Moto GP gone from Laguna Seca / Mazda Raceway

[Bowling4Bikes]

fuck

 

[sidewazzz]

Not this past year. We revamped the ticket process, they all get scanned.

That's why I said past few years. I only recall tickets being scanned two years (the 1st year and this year). When you consider 100k in attendance per year... 15% of 600k is a rather large number to be taking a hit on in the 1st place.

Not sure why scanning tickets was overlooked in the 1st place.

 

[Bowling4Bikes]

What happens to the yearly reserved camp sites? Bam! You get them for WSBK?

On that note. did they have Moto camping on Fox Hill for the race?

just called them...

I believe I just got the royal screw treatment.

I don't know if they're going to honor them for a replacement race...but it won't be for WSBK is what they said.

 

[Deftone]

.....GP could only hope to be like F1, ....

Motorcyclists are a unique demographic. What works in auto racing may not work in motorcycle racing. See: DMG.

just called them...

I believe I just got the royal screw treatment.

I don't know if they're going to honor them for a replacement race...but it won't be for WSBK is what they said.

It's not LS' fault. Blame Dorna. They pulled the plug.

 

[stangmx13]

Formula 1 is auto manufacturer money. The entire motorcycle industry is just a tiny fraction of what the auto industry makes. NASCAR has seen declining attendance for the last several years but will probably rebound with the economy.

no, its not. F1 teams are separate entities from any of the manufacturers. they have their own budgets, their own sponsors, and manage their own assets. hell, RedBull is funded predominantly by RedBull, not Infiniti or Renault. plus, F1 pays out a ton for the constructors championship which seriously impacts the front 4 teams' budgets, the ones that u think get their $$ from auto manufacturers.

F1 is a fucking joke! Bernie is setting up races in countries where they have to pay the people to fill up the stands...seriously! The only requirement is that they have to pay Bernie's fee. Meanwhile, they have moved the racing away from the biggest groups of racing fans.

source?

Fewer races in the U.S right now and likely fewer races in the future as more tracks can't afford Dorna's fees. As I stated in other posts, the F1 or NFL model will not be good for the sport, IMO. The motorcycle market is not a $200 a ticket market in the US or around the globe. The moto market will always be smaller with far less funding and less ability to attract sponsors.

thats def true in the US, but i seriously doubt u have any justification that its true elsewhere. the popular rounds elsewhere are packed and they are obviously charging the right amount. im not saying they should charge $200, but if they could and still fill the stands, it wouldnt be bad for anyone in GP.

Yes Dorna is marginalizing WSBK. What are they doing to bring money into the series or increase grids? Its clear they want manufacturers in GP and a bunch of poorly supported privateer teams in WSBK. Are any riders making any more money? Are they best riders attracted to the series? Ezpeleta lying about teams using 34 engines to get his way? Doesn't seem like Dorna is making an effort to improve anything?

so the things i did list didnt make WSBK more popular w/ fans, thereby increasing viewership and making it easier for teams to find sponsorship? Dorna is much much better at funding than InFront was.

poorly supported privateer teams? how are any of the teams poorly supported? Dorna has brought costs down marginally in the past year and next years rule changes will have another big impact. if anything, privateer teams were heavily supported but will not need all that $$ to survive in coming years. cost of entry comes down and grids will fill up.

u think Carmelo published that WSBK uses 34 engines? u realize that rumor came out like 1-2yrs before the Bridgepoint owned InFront and Dorna. tin-foil hat?

why the hell would the best riders want to go to WSBK? its never been the top level, never. at one point, even AMA was at a higher level than WSBK.

The big picture is a more corporate approach to control every aspect of MotoGP hasn't improved the product for consumers. Dorna has a hand in deciding which manufacuteres compete, which riders get seats and even which satellite teams get which particlar levels of support. Look at the problems MotoGP is facing:
- Does anyone think really think the Honda / Yamaha dominance will end anytime soon? The grid is haves and havenots and what is Dorna doing about that?
- That other teams will suddenly spend $40 or $50 million to compete?
- The majority of the grid across all MotoGP classes is paying or bringing money for rides. Riding for free? How is that good for the sport? How does that attract riders?
- Only tracks with public subsidies can get races?

This are the long-term trends and thats what we should be concerned about.

TL/DR version: Money is only flowing to one entity. That is a problem.

is false to assume that because the problem exists, someone isnt doing something about it.

Dorna is pressuring the factories to limit Spanish riders because an all Spanish world championship is bad for the series. world-wide viewership drops when a variety of countries arent represented. when viewership drops, less $$ comes into the sport.

