Ducati North America Raided by the FBI

[cg_ops]

I'm sorry to hear about the termination. That really sucks.

Just thinking out loud... It could be construed as a breach of confidentiality. Publicly commenting on or providing/verifying any specifics (eg 2-3 people on site, FBI raid with guns drawn, etc) about the company, or raid thereof, might constitute some form of breach. You can be sure they didn't want this information becoming public - a raid is bad enough but the public knowing it was ~30 agents with guns drawn will likely result in perceived negative public perception. The press inquiries likely wouldn't have resulted in the FBI sharing details such as the number of agents or that their guns were drawn at the time of the event.

For example:

• FBI: [We] can confirm that FBI San Francisco was at that location on December 17, 2020, to conduct court-authorized law enforcement activity. As of today’s date, no public records are available. Due to the ongoing nature of the investigation, I cannot comment further at this time

vs

• 30 FBI agents raided Ducati NA with guns drawn on December 17, 2020. Sources that were on the scene say the 2 employees working that day were scared for their lives. The FBI hasn't provided any further information but has confirmed that they were there, performing court-authorized law enforcement activity.

The top one may draw attention but the lower one elicits emotion and does more to drive shares about the news to learn more details, hurting the company's image in the process, in its opinion.

I've experienced this first hand... commenting on social media, about an employer related event, biting me in the ass.

 

[Enchanter]

I've experienced this first hand... commenting on social media, about an employer related event, biting me in the ass.

^^^ This.

It does not matter if the content of the social media post is truth, lies, supposition, or a wild-ass-guess.

 

[NorCalBusa]

I'm trying to figure out why 30 (or 4, or however many) agents felt they needed their guns out and pointed at people for a white collar property crime, with no (that I've seen here) evidence of violence or resistance. That's some BS for a use of force complaint, depending on what we don't know.

 

[gixxerjeff]

I'm trying to figure out why 30 (or 4, or however many) agents felt they needed their guns out and pointed at people for a white collar property crime, with no (that I've seen here) evidence of violence or resistance. That's some BS for a use of force complaint, depending on what we don't know.

Just watch one episode of The Blacklist and it will tell you everything you need to know.
The characters in that show can't get coffee at Starbucks without blowing a few people away.

 

[dravnx]

I'm trying to figure out why 30 (or 4, or however many) agents felt they needed their guns out and pointed at people for a white collar property crime, with no (that I've seen here) evidence of violence or resistance. That's some BS for a use of force complaint, depending on what we don't know.

You won't figure this out because you barely know any of the facts.

 

[Butch]

I’m trying to remember but maybe Ducati is owned by Lamborgini, owned by Audi, owned by Volkswagon. Maybe Cagiva is in there.

Something. Ah, global capitalism.

 

[NorCalBusa]

You won't figure this out because you barely know any of the facts.

So enlighten us.

 

[dravnx]

I don't know anything more then you do but I'm not making assumptions.

 

[bergmen]

My sister-in-law has worked as contractor for power-company in AZ for 15-years now. Bastards...

Oh yeah, in Bay Area, recruiting firms are HUGE part of hiring. They pimp you out for some high hourly-rate. Some agencies even provide some sort of benefits.

Corp-to-corp pays highest hourly-rate. Time to incorporate myself and have my corp pimp me out!

I incorporated and represented myself when contracting. It worked very well for five years at a company in Santa Clara before they saw a way to offer me a permanent full time position in 2013. I'm still there.

Contractor positions are no where near being a full time employee, it is an entirely separate situation. I signed an annual contract that stipulated my position and held me responsible for protecting any IP (signed a non-disclosure agreement). I was no different than any other commodity supplier, I could be let go in the same manner as the company switching power supply distributors.

I knew this going in. I charged accordingly and being an independent I was less expensive than agencies and got a lot more than if I were associated with an agency.

No benefits, I was on my own for health insurance, etc. No worries, I fattened up my bank account to cover things.

It was a good gig.

Dan

 

[KooLaid]

I'm trying to figure out why 30 (or 4, or however many) agents felt they needed their guns out and pointed at people for a white collar property crime, with no (that I've seen here) evidence of violence or resistance. That's some BS for a use of force complaint, depending on what we don't know.

That is not a "use of force". You would definitely know the difference once you've been on the receiving end of one.

I sure hope those pointing the guns at you were using proper trigger finger discipline and didn't actually have their fingers on the trigger.

