Thoughts from a newbie

[riskybug]

I've never done this before, but... gotta have a first for everything.


Hi, whoever's reading this! How's it going?

I'm a 23-year old art student who's fighting back his fears. I've always wanted to ride a motorcycle since I was little, but... I was scared because it's dangerous.

In a pursuit to try to not be scared of life, I've been pushing myself to talk to at least 2 strangers a day. One week ago, I mustered up all my courage and approached someone carrying a motorcycle helmet. I remember asking him, "Isn't it dangerous?"
He replied back calmly, "What isn't?". It set off something in me.

I've been fervent and diligent in doing what research I could -- a combination of both written posts and videos on whatever I can find -- safety, training, reviews on crashes, cornering, proper gear, and so forth. I set an artificial deadline of the end of the month to decide if I would try to get a motorcycle license or not. It's a lot to learn... but I'm not deterred! It felt addicting to find out more and more, curious questions bloomed into curious questions. I'm not a fan of reading, but I hear David Hough and Lee Parks have good books too...

In my pursuit of knowledge, it certainly wasn't the first time hearing about riders passing away, but seeing this specific photo made me pause.

To imagine that all would be left of me could be "a wrapper from a defibrillation system and some flowers". I think I understand this doesn't have to be me, but for me to choose to ride, I have to be able to accept this inherent risk. I repeated to myself "there's nothing wrong if you can't handle it."

I don't think I could swallow that yet. It takes time. I'm still workin' on it now!

Ah...

I have a gym bud I go with 6 days a week. When I told him about my ideas of riding, he understandably didn't agree, but did his best to try to support me. He urged me to learn to drive a car instead. I later realised that I wanted to get my motorcycle license to ride a motorcycle. Not because I needed a faster method of transportation than riding the bus everywhere.

I checked out the MSF course near me, I began filling out the form to join a class tentatively. Later in the form, it asks for my driver's license number. And, well, you see, I don't have one. And, well, even if I could get an M1 license without my DL, it made me hesitate again.

I reasoned it wouldn't be a bad idea to get my driver's license first. So I could be more familiar with driving on the roads, with traffic in my city, with how (some) drivers think. Even if I got my M1, I put onto myself to get my DL anyway, for these exact reasons. So... even if the order is flipped now, it's still fine, I think. The process to get a DL can take a while, and time would give me cushioning to tame and practice my mindset, make biker friends, process the possibility of becoming nothing more than flowers, and to ensure this -- riding a motorcycle -- is something I truly want. Though, maybe it is more commonly the case that riders start off driving cars, then transition to motorcycles?

Though, part of me feels like this is avoiding what I want, and putting off what I want to do out of fear, but... I can't help but agree this is probably the safest and smartest option. *Sigh* It's like arguing with a driver whose just done an illegal U-turn -- you can't win through logic because they're too emotional. When I feel scared lately, I say something like, "If I want to motorcycle, I can also do this." Or, also: "Even if I can't motorcycle, I can still do *this*!"

Overcoming the idea of being unable to do something I really want to do, because it's scary, because it's dangerous, because I don't have the skills for it, is a bitter pill to bite and gnaw on.
And well... if it ends up the reasons wash over me and I end up turning away from motorcycles, even in my one week of research, I feel like I've gotten a decent list of skills that can apply to non-motorcycle scenarios as well.[1] To say the least, I've seen risk in a new light.

1. Ride your ride. Trust your gut and ride how you feel most comfortable, in spite of what others choose to do.
2. Think 15 seconds ahead.
3. Position so great whites can't bite; have a safety cushion so others don't have a chance to hurt you.
4. The best way against an idiot is to walk away, and avoid staying near them.
5. Arguing against someone emotional with logic is not possible.
6. Expecting others to act a certain way is a doomed outlook.
7. Look out for yourself and trust yourself. Trust your own judgement in spite of others' bad decisions.
8. Assume "you don't see me".
9. Swallow your anger and ego after an incident.
10. Be honest with your limitations.
11. Find an alternate way home if you have an impairment. Extreme euphoria and depression are impairments, and you cannot drive under impairments. Fatigue, mental and physical, is also an impairment that appears faster than I expect.
12. Deal with hazards one at a time. Stay calm.
13. Get all your advice from multiple people.
14. Target fixation is real and dangerous.
15. Let others win, or leave the fight. You will lose fights, and by a long shot.
16. Even if you win, you won't change the other person because you're a stranger. The blind will not look no matter how visible you are, and the deaf will not listen no matter how loud you are.
17. Nature abhors a vacuum. If there's a big gap in traffic, something will want to fill it.
18. The best gear is gear you'll wear.

