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Best Shotgun for Home Defense?

Poo, who needs firepower? Slap BARF stickers up at all the doors and windows, and the Bad guy, will pee his pants, and run screaming like a little school girl.
 
billswim said:
Gunshot? What gun shot? I didn't hear one. Did you Sonny?
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Oaklamd

no_snitches_sticker-p217631390275879292qjcl_400.jpg
 
cycle61 said:
Biggest problem with me having a HD weapon...my roommate at the end of the hall who is also armed. I'm gonna just stay out of his line of fire, thanks.
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Just agree before hand to shoot in the same direction.. :p :laughing
 
If your new SHOTSPOTTER can't triangulate a gun shot, it didn't happen.
 
gixxerjoeca said:
Depends a lot on what rounds you are shooting, FMJ vs HP etc.
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racercosmo said:
I'm testing this after my neighbor leaves for work. I have milk jugs full of water.
Test subjects will be 45 acp 230 gr Federal HST vs 5.56 55 gr Federal XM193.
Depending on test results, I will try again with 5.56 62 grain m855.
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The m855 should be a blast... Depending on the date of manufacture. :laughing
RRR70 said:
FMJ doesn't do shit. It goes in and out without causing damage. Unless you lucky enough to hit major vessel, spine or brain. JHPs are designed to stay in the body, expand and to cause hydrostatic shock. So, even if you don't hit any vital areas, sharp edges of expanded bullet will cause major tissue damage, blood loss and hydrostatic shock will affect target.
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Aluisious said:
You shouldn't make a lot of noise about knowledge when you have never bothered to check your assumptions. 5.56 tumbles and disintegrates rapidly at close range. It's a very light round moving very fast, that shouldn't be a surprise. It over-penetrates less than many pistol rounds.
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I'm the one throwing out assumptions, yet YOUR post is the one being called out by multiple people. Right, I need to double check MY preference of a self defense weapon. I don't think so.

I guess you don't know a single person in a military or law enforcement position. Many of those folks, are routinely bitching about the .223/5.56 over penetrating and NOT causing enough trauma.... :dunno

Now as for tumble/fragment. Yes, it CAN, if your ammo and barrel twist ratio allows such. You might want to read up on that. :nerd

Frangible pistol rounds won't over penetrate. I don't even WANT to find out if cheap ass JHP .223 rounds will or will not perform the way I want them to in a home environment under a live fire situation.
I don't know about you but the idea of putting holes in shit I like (property) and people I love, while putting a hole in something I don't want in my house. Doesn't need to go down that way.
But hey, in your house with your gun and your loved ones on the line, who am I to give shit what goes down in your home. Oh yeah that right. I DO need to be concerned. All anyone needs is another misinformed person doing something catastrophic with a firearm. To give more fuel to the anti-gun idiots out there for their fight to ban firearms.

Enough dick swinging. I can't believe I drug myself into an argument over Ballistics. :rolleyes
 
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Dopesick said:
I'm the one throwing out assumptions, yet YOUR post is the one being called out by multiple people. Right, I need to double check MY preference of a self defense weapon. I don't think so.
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You quoted Roman out of context. I don't think he's naive enough to think that .223 FMJ "goes in and out and does nothing."

I guess you don't know a single person in a military or law enforcement position. Many of those folks, are routinely bitching about the .223/5.56 over penetrating and NOT causing enough trauma.... :dunno
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First, you have never heard a cop complain about .223 overpenetration. You shouldn't put words in imaginary friends' mouths. Second, military personnel are using tungsten core bullets out of short barrels that are designed to penetrate armor and cover. Low velocity, extremely hard bullets do zip right through, but only an idiot would use those for HD. XM193 does not overpenetrate at short range. It's fast and soft so it fragments easily.

So, basically you have no idea what you're talking about, but that doesn't stop you from loudly and aggressively thumping your little drum.
 
