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Is MSF really that useful?

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Yes, you are. The book covers the classroom portion of the curriculum. What you are missing is 10 hours of range time.

It has been my experience that even experienced riders come away from the BRC with something worthwhile.
 
FWIW, I had been riding for more than 30 years when I took the MSF with my daughter. I learned some worthwhile stuff. Why not get the easy access to a motorcycle endorsement and the insurance discount that result from completion of the BRC.
 
In the 18+ years that I have taught, it has been my experience that every rider, novice or experienced, finds that more than half of the exercises are 'challenging' to ride. A lot of people forget/do not understand that 'knowing how to ride' and 'knowing how to operate the controls' of a motorcycle are two very different things.

I've read your 'ZX14 or Hyabusa?' thread and would seriously caution you to not make either of those motorcycles a first bike. Now admittedly, you have not shared your riding history yet, so I'm only guessing here, but almost every 'experienced' or 'skilled' motorcyclist is aware of the benefits of the MSF courses. I wouldn't advise either one of those motorcycles for anyone without tens of thousands of miles of riding 'experience' or more importantly skill.

Before we continue here, what type of experience do you have? How long have you been riding? What types of motorcycles? How many miles do you ride a month?
 
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This shit can't be real.

Same with the 14/Busa through - sane people don't ask questions like this. Hell - insane people don't ask questions like this.

Fucking trolls.
 
i didnt learn shit from it, i felt like it was a waste of time and money. i only took it to get my license.
 
msteinberg said:
I already know how to ride and I read the course book for the MSF class:

http://www.msf-usa.org/CurriculumMaterials/BRC_Handbook_VS7_noprnt.pdf

I think most of the information in there is obvious and I don't really see a reason to pay $200 for the class when you can read the book for free. Am I missing something there?
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for $200 you:

  • might learn you learn something you didn't know about.
  • might learn that you can't control a Nighthawk 250 nearly as well as you thought.
  • might learn why a ZX-14 or a 'Busa is not a good bike for beginners.
... considering the cost of replacing fairings, levers and rearsets lost to roadrash, that's an absolute BARGAIN.

but hey, if you just want to play Captain Saucyballs on I-680, i say get the 'Busa. it's got that cool kanji decal on the side. :|
 
Kestrel said:
This shit can't be real.

Same with the 14/Busa through - sane people don't ask questions like this. Hell - insane people don't ask questions like this.

Fucking trolls.
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There was a time in a land.. before the MSF.. before head injuries... when people rode.. without MSF skills... and lived long enough to naysay the MSF..

depends on which generation you talk to on whether it's worth it's salt or not..

Dunno.. one of the old timers I knew who thought the MSF information was hogwash.. is now very much dead from a motorcycle accdient. Would the skills have saved him? dunno.. probably not.. I believe in fate.

I wish like hell he was still around though.. He hadn't finished teaching me how to act/ride.. ;)
 
I've read all the MSF course materials, passed the written and practical exam at the DMV. I just don't see the point of taking the course when I've read all the materials and no one has provided a cogent argument on why I should take it.

Michael
 
the MSF provides instruction that shows you not just how to ride, but how to ride safely. speaking from personal experience, i use what i learned in the BRC everyday and it's helped keep me accident free. i don't think you can put a price on personal safety.
 
There will always be students that have:

-Never ridden before and found the course to have value.
-Never ridden before, passed, and are still confused.
-Never ridden before but constantly talks about wanting wheelies and knee dragging.
-Ridden before (less than 1K miles) and found value in the course.
-Ridden before (less than 1k miles), passed and still stuck in their old habits.
-Ridden before (dirtbike) and still looks down at the ground! :teeth
-Ridden before (over 1K miles) and found value in the course.
-Ridden before (over 1K miles) and found no value to the course. (rarity)
-Ridden before (over 1K miles), found value in the course but still goes back to their old habits.
-Ridden for like (100 years) and knows it all but takes the course just for insurance discount.
and etc and etc ...
 
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I already knew how to ride, or so I thought. Then I took the BRC and learned A LOT. My father took the course about a year ago even though he started riding 30 years ago and he said he learned a lot.

I took the experienced course a year ago. I didn't learn anything, but it helped reenforce that I what I have been doing is correct. I am still glad I took it. Now I look forward to racing schools.
 
Sidewalk said:
...I took the experienced course a year ago. I didn't learn anything, but it helped reenforce that I what I have been doing is correct. I am still glad I took it. Now I look forward to racing schools.
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? did you ride your YSR :toothless :later
 
just the insurance discount for a new rider on one of those bikes will make it worth it.
 
msteinberg said:
I've read all the MSF course materials, passed the written and practical exam at the DMV. I just don't see the point of taking the course when I've read all the materials and no one has provided a cogent argument on why I should take it.

Michael
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Where did you learn how to ride? If self taught or taught by family or friends, then you have more than likely just picked up their habits (good and bad).

There is a huge benefit to being observed (then coached) when riding. Most people feel that they are doing a lot better than they really are. Only when getting coaching from a trained professional do they realize just what they were missing/doing incorrectly.

Would you start other life threatening hobbies such as flying, scuba, parachuting, etc. after just reading a book?

I've taught damn near 100 students a month since 1988. Most of these students read the book, and many passed the written exam(s). 90% of them needed additional coaching and practice to successfully learn the skills required for motorcycling. In every area of learning, training makes someone better than they were. Does it not make sense to become better at motorcycling?

Please share with us what actual riding experience that you have. How long have you been riding? How many miles?
 
msteinberg said:
I just don't see the point of taking the course when I've read all the materials and no one has provided a cogent argument on why I should take it.

Michael
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First reply in this thread:

Baptistro said:
Yes, you are. The book covers the classroom portion of the curriculum. What you are missing is 10 hours of range time.

It has been my experience that even experienced riders come away from the BRC with something worthwhile.
Click to expand...
 
msteinberg said:
I've read all the MSF course materials, passed the written and practical exam at the DMV. I just don't see the point of taking the course when I've read all the materials and no one has provided a cogent argument on why I should take it.

Michael
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I bet.. if you spent 6 hours with me one on one; i could teach you something about riding that you didn't already know; but only if your honest with yourself.. cause the point isn't to make sure anyone else knows that you can ride, it's that you know you can ride.. so.. if there's available training out there than it can't be a waste of time. Some of it might be review.. some might be new.. but everything helps..

This argument is valid; like my not wanting to goto MMI.. I know how to wrench.. but I bet if I went.. I'd learn something.. I just don't want to pay the 20k to go to that school..

This is $200 were talking about... I took the class.. three times over the years before I decided to start teaching it.. and I'm still learning..

The tough part about riding is you never know how much you know until it's to late.. To late cost $$ and = injuries..
 
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