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HID and LED

ST Guy said:
I know of no vehicles running LEDs for the main lighting. The only LED's you'll see on the front of a vehicle are accent lights, like those on Audis. If someone knows differnent, please inform me.
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More than accent lights. Koito has been developing the technology for some time in collaboration with the NICHIA CORPORATION. The automotive industry refers to them specifically as "White LEDs". See link here.

The Lexus 600h/LS600h L started factory installing them in 2008 models. I think that the price is still in the $800+ range PER bulb:)wtf yes eight-hundred, thats not a typo). See Wikipedia for some additional info, scroll down to LED light sources.
 
ST Guy said:
LED's are the new hope for lighting but it's not there yet for regular headlights. I know of no vehicles running LEDs for the main lighting. The only LED's you'll see on the front of a vehicle are accent lights, like those on Audis. If someone knows differnent, please inform me.
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HD just started offering an LED headlight as an "upgrade" Not worth $400 IMHO
"LED Headlamp and Auxiliary Lamps
Cut through the night. Harley-Davidson® LED Lamps are brighter and whiter in color and provide a superior light pattern over standard incandescent lamps. Compared to the yellow light of a traditional halogen bulb, the LED lamp produces a "Daylight Color Impression" that appears more natural to the user. Headlamps feature 2 horizontal "D" shaped lenses that focus light into a pool in front of the motorcycle, and separate high beam and low beam projector lenses that provide a focused beam of light in front. 4" LED Auxiliary Lamps feature 3 "D" shaped lenses that focus the light, and provide a matching appearance to the LED headlamps. The solid-state LEDs are designed for long life, and the shock- and vibration-resistant lamp assembly mounts into existing light housings. Installation is quick and easy, and the plug-in lamps connect to the factory headlamp wiring. No external ballast or complicated wire harness is required. The LED lamps are DOT approved for use in all 50 states."
73390_10_M_26a97.jpg
 
Hooli said:
Some kits address this issue by using HID bulbs that include a variable shutter. When it's lowered/partially closed you have your low beam. When you raise it (via the hi beam switch) you get full illumination.

The 2009 R1 has such a system, stock.
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When used as an aftermarket HID upgrade, that's only a bandaid and doesn't address the issues of the reflectors and lenses being wrong.

But, if it's set up from the factory that way, then you can be assured that the reflectors and lenses are different from the reflectors and lenses used with halogen bulbs.
 
DYTB said:
More than accent lights. Koito has been developing the technology for some time in collaboration with the NICHIA CORPORATION. The automotive industry refers to them specifically as "White LEDs". See link here.

The Lexus 600h/LS600h L started factory installing them in 2008 models. I think that the price is still in the $800+ range PER bulb:)wtf yes eight-hundred, thats not a typo). See Wikipedia for some additional info, scroll down to LED light sources.
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Hmmmm.....looks like they're getting close. 'Got to get the cost down, then it's a home run.
 
ST Guy said:
When used as an aftermarket HID upgrade, that's only a bandaid and doesn't address the issues of the reflectors and lenses being wrong.
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I've seen knowledgeable owners retrofit their bikes with the switchable bi-xenon HID's and replace the stock halogen reflectors in the headlight housings with projector lenses. :eboy

Happy now? :laughing
 
Hooli said:
I've seen knowledgeable owners retrofit their bikes with the switchable bi-xenon HID's and replace the stock halogen reflectors in the headlight housings with projector lenses. :eboy

Happy now? :laughing
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Delirious! If the reflector and lens is changed, you're good to go as long as it's all put together correctly. Usually, that kind of work is beyond your average happy shade tree mechanic. But nice when done and executed properly. :party
 
JO EBRMC said:
Those are pretty cool but $300-$350? For LEDs?

I think I'll wait until there is some competition in the market.
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That's for the entire kit that includes two lights, two different sets of lenses, harness, brackets, relay and switch. You can get just the lights alone a little cheaper, especially if you go to the source (Vision X off-road lights by Solstice Co) and bypass Twisted Throttle. But then you have to source all the rest of the stuff.

This is a quality product, and it's not a bad deal, especially if you compare motorcycle-specific HID auxiliary kits offered by companies like Piaa.
 
When I install HIDs, I will be including a projector headlight, rather than an ill-suited halogen light housing.
 
Motech said:
That's for the entire kit that includes two lights, two different sets of lenses, harness, brackets, relay and switch. You can get just the lights alone a little cheaper, especially if you go to the source (Vision X off-road lights by Solstice Co) and bypass Twisted Throttle. But then you have to source all the rest of the stuff.

