Mastering a 600ss

[ThumperX]

The Other came back from a ride Sunday on my bike. He had a shit eating grin on his face when he asked "you ever take this thing above 7K?"
That's the thing about an I4 600, you really have a couple of different bikes in there. I don't see ever mastering my 600 but I do enjoy riding all the different bikes housed under the tank.
I'm contemplating some suspension mods now that I have almost 20K on THIS Hornet

A liter bike would be nice for longer trips but I don't see stepping up anytime soon.

 

[FickleBiker]

I've been riding big liter bikes, different styles & models, for the last ten years.

Recently I bought a 69hp 645cc SV......,

it may not be as quick/fast in the straights as my Bandit 1250 (39,000 miles), '03 FZ1 (40,000 miles), my Sprint RS (10,000 miles), the RSV1000 (5,000 miles), or the BMW that I rode for 60,000 miles..... it comes close to the kind of power my XL1200'S' put to the rear wheel.

- however -

I find a small, nimble, 'fun' bike in the sub-750cc range to be quite the challenge to throw through the twisties. The little 650 SV is the quickest package I have EVER thrown through Mines, Del Puerto, or to the top of Hamilton..... and if I'm not careful or paying attention, I can get myself into a world of hurt with the quickness!

I don't think one bike can "prepare" you for another/different bike. Regardless of the machine, it's all about knowing what your limits are with regard to staying within your riding ability. One of the exceptions might be a newbie rider under 25 years old.... it might be wise to graduate from small & underpowered machines - in steps - to larger, more powerful machines.

In short, if you're an experienced rider with thousands of miles on one of these modern 600cc sport bikes, you may well be MORE THAN QUALIFIED enough to move up to a heavy liter bike......

 

[Roadstergal]

Think about moving sideways

Or about moving 'up' to a more street-oriented bike (regardless of displacement) for the street. Supersports were made for the track, hence the name.

 

[tuxumino]

you arent going to ride any current sport bike to its full potential on the street not if you want to see your next birthday. Most of us will never ride a bike to its full potential even on the racetrack..

this
the only place you can ride a 600ss to it's full potential is at the track.
do some trackdays, learn what riding in an environment that allows you to focus on just riding, not dodging cars, can do for you.

 

[sanjuro]

Think of it like this:

Any fool can go fast in a straight line.

The real skill is in cornering. If you are taking a particular turn at, let's say 50mph, will it matter if the engine underneath you is pushing 250cc, 600, or 1000?

I think what really matters is suspension, weight, weight distribution, braking, and the other intangibles which fall under handling.

 

[Dr. Evil]

I have been riding off and on for about 7.5 years (about 10-12k miles) on just 500s/600s, I would consider myself to be an ok rider, but far from a great rider.For me a 600ss is more than enough bike. I understand that people buy bigger bikes (ie: 1000cc) because they are very skilled riders or they simply want more torque than a 600ss offers.

Want more tourque? Ride an SV 650.

Questions like this are a big problem, and they cause a lot of keyboards to be worn out in flame wars. The reason for this is that, like ALL questions that ignite fierce debate about a particular topic, it's entirely the WRONG question to ask.

It doesn't matter if you've mastered the bike. Like Karbon touched upon, you probably never will.

The right question to ask is:

Have I mastered MYSELF?

Only you can answer that. You can consult with your fellow riders, get an idea of what their experiences are, but your ability to answer this question depends entirely upon your ability to be honest with yourself. Unlike some other folks in this thread have said (with all due respect to them) the answer to this whole question has nothing DIRECTLY to do with your ability to corner or brake quickly or whatever. The crux of it is:

Do you have the skills and experience to cash the checks my driving habits are going to write against this particular motorcycle?

As I said, your absolute ability to pilot a motorcycle is irrelevant. What matters is your ability to ride RELATIVE to your riding habits. An arthritic old lady on a Hayabusa (however it is that she got there) will probably get into less trouble than an 18 year-old boy on a Ninja 500. Again, can you be honest with yourself about this: "REALISTICALLY, how am I going to behave on this motorcycle?" If so, you'll do fine.

