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replica vintage

will be interesting to discuss the meaning of “altered” here, maybe it wouldn’t apply to our stack of fresh Crocker cases that someone is knowingly putting numbers on with an intent to deceive.

SFMCjohn, you probably hit the nail on the head. I think the key statement here is "intent to deceive". I don't see any problem with a stack of replica engine cases without knowing how they are being represented to the public(?) I think those details are what's missing from this discussion. I assume that is possibly what the OP was alluding to in his initial conversation about DMV issues.:dunno
 
...anyway, don’t think we’re talking about the awesome people who make their own frames and get them properly registered honestly for the street, so my pal wasn’t thinking of what you do, framemaker. :gsxrgrl

Hah.. Thanks!

I will say that I've done a lot of research and have had numerous conversations with CHP vehicle inspection officers over the years. I can say that there is a lot of gray area when it comes to VIN tampering and what is and isn't allowed when building or modification of vehicle frames.

My go-to question when I meet a new CHP inspection officer is this hypothetical question... "if I cut the tail off my motorcycle frame so that I can relocate the tail light... most would agree no problem. If I cut the steering head off (with the VIN stamp) and graft a new frame onto it, most would agree that is illegal. So where is the line between those two points where I can and can't modify or re-construct a frame?" That usually leaves them stumped. Although I did have one officer say that he'd be okay with a complete frame grafted onto a steering head "if the welds looked professionally done". :wow
 
:thumbup

just find all this stuff fascinating ... getting involved in showing old bikes sounds like fun to me.

anyway, don’t think we’re talking about the awesome people who make their own frames and get them properly registered honestly for the street, so my pal wasn’t thinking of what you do, framemaker. :gsxrgrl

this is, I think, responsive to the OP? explains Mr Bojangle’s link, a bit, and supports his take:



there may be a better VC section, idk.

will be interesting to discuss the meaning of “altered” here, maybe it wouldn’t apply to our stack of fresh Crocker cases that someone is knowingly putting numbers on with an intent to deceive.

can’t imagine there isn’t case law that clarifies someone simply putting fresh numbers on a fresh part as opposed to sanding one off first. would think in the car world everything under the sun has been seen before?

fun to think about ... :party

(have been told that “wobbler” means it can be charged as either a felony or a misdemeanor. Mr Bojangles references it, above. in my example to my friend I included the fraudulent intent of our stack of new Crocker cases, so he went with felony, I guess, assuming this was the VC section he had in mind.

here’s an extra credit question, is felony altering 16mo/2 years or 3 years the prison term, assuming we still sent people to prison?)

No, that's per 1170(h) P.C. That could include some county jail time and supervised release. Can't go to state prison for property crimes anymore.
 
Hah.. Thanks!

I will say that I've done a lot of research and have had numerous conversations with CHP vehicle inspection officers over the years. I can say that there is a lot of gray area when it comes to VIN tampering and what is and isn't allowed when building or modification of vehicle frames.

My go-to question when I meet a new CHP inspection officer is this hypothetical question... "if I cut the tail off my motorcycle frame so that I can relocate the tail light... most would agree no problem. If I cut the steering head off (with the VIN stamp) and graft a new frame onto it, most would agree that is illegal. So where is the line between those two points where I can and can't modify or re-construct a frame?" That usually leaves them stumped. Although I did have one officer say that he'd be okay with a complete frame grafted onto a steering head "if the welds looked professionally done". :wow

now what about cutting the head off a frame, adjusting the geometry (raking, whatever) and reattaching? Lots and lots of gray
 
the thread title "Replica vintage" 2 words 180 degree opposed.
this is about NEW vehicles NOT vintage vehicles.
 
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search youtube for crushing Harleys or ferraris or lamborghini

this is not what I want to see to happen to replica bikes so I am not going to police as suggested
 
Hah.. Thanks!

I will say that I've done a lot of research and have had numerous conversations with CHP vehicle inspection officers over the years. I can say that there is a lot of gray area when it comes to VIN tampering and what is and isn't allowed when building or modification of vehicle frames.

My go-to question when I meet a new CHP inspection officer is this hypothetical question... "if I cut the tail off my motorcycle frame so that I can relocate the tail light... most would agree no problem. If I cut the steering head off (with the VIN stamp) and graft a new frame onto it, most would agree that is illegal. So where is the line between those two points where I can and can't modify or re-construct a frame?" That usually leaves them stumped. Although I did have one officer say that he'd be okay with a complete frame grafted onto a steering head "if the welds looked professionally done". :wow

well, something else I’ve learned in this thread. always thought the titled steering head trick was kosher ... disappointing. :nchantr

No, that's per 1170(h) P.C. That could include some county jail time and supervised release. Can't go to state prison for property crimes anymore.

OK, think I got it, now.
wasn’t really correct to say that it was a felony. :thumbup
 
OK, think I got it, now.
wasn’t really correct to say that it was a felony. :thumbup

No, THAT part was correct. :laughing

It is a felony. AB 109 changed property crime felonies to no longer be eligible for state prison. 1170 P.C. was created, and subsection (h) outlines the sentences as local county only. A person convicted of such a felony can do some county jail time and/or PRCS supervised release. They can no longer go to state prison, and they are supervised by county probation, not parole. A whole ton of felony crimes were affected.
 
what part is vague ?

the title says "replica vintage"
 

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The vague part is why you are choosing this issue to get worked up about. It is merely and interesting fact of life for us. Why is it personal for you?
 
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