This is a quality product, and it's not a bad deal, especially if you compare motorcycle-specific HID auxiliary kits offered by companies like Piaa.
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Sorry, man, even if somewhat cheaper this ain't cheap and the buyer is getting ripped off. There is no way that LEDs could ever cost anywhere near this. From a manufacturing perspective, they are cheaper to produce than HIDs .

Only the military pays this sort of markup.

Like I said, I'll wait for competition to enter the market. I'm prepared to bet that we'll see the same product for under $50.
 
In a related note, some parts of Santa Cruz are illuminated with LED street lamps. These things are bright. Like, scatters-crackheads/roaches bright. They almost have a white-bluish tints similar to mercury vapor lamps.
 
Karbon said:
In a related note, some parts of Santa Cruz are illuminated with LED street lamps. These things are bright. Like, scatters-crackheads/roaches bright. They almost have a white-bluish tints similar to mercury vapor lamps.
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Hmm...
What are you suggesting? I haz an extension ladder.:rofl
 
Karbon said:
In a related note, some parts of Santa Cruz are illuminated with LED street lamps. These things are bright. Like, scatters-crackheads/roaches bright. They almost have a white-bluish tints similar to mercury vapor lamps.
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IIRC I could have sworn that I saw some LED lighting on the causeway of the San Mateo Bridge...
 
JO EBRMC said:
Sorry, man, even if somewhat cheaper this ain't cheap and the buyer is getting ripped off. There is no way that LEDs could ever cost anywhere near this. From a manufacturing perspective, they are cheaper to produce than HIDs .

Only the military pays this sort of markup.

Like I said, I'll wait for competition to enter the market. I'm prepared to bet that we'll see the same product for under $50.
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It's all P&P man, perspective and priorities. I doubt a $50.00 kit will ever be available that mounts so cleanly and can seriously handle the rigors of off-road motorcycle abuse like this Made in the USA kit can, especially the interchangeable lenses and the proven underwater durability. Might as well zip-tie an LED search lamp to your fork brace.
 
Motech said:
It's all P&P man, perspective and priorities. I doubt a $50.00 kit will ever be available that mounts so cleanly and can seriously handle the rigors of off-road motorcycle abuse like this Made in the USA kit can, especially the interchangeable lenses and the proven underwater durability. Might as well zip-tie an LED search lamp to your fork brace.
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That is exactly the reason for going to LEDs: they are durable as hell.

I also am not sure that I agree that kit mounts all that cleanly. Nor is it very sophisticated in the first place. Sure it might look appropriate on a GS1200 but it looks ridiculous on the Triumph.

A die-cast case is not a quality piece of equipment. It also isn't an expensive piece of equipment.


LEDs are cheap to produce and cheap to implement because they aren't fragile. That is a recipe for low cost. $350 is taking advantage of suckers who have to have the lastest thing. Being an early adopter is fine as long as you are willing to admit to yourself that you are paying way too much for something someone else is going to buy for a quarter the price in a year or so.
 
JO EBRMC said:
$350 is taking advantage of suckers who have to have the lastest thing. Being an early adopter is fine as long as you are willing to admit to yourself that you are paying way too much for something someone else is going to buy for a quarter the price in a year or so.
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Agreed. There's always more to the equation too, so check the numbers on the data sheet and do the math to know HOW much light(lumens) you're actually buying. The amount of light that "Conventional LED" lighting placed in a water-tight housing is for the most-part a function of number of LED's in the array and input power available. For example, look at these street lights. While somewhat unrelated to motorcycle lighting, the basic concept is not that far off. Notice that the Luminous flux (light output) is a linear factor to the number of LED arrays (and to a lesser-degree, input voltage because by the time you add 6 arrays, the Watt per array goes down to 13.8W...but then you are feeding it 230V AC at that point). But basically, you get 1500 Luminous Flux per array in this case.

Anyhow, relating to motos, at 12VDC, you will get like ~400 lm??...I don't know just ask the spec. All I'm saying is ask questions and be informed before you trust your life to seeing whats in front of you for $300 bucks worth of LED lighting. Who knows, maybe this is the "cats meow" and a great value. As always, it's just buyer beware. If you're going to be the DIY'r, you should know a bit about how to engineer power-circuits so you can safely deliver available power. Anyhow, IMO, conventional LED's wired in series to a basic 12VDC harness may give you 50,000 hours of bulb life, but it is NOT going to give you the output lumens of real HID lighting. NO way, no how.
 
DYTB said:
Anyhow, IMO, conventional LED's wired in series to a basic 12VDC harness may give you 50,000 hours of bulb life, but it is NOT going to give you the output lumens of real HID lighting. NO way, no how.
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True enough, but when does the output become too much? When HID kits putting out over 2000 Lumens are so darned bright that your pupils shrink and compromise your night vision in the darkness around you, what new hazards are created?
 
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