 

[afm199]

I really can't define mastering a 600cc, but basically you would be extremely confident smashing in the twisties, not scarred at all to dip the bike in the corners and not afraid to grab a monster handful of your front brake without concern. Basically you are have acquired enough skill to intimately know your bike and ride it too almost its full capacity. This is the best way I can describe it, or simply say you are so damn good at riding, a 600cc just doesn't do it for you anymore.

There are about 28 guys on the west coast who can ride a 600 to almost its full potential. There are another 200,000 who can't.

 

[slowblood]

OP, think about "where" you ride.
That will better dictate which bike you would want to ride.
ie.. Vegas trip, Sunday rides, cruising on the coastline, commuting to work, adventure dirt roads and camping, touring the Sierras, track day blast....

I think people "move up" to a bigger bike when they find out what they want to use it for ... or it was a real great deal on Craigslist that couldn't be passed up!

 

[Burning1]

500cc, 600cc, 750cc, 1000cc, V-twins, Inline 4's, Triples, etc. I've owned the lot but I have yet to master any of them in the street.

Take me to the track, and that's a whole 'nother story...

Dunno about even the track. I rode the A B and C group at Sears point this weekend. Of the 90 or so riders I saw that day, only a small handful (6? 10?) were anywhere close to riding their bike anywhere near the bike's limit. And even those guys were working hard to get a little more out of it.

I wanted to ask people that ride larger displacement bikes, were you able to master a 600cc before moving up? By mastering a bike, I mean ride it to virtually all of its potential. If so, how long did it take you to confidently master a 600ss? I know riders come in all shapes and sizes and some people just have it in their blood. Was your 600cc not enough bike for you?

No one rides their bikes anywhere near the bikes potential on the street. Some of the fastest street riders I've seen were mid-pack racers, who were just willing to take more risks than most.

The question you should ask yourself, is if you have the judgement to ride a literbike safely. Remember: Below 100mph, A modern literbike is capable of accelerating just about as hard as it can brake. You can get yourself into an unavoidable collision long before you know that you're about to have one. If you have the experience and the judgement to ride something like that safely, I'd encourage you to try one. I personally like big bikes, and find them less fatiguing than small bikes.

BTW... 12K miles is very little riding for someone with more than 6 years of riding experience. That's about 170 miles a month or so, and well below the CA average.

 

[ST Guy]

I wanted to ask people that ride larger displacement bikes, were you able to master a 600cc before moving up? By mastering a bike, I mean ride it to virtually all of its potential.

No. Nobody ever "masters" a motorcycle. They get better than they were (hopefully). One is always a student and forever improving their skills. Even the top riders in superbike and MotoGP are doing that. None have or will "master" a bike.

Reasons for getting a different bike include wanting more power (for whatever reason), a physically larger bike that doesn't feel so cramped or can take a passenger in more comfort, a bike that's specialized for a different purpose (sport touring, dual sport, etc.), ya like the looks, it's more reliable, you've always lusted after one, etc., etc., etc.

Don't expect to "master" your current bike. You will, hopefully, just get better at riding overall. And someday you may feel, for example, like you want a bike with hard luggage, a fairing that actually protects you, shaft drive so you don't have to fool with lubing a chain, etc., so you can go sport touring. You'll never "master" that bike either, but it will still be a hell of a lot of fun.

Until you get a hankerin' for some other bike.

 

[russ69]

There are about 28 guys on the west coast who can ride a 600 to almost its full potential. There are another 200,000 who can't.

There are just a handful, if you count both north and south. It takes a lot of talent to master a 600.
If it makes you feel any better (the OP), it took me 10 years to learn how to ride and that was riding everyday. It's a little easier today with the abundance of track days they have. The key is trying to dissect your riding and move forward, that gets hard to do on the street but you can become a very solid street rider if you work at it. The bike doesn't matter, rider confidence is what matters. Once you are a confident rider, you'll be able to jump on any bike and feel comfortable on it.

