Yes, I saw that. Given how few street-oriented motorcycles meet your 340-pound weight limit, it seems like a stupid idea to me. Especially in the Bay Area, where car drivers are frequently: 1) aggressive, and 2) traveling much faster than the posted speed limit.
That thread is about someone who died while lane-splitting past a big rig during rush hour. A very different situation from, say, riding on the freeway on a weekend. I'm pretty sure any newbie would realize there's a difference between these two situations and plan accordingly. My second ride on my first (415-pound) bike was down Highway 280 one Saturday morning. Much less drama riding down 280 at 9am than when I got back to my neighborhood and had some geezer in a 1980's Cadillac turn left in front of me 1/4-mile from my house...
It's amazing. You continue to provide reasons for a new rider to not ride on the freeway, and yet you cannot see it. Truly amazing. You with your vast experience may be able to differentiate, but imagine someone that's still trying to develop their control of the clutch friction zone being aware enough to differentiate. New riders do not have the experience. They are not blessed with your wisdom. They are new. Seriously at least try to look at the world through their eyes. Put on some nubbie boots and walk around for a few miles. Go ride with some nubes. You obviously have no concept as to what it is to be a new rider. Your posts clearly illustrate this fact.
So it sounds like your recommendation is that people who want to ride motorcycles in the USA should move to a foreign country, buy a small-displacement motorcycle, and never ride it in the freeways?
Not at all what I said. But maybe I've gone over your head. You see we can learn from other cultures. We are the melting pot--which is to say we can take from the best, and implement those ideas here. It doesn't mean that we have to go there to enjoy the ideas. I'm also talking about Learner's bikes--not forever bikes. Your posts seem to imply that a person will only ever have one bike. While that might be true if they start off with a really bad first bike, and decided that riding isn't for them, but hopefully with some proper guidance that wont be the majority of the cases.
Sorry, it's time to pull your head out of the sand and recognize reality for what it is: the vast majority of bikes weigh 400+ pounds and, in the Bay Area at least, freeway travel is nearly inevitable. Buying a bike that's inappropriate to local conditions doesn't do a newbie any favors. It's the equivalent of teaching someone to swim in a kiddie pool, then dropping them into the middle of a Class V rapid...
The one that seems most unwilling to look at the data, and learn is you fubar. Sure the vast majority of bikes are over 400 lbs, but that includes all bikes--this discussion is about a learner's bikes, and yet you can't seem to get beyond including inappropriate bikes. You are unwilling to see what works in other countries, and apply it too our situation. In England all learner's bikes are under 400lbs. That's right ALL. There are plenty of good bikes on which to learn. Plenty.
While you lay claim that you can't ride a bike in the Bay Area without going on the freeway it's quite possible that you've not even tried it. As someone that's been doing it for decades let me assure you that it is not only possible, but quite easy too. Sure maybe you can't commute over the Bay bridge with a smaller bike, but considering that very experienced riders are killed crossing that bridge maybe it's not the place for an unskilled rider to be, don't you think?
Your overwhelming issue seems to be that you are judging a learner bike based on how you like to ride. What's good for Mr. Five Years Track Rider Coach doesn't actually translate into good for the new unskilled rider--they don't have your skill set. I'm actually quite amazed that you are unable to do this calculous. Even in this thread you have repeatedly illustrated why new riders shouldn't go on the freeway. Even your analogies of new swimmers illustrates it, and yet you cannot see it. Amazing!
I take it you survived the Cadillac turning in front of you near your house. Do you think you would have faired so well at 70mph on the freeway had Mr. Cadillac taken you out there? If, as you say, there are aggressive speeders filling the freeway doesn't that make for yet another reason for the new unskilled rider to avoid it?
Look, what I'm saying is that new riders have to be given the opportunity to develop. They need bikes that foster this development. Putting them on the freeway where it is quite easy for them to die, and putting them on bikes that are quite able to get away from an unskilled rider is an equation for disaster. It's not setting the new unskilled rider up for success. As the elder statesmen that we are in the moto world it is our responsibility to guide the new riders. Our responsibility to ensure that they have a chance to develop into good riders.
