious, I think the fast/slow group cut-off is probably around 2:12-2:15 depending on bike and riding style.
 
This sounds awesome...wish I could attend. Have fun all, hopefully the weather continues to look good
 
When are you planning on letting us know? How will we pay? Paypal? Cash onsite? tnx

I'll let everyone know once we know what the weather is going to do. Or if someone else wants the day, and we lose it because I wouldn't commit, then I'll let everyone know about that. So just keep your schedule free on that day in case the weather gods smile upon us.

As for payment, I can take credit cards, cash or checks (except from you Neil). Obviously I won't be taking money until we know that this day is actually going to happen. And paying on the day of the event will be fine.
 
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