- Set yourself up to get as much information and vision as possible; look left-right-left, look front and ahead, flick your eyes towards yourself, look back front and ahead
- Look at where you want to go
- Side of a vehicle = treat as intersection
- Left turns are a dangerous pattern

[1] As advised by tzrider, I did my best to replace "don't"s with "do"s.

All of the above are tentative to change if needed; they're just notes I've jotted down before I've even felt a clutch.

I even considered just getting some cheap bicycle to practice in the meanwhile, even though it's not the same. Just... *something*. With enough speed I could probably practice countersteering, heh?

Ahem.

But anyway, these are my thoughts from a newbie, 8 days into this whole motorcycle thing. I wonder if the same pride to embrace what I like -- what I love -- that pride that makes me want to ride will be the same pride that pulls my last breath?


And to whoever may read this, stay safe and take care! I hope to meet at least one of you one day!

 

[Butch]

Dirt bike

 

[Butch]

CDL, bicycle, dirt bike, moto. Get a cheap mtn bike and hit us up. It will save your life

 

[berth]

Thanks for posting, I'm sure it wasn't easy.

You don't need a DL to get an M1, I'm proof of that. I had my M1 for several years before I got my Car certification. I like to muse how I got to test drive a new truck using my M1 only DL and "nobody knew" .

I always repeat the mantra "I love motorcycling, I don't recommend it to anyone". It dangerous.

But, if you look at the charts of who gets hurt, it's very spiky. That means there is a select population overrepresented in motorcycling accidents.

The dark truth of that, however, is one of those populations is inexperienced riders (note, I did not say young riders).

Simply, it takes time and experience to become better at this activity, and the only way to do that is to ride the bike.

If you want what is probably the safest path to being adept on a motorcycle, I would get the DL, get a truck, and put a dirt bike in the back.

Then ride that, a lot. The compromised traction environment of a dirt bike translates well to the crummy road conditions on the street, meanwhile early dirt bikes tend to be lightweight and not have crazy power, so it can be harder for the inexperienced to get in trouble. They're great "starter bikes".

Meanwhile, you're getting some more experience on the street driving your truck, encountering idiots, learning to pay attention to traffic, and such.

On top of that, do NOT drive impaired, either vehicle. Ever. Drinking, drugs, cold medicine. Don't. Do not drive while fatigued. You're more tired than you think.

Ride that bike in the dirt for a year, drive the truck for a year, then consider getting a street bike. Going to MSF. Getting your M1 rating.

Once you do that, put 10,000 miles on your first bike.

All of that will get you past one of the large spikes of those involved with motorcycle incidents.

But lightning can still strike, and bikes have always been more vulnerable to lightning that cars. It's a less forgiving medium. That's just a cold reality. But there's all sorts of other things that can do that too, completely unrelated to motorcycling.

 

[Butch]

Uh, dirt bikes are really fun, so this can be painless

 

[ThumperX]

Hey Axel
Love how you put it out there.

I often think of Joy Vs Fear. Joy is a pass through every door; she floats you over any obsticle and allows an indescribable meld between the physical and mental aspects of existence. Fear on the other hand, why fear is the angry slamming of a door, the tripping over the flush threshold of opportunity and a trap. Fear works itself into your mind causing your neck to shorten and your shoulders to tense. You cannot ride a motorcycle this way, not with fear distracting you

Motorcycling for me is joy. I had a nasty accident in 2008 and noticed that fear would come out of nowhere and do what it could to smother joy. In 2020 with the out break of Covid fear once again came creeping in and kicked joy (when it comes to 2 wheels) out of my life. I sold my street bike and declared myself done. Then I purchased this tiny little electric dirt bike. I've been riding that for a year now and realized a few months ago that joy had retuned. I just got a new to me street bike yesterday and all I feel is joy.

I'd completely follow the advice of several barfers and try a dirt bike. Get a mountain bike and hone your skillson 2 wheels. Let the joy find you Vroom!

Oh and welcome to barf

 

[Shawn_the_Sheep]

Shawn the Sheep will ride mtn bikes with you in Alum Rock park. Step one. Do it.

 

[tzrider]

Axel, mine would be another vote for getting a DL and driving for a while before riding a motorcycle on public roads. There are a number of things about riding that are counterintuitive and they require a lot of attention when you’re new.

