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Seeking like minded pediatrician

Saul Goode said:
Thats a really cute conclusion you're coloring in there.

Already assuming bad intent ?

I on the other hand would venture to guess the LEO's just might be a bit suspect about a product still in beta, being forced on kids, from a company with a criminal past

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/just...gest-health-care-fraud-settlement-its-history
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So, I am not here to hate on you, I do not really agree with your position, but that is ok. I'm just curious now that Phizer is no longer on an emergency approval and fully FDA approved, in addition to their approval in Albania, Austria, Azerbaijan, Belgium, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Czechia, Denmark, Estonia, Faroe Islands, Finland, France, Georgia, Germany, Greece, Greenland, Hungary, Iceland, Ireland, Italy, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Monaco, Netherlands, North Macedonia, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Republic of Moldova, Romania, Serbia, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, The Vatican, Australia, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Brunei Darussalam, Indonesia, Iraq, Israel, Japan, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Malaysia, Maldives, Mongolia, New Zealand, Oman, Pakistan, Philippines, Qatar, Republic of Korea, Saudi Arabia, Sri Lanka, Thailand, the United Arab Emirates, Vietnam, and the West Bank.

What is your continuing protest of the developed results?
 
I think what often gets lost in these discussions is the question is not “are vaccine safe” it’s “are vaccines safer than not vaccines”. A vaccine could kill within 15 minutes a certain portion of those who take it and still be a good idea.

I also think we spend way too little time talking about vaccines as something you do to help others as opposed to just protecting yourself.
 
The Herman Cain Awards are the end result of leopards eating your face.
 
Saul Goode said:
Not exactly, but I'm glad you mentioned this. I'm actually outraged how little wellness and health marketing is happening and only a single, one track approach (jabz) is in the spotlight.
(which btw I support everyone's choice who wants it)
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OP mentions health...
which I assume means "vitamins" and "healthy lifestyle".

Well, the sub-forum quoted above:
https://www.reddit.com/r/HermanCainAward/

in the first top post that I just saw today:
https://www.reddit.com/r/HermanCain...l_i_finally_caught_the_damn_rona_but_instead/

Mentions exactly the same thing in one of the images. .. "oh my buddy told me to take vitamins":


so maybe this "live healthy, avoid the vaccine" stereotypes are just that: stereotypes, repeated from the internet.. and they are wrong; Vitamins= not enough.
 
Saul Goode said:
Whats the likelyhood of a toddler being exposed to Hep?
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Actually, more common than you think. Anti-vax sister in law spouted the same line. "My toddler isn't having sex, why should they get this vaccine." Turns out there are plenty of other ways to catch multiple varieties of Hep (A/B/C)... and it could be as simple as coming into contact with blood from an infected person... Playground accident, foodservice incident.. who knows.

"I'm not anti-vax".. oh please. Line after line of your own dialogue has proven that to be not true.

Honestly puzzled why this thread is still open.... Openly soliciting fraud on a public forum, not to mention the baiting by the OP.
 
Karbon said:
We all should tbqh.
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I find that most of reddit is a bigger, wilder version of barf. it's just a big internet forum. Some good, some bad, sometimes an interesting discussion.

That's just not the reddit that draws the outside attention.
 
bpw said:
I think what often gets lost in these discussions is the question is not “are vaccine safe” it’s “are vaccines safer than not vaccines”. A vaccine could kill within 15 minutes a certain portion of those who take it and still be a good idea.

I also think we spend way too little time talking about vaccines as something you do to help others as opposed to just protecting yourself.
Click to expand...

This is true, but also, for these vaccines we can actually just ask 'are the vaccines safe' without any qualifications. With the billions of doses administered so far around the world for the various different vaccines, there are zero deaths that can be directly attributed to the vaccines.

(https://www.politifact.com/factchec...ar-evidence-covid-19-vaccines-have-caused-an/)

You are right on the part about focusing too much on 'protecting yourself' and not about helping others.

To borrow from the OP. Not getting vaccinated means that you hate 'fun' and 'freedom', because not getting vaccinated means you are contributing to keeping the entire country stuck in this ongoing plague. Most people want to get beyond the current situation, to be able to go to big concerts or pubs or anything else with lots of people without having to constantly mask up and worry about whether someone in the crowd is going to give us COVID. We all want to get back to living life normally. The only way to actually get there is for everyone who can get vaccinated to do so, and by doing so stop the spread of COVID and wipe out the virus. Without that, we are just going to be stuck with this shit.

Being pro vaccine is the pro freedom, pro fun, and patriotic thing to do. Being anti vax is anti freedom and anti America.
 
Sheep 101: sheep behavior. Sheep have a strong instinct to follow the sheep in front of them. When one sheep decides to go somewhere, the rest of the flock usually follows, even if it is not a good "decision." For example, sheep will follow each other to slaughter. ... This instinct is "hard-wired" into sheep.

There just isnt any good LeaderSheep any more.

LETS GO BRANDON!
 
scratchpad said:
Sheep 101: sheep behavior. Sheep have a strong instinct to follow the sheep in front of them. When one sheep decides to go somewhere, the rest of the flock usually follows, even if it is not a good "decision." For example, sheep will follow each other to slaughter. ... This instinct is "hard-wired" into sheep.

There just isnt any good LeaderSheep any more.

LETS GO BRANDON!
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You know why sheep do that? Because it provides the highest odds of survival.