It's one thing to have a gun pointed at you. It's a whole other level if their finger is actually on the trigger.

Most non gun owners would go straight to "drawn on me" conclusion when really the officer was at "low ready" and scanning.

Or the officer had "his finger on the trigger" looking for a reason to fire, when really it was on the trigger guard over the trigger and.... yes looking for a reason to fire because that's what you're supposed to do.

 

[NorCalBusa]

That is not a "use of force". You would definitely know the difference once you've been on the receiving end of one.
[snip]

The reference I made was in regard to LEO policy and what that determines is Use of Force (and subsequent reporting documentation). Not all agency's such policies are the same, especially lately- I'll leave that to the LEO's to clarify as they see fit. Sorry you didn't see the issue with a white collar/non violent offense and multiple people pointing guns at people as reported.

 

[storm]

Funniest thread I’ve read here for awhile...

pay attention ding dong - this is not something funny.

(take care of your head, Shawn, sorry this happened on you)

 

[ctwo]

It could be funny for people on the outside. I remember when Fry's Electronics was raided in a similar way. It's really not a good thing...

 

[MR662]

The reference I made was in regard to LEO policy and what that determines is Use of Force (and subsequent reporting documentation). Not all agency's such policies are the same, especially lately- I'll leave that to the LEO's to clarify as they see fit. Sorry you didn't see the issue with a white collar/non violent offense and multiple people pointing guns at people as reported.

Not once has someone confirmed why the FBI was there or what they were investigating. You’re assuming it was non violent/white collar crime but you weren’t there. Most agencies, police or FBI have guns drawn during a search warrant entry into home/building because of the unknown threats. Often times firearms are out at low ready. If everyone complies and building is searched, no threats found, firearms are put away. Standard procedure....

 

[superhypered]

pay attention ding dong - this is not something funny.

(take care of your head, Shawn, sorry this happened on you)

They apologized if you had read farther down.

 

[NorCalBusa]

Not once has someone confirmed why the FBI was there or what they were investigating. You’re assuming it was non violent/white collar crime but you weren’t there. Most agencies, police or FBI have guns drawn during a search warrant entry into home/building because of the unknown threats. Often times firearms are out at low ready. If everyone complies and building is searched, no threats found, firearms are put away. Standard procedure....

Of course I wasn't there, but I find it a stretch to think Ducati is in the gun trading business, keeps them in drawers around the office or is involved in any pursuit that requires them. All we know is what we've seen here, knowing its not gospel- cause its the intrawebnet; present something different and we can go from there.

 

[scootergmc]

Of course I wasn't there, but I find it a stretch to think Ducati is in the gun trading business, keeps them in drawers around the office or is involved in any pursuit that requires them. All we know is what we've seen here, knowing its not gospel- cause its the intrawebnet; present something different and we can go from there.

I'll present that those who serve warrants for a living know far more about serving warrants.

 

[ctwo]

Not once has someone confirmed why the FBI was there or what they were investigating...

I think the FBI gave a statement that they were investigating a financial crime. It was the same thing at Fry's - they came in with guns.

(just to clarify, Fry's was the victim of the crime and the owner's/operator's were forewarned of the raid)

 

[ejv]

"I can confirm that FBI San Francisco was at that location on December 17, 2020, to conduct court-authorized law enforcement activity," FBI spokesperson Katherine Zackel told the website. "As of today’s date, no public records are available. Due to the ongoing nature of the investigation, I cannot comment further at this time.". That's the quote I am seeing online that is attributed to the FBI.

Nothing about it being a financial crime and supposing it was, does that mean that there is no possibility of someone inside the building or at the property when the warrant is served that reacts in a way where a gun may be used?

 

[cg_ops]

I think the FBI gave a statement that they were investigating a financial crime. It was the same thing at Fry's - they came in with guns.

Speaking of Fry's, their slow, painful death has been heartbreaking to watch as a gadget geek. It was bad enough when RadioShack went under, now there's NO ubiquitous electronics stores that offer electronic PARTS (like resistors, fuses, diodes, arduino, pc parts, etc... not just your typical Best Buy mainstream doodads).

I've read that it's possible/likely that the only reason any Fry's store is still open is as a bankruptcy tactic - sap as much cash from their assets as possible while they can technically claim they were trying to revive the business. Anyone that walks into a store can plainly see they're not even trying, however.

/soapbox /rant