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Aluisious said:
You quoted Roman out of context. I don't think he's naive enough to think that .223 FMJ "goes in and out and does nothing."
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Actually, that's exactly what it does. It goes in and out creating very narrow wound canal and unless it struck major vessel or nerve center, it does nothing. There are countless stories from the sandbox in regards of that issue. That's one of the reason why military experimenting with LP-FMJ ("Limited Penetration-Full Metal Jacket").
 
Aluisious said:
You quoted Roman out of context. I don't think he's naive enough to think that .223 FMJ "goes in and out and does nothing."

It's fast and soft so it fragments easily.

So, basically you have no idea what you're talking about, but that doesn't stop you from loudly and aggressively thumping your little drum.
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This will be my last comment to you. Even Roman above me, doesn't agree that I quoted him out of context.

Now as for your "Rifle" ammo. Several people in this thread (and on forums around the world for shooting) have made the SAME comments as I have.

Here's someone not even involved in this thread, and hell this dude does all his own testing... http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot1_2.htm

And I shall quote him for you in the event you don't want to listen to reason.

It was time to get out the rifle.
I shot my 16" AR with XM-193.
Here I am busting the Box.
We don't know how many boards it would have penetrated, as it was still moving after exiting the twelfth board.
Here are the two exits.
Notice, again, that they were tumbling.
Lessons learned:
1. Sheetrock (drywall) doesn't slow any round down much. If you shoot in the house, walls will not stop any serious round.
2. Twelve pine boards will not stop a .223 round.
3. Shooting stuff is fun.
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Even your beloved XM193 round, went THROUGH 12 pine boards. Granted at the exit "wound" they were tumbling. Did I mention the it went through 12 pine boards part????

As for the frangible rounds. I chose a pistol to run them through, due to the lower FPS. Means I have a hell of a lot more of a buffer room for not over penetrating, then the higher FPS a rifle will do. Granted I'd be trying like hell NOT to miss. But I've never placed myself under that stress. I sure as hell do not want to find out the hard way.

Ok, I'm done with this. I'm not a ballistics expert. But I DO listen to those that know more then I do. When you can prove EVERYONE, including myself in this thread that we are wrong. Then I will listen to you.
 
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Ha, we were in the desert and Susan decides to shoot a steel plate about 25yds away with her AR using XM193. Bullet whistled right through it, except for the jacket which tore off and came back to hit me in the leg. I was a tad pissed. But 5.56 can whistle through all sorts of stuff.
 
Aluisious said:
Second, military personnel are using tungsten core bullets out of short barrels that are designed to penetrate armor and cover.
So, basically you have no idea what you're talking about, but that doesn't stop you from loudly and aggressively thumping your little drum.
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Short barells huh?:laughing

FYI the standard issue U.S Military rifle is the M16A2/A4 which has a 20" barrel.
 
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Archimedes said:
Funny thing about this whole discussion is that, in the 20 years I've lived here in the Bay Area, I don't think I've heard or read about a single incident where a local homeowner used a gun to defend their home. Happened plenty of times when I lived in Texas, but I can't recall a single incident in the Bay Area. I still own a gun though...
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http://articles.sfgate.com/2002-05-23/bay-area/17546672_1_mesa-kasem-fangs-christmas-christmas-tree

firing line thread:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33751
 
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gixxerjoeca said:
Short barells huh?:laughing

FYI the standard issue U.S Military rifle is the M16A2/A4 which has a 20" barrel.
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True. But M16 is a standard issue for the Marines, rest of the service uses mostly an M4 with 14.5" barrel.
 
RRR70 said:
True. But M16 is a standard issue for the Marines, rest of the service uses mostly an M4 with 14.5" barrel.
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We use your standard colt m16A2, the 16" m4 and also the 10.5" MK18.

Now you know

And knowing is half the battle

J.I. Joe!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
2nsane said:
We use your standard colt m16A2, the 16" m4 and also the 10.5" MK18.

Now you know

And knowing is half the battle

J.I. Joe!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Yeah, I forgot about puddle pirates.:p
 
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