Dorna took the rulebook back from HRC/Yamaha. their dominance is because Ducati sux, not because Dorna is playing favorites. Suzuki and Aprilia are coming (back) into the sport because of the rule changes. how is that bad for GP?

what other teams should spent 40-50M euros to compete? Duc's budget probably isnt that high, but giving them an extra 10M probably wouldnt help since they cant even improve a tiny bit. Suzuki and Aprilia def wont spend that much because the rule changes have made the point of entry cheaper. rly, they wouldnt be in GP without the changes.

you are using the US as a broad example for tracks getting govt subsidies to remain on the calendar. really, that doesnt apply to half the other tracks. if Carmelo charges more, the better more popular rounds stay and the weaker less popular ones get dropped. again, not bad for the sport.

u seriously need to read more about any of this before starting to type. your opinions arent even close to fact when they are contrary to what is actually going on.

 

[stangmx13]

Motorcyclists are a unique demographic. What works in auto racing may not work in motorcycle racing. See: DMG.

thats not what i said. please take my words at face value. at least u acknowledge that things from successful auto racing MAY work in GP.

i could go into detail about how GP is already benefiting from being more like F1, but thatd be a very very long post.

 

[Kurosaki]

On a related topic, BEin sport needs to bring their own crew and production team to any future races here in the States if they want to build the brand. Watching Greg White during the Superpole broadcast sitting on a stool in the Laguna parking lot reading at a 6th grade level from a note pad was beyond awful. The cracked, oil soaked pavement and trash cans as a backdrop was priceless. I expect that from the DMG train wreck, but c'mon WSB?

You guys just need to stop watching terrible TV broadcasts.

Gluttons for punishment, you are.

 

[Map8]

u seriously need to read more about any of this before starting to type. i have a feeling that u dont actually know as much as u think u do. your opinions arent even close to fact when they contradict what is actually going on.

so the things i did list didnt make WSBK more popular w/ fans, thereby increasing viewership and making it easier for teams to find sponsorship? Dorna is much much better at funding than InFront was.

Great. Name some sponsors that have come as a result of Dorna's efforts. You just claimed thats its easier to get sponsors now.

u think Carmelo published that WSBK uses 34 engines? u realize that rumor came out like 1-2yrs before the Bridgepoint owned InFront and Dorna. tin-foil hat?

The engine allocation system had long been expected, after Carmelo Ezpeleta made a series of barbed (and misleading) attacks on the number of engines supposedly used by Aprilia in WSBK in 2011 and 2012.

http://motomatters.com/analysis/2013/08/27/analyzing_the_details_of_the_2014_world_.html

Ezpeleta repeated the 34 engine comments.

what other teams should spent 40-50M euros to compete? Duc's budget probably isnt that high, but giving them an extra 10M probably wouldnt help since they cant even improve a tiny bit. Suzuki and Aprilia def wont spend that much because the rule changes have made the point of entry cheaper. rly, they wouldnt be in GP without the changes.

There is a difference between just being on the grid and being competitive. You just made my argument. Other teams don't have the money won't be able to compete with Honda/Yamaha. That is not going to change with the current managment and structure.

Just think critically for a moment about the long term. Think about what GP was like ten years ago, what has happened in those ten years and the direction its going. More money for flowing to Dorna. More control for Dorna. More expense for everyone else. Thats the big picture.

 

[kevin 714]

Ten years ago no one outside of a Honda could compete.

Yahmaha didbt win a single race in 2003 and Ducati won one.

 

[weasel]

just called them...

I believe I just got the royal screw treatment.

I don't know if they're going to honor them for a replacement race...but it won't be for WSBK is what they said.

See what I was getting at huh?

fuck

 

[Maddevill]

Waiting to see if our GP campsite will be transferred to WSB. It would suck for a loyal, (20+ year) fan to lose our campsite due to the GP cancellation. I don't relish the idea of having to fight over a new campsite.

 

[stangmx13]

Great. Name some sponsors that have come as a result of Dorna's efforts. You just claimed thats its easier to get sponsors now.

http://motomatters.com/analysis/2013/08/27/analyzing_the_details_of_the_2014_world_.html

Ezpeleta repeated the 34 engine comments.

There is a difference between just being on the grid and being competitive. You just made my argument. Other teams don't have the money won't be able to compete with Honda/Yamaha. That is not going to change with the current managment and structure.

Just think critically for a moment about the long term. Think about what GP was like ten years ago, what has happened in those ten years and the direction its going. More money for flowing to Dorna. More control for Dorna. More expense for everyone else. Thats the big picture.

ha, u roll your eyes but fail to address even half my points, my rebuttals. good one.

list of sponsors that are a result of Dorna's efforts? u should know thats not possible. there no possible way to know what sponsors would have been attained without improvements to the series because they did happen. but ive given examples improvements that Dorna has made and uve just said "no they didnt" or "its not helping".

you argument that teams need 40-50M to compete with HRC/Yam is ridiculous. even if u gave EVERY team on the grid the same amount of $$, someone would always go faster than someone else. its IMPOSSIBLE for every team to be equally competitive. there isnt enough talent in the world, in development, management, and riding to make an entire grid of race teams competitive. its especially important in development which is why all the factories seem to poach each others technicians. u should know that making a GP bike is hard, its not just about $$.