 

[ST Guy]

Oh, and the number of people in this world who can ride any bike even close to all of it's potential is very, very small. Read the rider entry list of MotoGP or some other series and you'll find a list of people who've ridden motorcycles far, far closer to their potential than any of us mere mortals. However, they have still never "mastered" them.

And just because you've never ridden a bike close to it's potential, that doesn't preclude you from getting another bike.

 

[flying_hun]

Oh... and I'd take the comments about needing a liter bike to ride two-up with a grain of salt. I ride two-up fairly often on a 40hp or so DRZ. No problem at all keeping a spirited pace. If anything, it's more difficult on the liter bike because of the way the pillion's weight is carried on the bike. Keeping the front wheel planted (hell, keeping it on the pavement) is much more challenging.

OP, I've ridden with a number of the posters in this thread, including Ogg. One difference between the ones I've ridden with and your description of yourself is experience. For lots of folks 10-12k miles would be a low mileage year. Whatever you ride, ride more. Ride with people you can learn from. Expose yourself to training and feedback whenever you can. Put in the miles - whatever you're riding - and you'll get better.

As for the idea listed above about needing a big bike to ride two-up, I agree with Ogg. I've done some miles with my lovely spouse two-up on the Versys, and it's fine. Those who know me are aware that even riding by myself that I'm equivalent to most people riding two-up. I know for a fact that 60 hp will do the trick. Ogg is a skinny guy, so 35 does it for him.

FWIW, right now I have a 650, a 955, and an 1100. I actually like the 650 the best for most riding.

Good luck,

 

[Karbon]

OP, I've ridden with a number of the posters in this thread, including Ogg. One difference between the ones I've ridden with and your description of yourself is experience. For lots of folks 10-12k miles would be a low mileage year. Whatever you ride, ride more. Ride with people you can learn from. Expose yourself to training and feedback whenever you can. Put in the miles - whatever you're riding - and you'll get better.

This.

You may not be able to afford or partake different types/styles of riding (dirt, stunt, trials, ect.) OP, but it goes without saying, try to keep an open mind about ALL types of riding, as it pertains to technique or methodology.

Osmotically, the kind of insight you can glean from just merely having an open mind will surprise you in many ways.

Good luck out there!

 

[ThumperX]

OK I have to say it...
It isn't what you ride it's how you ride it.
My SO is a freaking machine on anything. As I mentioned earlier out of 9 bikes he seems to always take my 600.

 

[Roadstergal]

Just to add to the above - t'ain't all mileage. You can rack up 10K+ miles in a year and learn nothing. You can do half that and learn a lot by using some of the many learning tools available - track days with instruction, supermoto schools, the array of dirt schools available.

 

[ThumperX]

Just to add to the above - t'ain't all mileage. You can rack up 10K+ miles in a year and learn nothing. You can do half that and learn a lot by using some of the many learning tools available - track days with instruction, supermoto schools, the array of dirt schools available.

and you can always ride with me if you want to see how to do it wrong and get an ego boost

 

[reidconti]

I'd rather ride lots of different kinds of bikes than always be looking for "more better faster".

Swap the 4 banger for a twin, or a single, or a triple.

I did 12k miles in a little over a year on my first bike (F3), and never even got "good". YMMV.

 

[Cali]

I thought I was quick till I did a racing school and was on the track with some WMRRA and OMRRA title holders. No matter what I thought before, I'm slow compared to them and am nowhere near mastering a 600 or riding to its limits. And that's after a few track days, racing school, 60,000+ street miles...

 

[stan23]

Also, no 2 riders have the same natural talent. You can get a guy riding the same bike for 100 trackdays, and not have much bike control.

You can compare that with guys of natural talent and can hop on a bike at the track and find the limits pretty quickly.