Unlike your average anti-vaccer, sheep at least understand the concept of optimizing behavior for preferable outcomes.
 
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clutchslip said:
30K people isn't enough testing for you?
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My concern is exactly that: how much testing is enough? I've been part of a clinical trial for a vaccine for a condition known as C. Diff, or Clostridioides difficile, for about 3 1/2 years now. It was scheduled to be completed this past June but the manufacturer, Pfizer, extended it for another 6 months because they did not have enough data to declare it safe yet. Typically clinical trials ALWAYS take years to complete, once a vaccine is developed, and we're now told that vaccines can be developed, fully tested, and released in less than 6 months - what makes this vaccine so much better than all other vaccines that take years to release?
 
History won't look too kindly in regards to the way we treated each other during this pandemic.
 
Alan_Hepburn said:
what makes this vaccine so much better than all other vaccines that take years to release?
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Volume.

How many people are in your c. diff. study?
How often are people generally exposed to c. diff.?

Answer? Probably not that many, and exposure is rare. (It's just super nasty when people do get it.)

Covid was unusual: they had a zillion volunteers in the study, and also enormous numbers of people with likely exposure. Many volunteers worked in healthcare, and thus were certainly 'sharing the air' with sick people.




What's missing is tweaks. The results were "good enough, let's go with this". But it turns out that 3 weeks is really not as good as a longer duration for a second dose of, say pfizer. Thus leading to confusion around boosters. (As far as I know, they're useful but not super important--and certainly not as important as getting everyone in the world up to one dose). Or the J&J vax (always was known to be not as good as the mRNA ones, but again it was good enough to encourage people to get it vs nothing).

Or true long term results. But results from earlier similar mRNA vaccines and other vaccines that the chance of long term issues is slim to none.

(remember SARS in 2003? It stopped because everyone who was infectious had a high fever and could easily be quarantined. But they still started down the vaccine path and did tests.)


=

Anyway, I feel for people avoiding the vaccine. Knowing who to trust is hard. The 'authorities' have occasionally broken trust, scam artists are taking advantage of that, and the rest of us have to figure out which is which.

My recommendation as to who to follow? Go look up Zeynep Tufecki who has gotten almost everything reporting on both the medical AND sociological front. She's been following these issues for years, reporting on the errors of the system and those taking advantage of it. And the successes of the system! Because the actual 'medical' part is a success, it's the 'social' part which is not.
 
We probably disagree on who's behaving like sheep. Authorities baaaahhd, I'm going to try this other shit some people told me about.

scratchpad said:
Sheep 101: sheep behavior. Sheep have a strong instinct to follow the sheep in front of them. When one sheep decides to go somewhere, the rest of the flock usually follows, even if it is not a good "decision." For example, sheep will follow each other to slaughter. ... This instinct is "hard-wired" into sheep.

There just isnt any good LeaderSheep any more.

LETS GO BRANDON!
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mbsv said:
Volume.

How many people are in your c. diff. study?
How often are people generally exposed to c. diff.?

Answer? Probably not that many, and exposure is rare. (It's just super nasty when people do get it.)

Covid was unusual: they had a zillion volunteers in the study, and also enormous numbers of people with likely exposure. Many volunteers worked in healthcare, and thus were certainly 'sharing the air' with sick people.
Click to expand...


As far as the speed of development, there are two main things that sped up the development of these vaccines

1. They weren’t starting from scratch. They already had a head start with the development for SARS 1. That gave them a good starting point that helped them already understand doses and effects.

2. For normal vaccine development, what takes forever is that after each step, the researcher has to publish their data and go back to requesting money for the next development step. Usually 6 months to a year between development steps spent raising money to proceed with the next phase. There was so much money thrown at these vaccines that there was zero wait time in between steps.

Regarding Pfizer vs Moderna, one key difference is that Pfizer purposely reduced the dose of their vaccine in an attempt to reduce side effects from the vaccine. This is why people suspect that the Moderna vaccine will produce longer term protection. The protection for both vaccines wane at the same rate, but Moderna’s higher dose means that they start at a higher level of protection than Pfizer.

The challenge with understanding is that we currently do not have what is called a “correlate of protection.” Right now, everyone is just measuring the number of antibodies in a person’s system and just assuming that this correlated to the overall protection from the virus. Papers are starting to show data that the level of antibodies are not a direct indicator of the level of protection a person has. Nobody has spent any time measuring levels of B and T cells to find out how those levels correlate.

So, there are still a lot of unknowns. But, we do know that all the vaccines are very effective at keeping you alive or out of the hospital while unvaccinated people have a 1 in 50 chance of death and an even higher chance of getting long term effects from the virus.

But, I’m apparently just a sheep, so just ignore everything I’ve posted.
 
Blankpage said:
Could be the anti vaxxers are waiting for more data
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There has never been any side effect that was unknown appeared more than 6 weeks after immunization from basically any vaccine in history. Go look for yourself (https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/concerns-history.html). This doesn't mean its IMPOSSIBLE, but it's never happened yet, so lets be smart about this considering the many billions of doses given out already.

People like the OP (and certain people in my family/friend group) are contrarian and THINK they know more than researchers, scientists, and doctors around the world. they are room temp IQ morons plain and simple. I'm not a medical expert in the slightest, but I can at least look at high level data, and what the professionals are saying and come to a reasonable conclusion based on the data available.

Hermain cain awards sure are fun to sift through :laughing. Clowns.
 
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