Learning to cope with traffic, obey traffic laws and come to understand the repertoire of dumb things other drivers commonly do is part of the learning curve of driving. To do that while simultaneously dealing with the counterintuitive nature of motorcycles is asking a lot of yourself.

The dirtbike suggestions are good if you can swing it, and could allow you to build both skill sets in an overlapping fashion, but not simultaneously.

Lastly, I’d encourage you to focus your attention on correct action, rather than on outcomes you don’t want. On your list, consider rephrasing anything that has the word “don’t” in it with an action that would naturally prevent you from doing the thing you don’t want to do. This is much more than a semantic exercise, it helps you allocate your attention to the things that produce the outcomes you want.

 

[budman]

Axel

Very cool first post in terms of your own awareness and desires.
While I agree with the above in terms of dirt bikes and driving my first experiences on the street was on a motorcycle. However I had been riding dirt bikes for 5 years before I was old enough to get on the road.

Just driving with my parents gave me some insight into the asphalt jungle and as a 15-1/2 yo I can tell I had nowhere near the awareness you possess.

The 1Rider Forum here has a wealth of knowledge and information to look at. Video's that are good to thoughts by our very wise Data Dan and others who have decades of riding experience.

As your interaction with that motorcycle dude pointed out life is dangerous. Everything you choose to do may have repercussions and that include bicycles, scooters, dirt bikes.. cars... trucks and motorcycles besides a thousand other activities.

If you want something bad enough you accept the risk.

I suggest you take the class and feel it out.
I noted you live in SJ so not as difficult as perhaps SF for a new rider, but the downtown area is for sure still plenty busy and on a bike you have to be much more vigilant than in a car in terms of your own safety.

Riding a motorcycle is a beautiful thing and an experience that many will not pursue but for some like me, it becomes a big part of who you are.

I wish you a ton of luck with your life in general and it seems to me you have a good head on your shoulders and you can use that to be a successful motorcyclist should you really want to be one.

Many smiles with your miles.

 

[GAJ]

Some great advice.

A street bike might be a good idea.

In five years after following the advice here.

 

[riskybug]

Oh my word, I certainly did not expect responses like these! Last night my voice quivered knowing there were so many replies so quickly.

I will admit, after learning that I could practice failures and difficult techniques (more) freely on a dirt bike, I couldn't sleep early from being unable to hold back my smiles. It felt like jumping for joy that there in fact was another option! Euphoria, maybe, that I don't have to fear the absolute worst so much now.

A dirt bike... I have heard of them from mentions of motocross. Though, I really don't know too much about all its differences from a motorcycle aside that it's slower, lighter, and you can ride them off-road away from cages. The gear you wear is still the same, isn't it? Either way, more reading and learning ahead for me!

To everyone here so far and to come, you've really lifted my spirits! I've been really happy to hear all your advice so far. I'll definitely be searching around for threads here to find out more. I'm sure I'm not the only one who's taken the mountain bike/dirt bike -> motorcycle pipeline.

 

[motoproponent]

:Edit: I was writing this post as you were writing the one above.



M'eh ..Go for it!!

You may not know what your capable of till you throw yourself off the dark cliff with only the expectation that, no matter how far down it turns out to be, you'll land on your feet.

But know this,

whether you ease yourself into it or take the plunge, love it with a passion for the rest of your life or decide it's not for you...We'll all be here to support and not judge.

Dirtbikes Only, awesome! there are people here that will give you space in the back of their truck, when they go, to haul your bike till you get a means of transport for yourself.
Track Days only, sweet don't even get your own bike just rent one a few times a year.
Whatever style speaks to you, Cruiser, Sport, Standard, Adventure, Dual Sport, Bagger, Electric (like the coolest of the cool kids), or even riding with your knees touching on a Scooter, no judgement... just welcome to the family.

I've been riding and commuting here in the Bay Area for 30 years. There have been times in my life when I only had a moto as a vehicle. It is dangerous and I have had several times when I was being dumb cool and survived with no or minimal injuries because of no other reason than luck. I also knew, and have lost, several people that got their ticket punched doing regular rules-of-the-road-shit and got taken out by a car across the double yellow, or just out enjoying being a rider and washed the front. I've also lost some riders to cancer. I'm as unreligious and as unspiritual as they come so I'm not going to chalk it up to some grand plan or when your time is up your time is up. Just live your life and know you don't need anyone's permission to be young and foolhardy.