GP 10 years ago? u talk about no one besides Honda and Yamaha being able to compete, yet 10yrs ago Rossi won everything. it took a number of contributing things to fail in 2006 to end his streak. there were 3 diff winners in 03', 4 winners in 01', 02', 04' & 05', and we all know how 06' was a crazy outlier. so really, this year w/ 4 winners is more of the same.

besides the actual results, so much else has changed since 10yrs ago. GP is actually hurting today because it was so successful 10yrs ago. tobacco sponsorship inflated the budgets of all the teams and it was no big deal at the time because tobacco just paid for it. of course, that was unsustainable, so i dont want to go back to that. energy drinks will never make that same mistake today and GP (or practically any racing) should never spend that much $$ again. on the technical side of 10yrs ago, i dont want to go back to the overnight tire and other examples of companies/entities getting to decide who wins before the race even starts. id love it if all the teams got 24L of fuel like back in the day... but the reduction of fuel was never Dorna's rule and they are fighting today to push the grid that way. next years rules will exist for 3yrs and the entire time, Dorna will be fighting for spec electronics w/ 24L and unified rules between all teams.

more $$ flowing to Dorna? sure, but do u know what they do with it? Dorna makes very little profit each year because the majority of their revenue is used to subsidize the entire series. the report two years ago or so was that Dorna spends $220M euro subsidizing all the GP teams. it was something like 50M to HRC, 30M to Yam, and less to the rest. but of course, that was when such a large portion of the bikes were RCVs. i doubt HRC is getting such a large piece of the pie today. yes, Dorna has more control by pulling back the rulebook... but they are supporting the entire series with that control. without those subsidies, we wouldnt be able to watch GP racing. thats fine if you dont like what Dorna is doing, but they are better at their jobs than u even know.

 

[kevin 714]

Ten years ago aside from repsol, most the major teams were tobacco sponsored

Marlboro ducati
Gaulioses yamaha
Camel Honda
Fortuna yamaha

And telefonica was chased out by repsol in the 2006 preseason pedrosa debacle

 

[kevin 714]

And now Dorna subsidizes just about every non factory team

 

[sidewazzz]

Ten years ago aside from repsol, most the major teams were tobacco sponsored

Marlboro ducati
Gaulioses yamaha
Camel Honda
Fortuna yamaha

And telefonica was chased out by repsol in the 2006 preseason pedrosa debacle

If tabacco companies were allowed to still sponcer sports and display their brand all aspects of racing would be very healthly.

 

[stangmx13]

If tabacco companies were allowed to still sponcer sports and display their brand all aspects of racing would be very healthly.

i often wonder if this would be true. here in the US, weve kind of shamed smokers into not smoking, so maybe they sell less and have less $$ for sponsorship. this probably isnt true elsewhere in the world.

perhaps tobacco sponsorship would be at the same level as energy drinks, healthy but not dependent. either way, i wouldnt argue more $$ in the sport.

 

[Spec-ECU]

Ten years ago aside from repsol, most the major teams were tobacco sponsored

Marlboro ducati
Gaulioses yamaha
Camel Honda
Fortuna yamaha

And telefonica was chased out by repsol in the 2006 preseason pedrosa debacle

If tabacco companies were allowed to still sponcer sports and display their brand all aspects of racing would be very healthly.

i often wonder if this would be true. here in the US, weve kind of shamed smokers into not smoking, so maybe they sell less and have less $$ for sponsorship. this probably isnt true elsewhere in the world.

perhaps tobacco sponsorship would be at the same level as energy drinks, healthy but not dependent. either way, i wouldnt argue more $$ in the sport.

Is Laguna Seca worth it to take up smoking?

That is the question.

 

[Tharkûn]

Glory days!

 

[rmcobb]

Waiting to see if our GP campsite will be transferred to WSB. It would suck for a loyal, (20+ year) fan to lose our campsite due to the GP cancellation. I don't relish the idea of having to fight over a new campsite.

Keep waiting but WSBK is a totally separate event that had everyone call in for camping when that event was announced. If that event stays at Laguna, those who had campsites for WSBK will be offered those same sites. Everyone else will have to call in on the day they announce that tickets for the 2014 event go on sale. The good news is that I'm sure there will be spots available as this past weekend I saw many open spots.

 

[mel3535]

So why is it tht tabaco do any sponsor GP teams any more? I know they don't in F1 also anymore. Are they not allowed to by law or something?