I can't imagine not riding a motorcycle. I was hooked before I ever got one. Not having motorcycles would feel like buying a ticket on a very scenic, very comfortable, money-saving, death bound train. Motorcycles may be the death of me, but "life" without them would just be a slower (statistically speaking) death anyway.

For me, its the socializing. I'm weird and fucking awkward. But when you walk into a bar in the middle of some tiny little town covered in riding gear and bug guts, you are an interesting person. Striking up a conversation is almost automatic. Travelling on a motorcycle is the greatest joy for me. I try to share it as much as possible, but I know it's not for everyone.

 

[Joe_13]

Get an E-bike!

 

[motoproponent]

Get an E-bike!

I agree. If you have a place to park overnight that will allow you to plug it in electric motorcycles are a great way to enter the fray.

very little maintenence
super low cost of ownership
no clutch or shifting
used bikes depreciate quickly and can be very good value in the used market.

Come to the Moto Social in San Francisco tonight, I'll talk your ear off about them.

 

[riskybug]

Come to the Moto Social in San Francisco tonight, I'll talk your ear off about them.

Ahh, you have no idea how badly I wanna go and meet riders! Just my luck my wisdom tooth surgery was today, I'll have to wait until the next one...!

Though, in my debate between e-bikes, mtb, and db, I reminded myself the goal now was to get practice in to ride a street bike one day. I thought dirt bikes would be closest to that.

But man, hearing about lugging around the bike on trucks and such, I don't know anyone with a truck (yet), how am I gonna practice?

And then the other thing is... I can't wear motorcycle gear on an e-bike, can I? I seem to get mixed answers on that. For me, I think rocking the gear is a big part of the experience, I'm itchin' to wear ATGATT!

 

[GAJ]

Either way, take the Motorcycle Safety Course which gets you a learners permit.

You might hate it and thus answer your question early.

On the other hand.....

 

[motoproponent]

And then the other thing is... I can't wear motorcycle gear on an e-bike, can I? I seem to get mixed answers on that. For me, I think rocking the gear is a big part of the experience, I'm itchin' to wear ATGATT!

You can wear moto gear riding a skateboard of you want to. I see Door Dashers in the city wearing full face HJC and BiLT helmets on E-bikes all day every day. You're an adult, wear what makes you feel comfortable (socially and for safety reasons)

Because I ride an electric motorcycle, when people say "E-Bike" on this forum I think they're talking about a Zero, Livewire, or Energica. Now I think y'all were talking about electric bicycles with pedals and what not.

I agree. If you have a place to park overnight that will allow you to plug it in electric motorcycles are a great way to enter the fray.

very little maintenence
super low cost of ownership
no clutch or shifting
used bikes depreciate quickly and can be very good value in the used market.

When I said that I was talking about something like a used Zero S or something.

 

[riskybug]

Hi all, I came back to post a bit of an update!

So, despite my wisdom teeth being removed that same morning, I checked in with my body and went to the moto social after all. It was a very wonderful experience! Everyone I met gave me their share of wisdom and advice, and I met quite a few new faces!

I want to start off learning with a street motorcycle. Waking up early and practicing in empty parking lots is definitely something I can see myself doing, and I think it's more feasible than starting off with a dirt bike for my circumstances. Of course, also learning things like riding dirt bikes, mountain bikes, scooters, etc won't hurt, but there's no replacement for seat time on the real thing. If I want to practice to ride well on a street bike, practicing on a street bike seems to make sense.
Many suggested a smaller bike where I could plant my feet firmly on the ground, probably a naked, used bike, around 400cc.

I actually booked my MSF for next month, on the weekend right before the next moto social! By then I'll be able to know much more about what I'm getting into.


In a scheduling dilemma, I found out I was able to get a limited slot with one of my favorite tattoo artists before they leave back to Canada, but it's on the 20th. Basically means I won't be able to ride for several weeks while my arm healing. But my friend reassured me if riding a motorcycle is something I really want and it's gonna be long term, I shouldn't worry about 2 months! Just means I'll have 2 months to look for the right bikes!

And, even if I can't practice riding itself, nothing's stopping me from connecting with the community more during those times.

 

[Joe_13]

You can totally ride with a fresh tattoo. Just wrap it up and go. Your tattoo will itch, but will be fine for riding.

Don't overthink it. Follow instructions during class,... then ride every chance you get!

You got this!

 

[motoproponent]

Sorry I missed you at the social. Maybe next month