Water Cooling

[NorCalAthlete]

Back on topic, case arrived along with CPU, motherboard, and PSU. I went with the ASrock Fatal1ty board, i5 7600k CPU, and Corsair SF600.

Need to figure out:

• CPU Waterblock
• Fittings
• Tubing
• Coolant
• GPU (+ GPU waterblock if the Hydro Copper doesn't fit)

 

[NorCalAthlete]

Interesting. Just found out that there's some CPU waterblock / pump / res combos out there. That would actually fit pretty well. Plus found these, pump coolers:
https://www.bitspower.com.tw/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=170_176&products_id=3478

 

[UDRider]

Yeah if you think about it; they wouldn't need the fans moving air anymore, only pumps moving liquid? So that fan load on the pc power supply would be gone, but the building load (at least in that server room vid) would still be there/maybe more? (thinking electric liquid pumps) Hmmm...

I bet moving those liquids requires liquid cooling too. So I think yes, you lose load in 1 place only to be required to increase it in another.

Six of one to get half/dozen of another.

Least the cpu's/memories/& everything runs....uh...cooler?

It still requires less energy to cool small amount of oil, relatively speaking, then running giant ass cooling system to cool down a huge room.

 

[Cycle61]

Most medium and large industrial transformers are oil cooled, and you can push several megawatts through one with only natural circulation and ambient air cooling fins. I'd get a kick out of building a PC the same way, but serviceability would be kind of awkward, and you would have to use an SSD or remotely mounted hard drive.

 

[itisagoodname]

Been hard to find decent price GTX-1080's in stock. Just snagged an EVGA 1080 FTW Hybrid just below MSRP. Don't even have anything to put it in yet... Have all the components in my Amazon basket but waiting to see if anything goes on sale for Prime Day tomorrow.

Been almost 11 years since i've had a decent gaming rig, back when the GTX 8800 first came out (8 November 2006)!

 

[UDRider]

Been hard to find decent price GTX-1080's in stock. Just snagged an EVGA 1080 FTW Hybrid just below MSRP. Don't even have anything to put it in yet... Have all the components in my Amazon basket but waiting to see if anything goes on sale for Prime Day tomorrow.

Been almost 11 years since i've had a decent gaming rig, back when the GTX 8800 first came out (8 November 2006)!

Good times. Still have my old rig with couple of those in SLI config.

 

[NorCalAthlete]

So the Swiftech Apogee Drive II is an integrated CPU block / pump combo, using the same MCP35X pump I was looking at.

http://www.swiftech.com/apogeedrive2.aspx

IF it'll fit between the radiator / fans and motherboard, it sounds like a real winner, letting me minimize my tubing routing. Keeping the entire bottom of the case clear (ie, no pump) also means I could stuff a couple more fans in the bottom to help with cooling.

Swiftech says the height of that thing is 61.5 mm.

NCase's website says CPU coolers up to 130mm tall can be used WITH bracket, NO fan.

Since there will be a 240mm rad + 25mm fan in the way, with the EK Coolstream PE being 40mm thick, and a standard 25mm fan....130-40-25 = 65mm left.

So I THINK I'll have just 3.5mm to spare, but it SHOULD still fit. I will definitely need 90 degree coolant tube fittings that do not extend very far beyond the top of the Swiftech though...

edit - looking at the dimensions, it would appear that the tip of the fittings is at 43mm high....so 65-43 = 22mm. Now, you CAN swivel them a few degrees for just a tiny bit more clearance too. But I found these low profile 90-degree fittings...

http://koolance.com/fitting-single-swiveling-elbow-low-profile

They're only 20mm. So it looks like I'll have just 2mm or so to spare...but it should work!

 

[EastBayDave]

great post, thank you. Many different systems to consider; much more than I had imagined. Price can skyrocket for some systems as well. $300+ for your system?

I liked this link:
http://koolance.com/

Gives you an idea of the different things you can do in this field. They have many, many accessories available if you look at the "products" page.

Kinda strange, over the years I've always relied on various forms of air-cooling. But w/temps rising, adding water (liquid) cooling looks more & more inviting dependent on processors/memory/video configuration...

Should I build my own or get a "bought" already built, brand pc? Hmm...as I have an additional concern (RFI), it's interesting...

 

[NorCalAthlete]

great post, thank you. Many different systems to consider; much more than I had imagined. Price can skyrocket for some systems as well. $300+ for your system?

I liked this link:
http://koolance.com/

Gives you an idea of the different things you can do in this field. They have many, many accessories available if you look at the "products" page.

Kinda strange, over the years I've always relied on various forms of air-cooling. But w/temps rising, adding water (liquid) cooling looks more & more inviting dependent on processors/memory/video configuration...

Should I build my own or get a "bought" already built, brand pc? Hmm...as I have an additional concern (RFI), it's interesting...

$300 is a hell of a lot better than the initial $800 estimate heh. Right now I'm looking at ~$150 for that pump/CPU block combo, ~$60 for a radiator, and then about $80-$150 for a GPU block. So probably around $400 after fittings, coolant, and tubing. Add another $60 if I decide to go with the external reservoir which is about the only one I can fit.

Eyeballing a slim radiator now (the Hardware Labs GTS 240 / Black Ice GTS 240 gen 2 to be exact) to combine with the full size fans to give myself a bit more breathing room to get better fittings off the CPU block/pump. While I think the low profile Koolance ones would work, I'm really not keen on the minimal threads they have. I'd still use thread tape/threadlock but it makes me a bit nervous to have the riskiest point of failure have the worst fittings.

 

[EastBayDave]

$300 is a hell of a lot better than the initial $800 estimate heh. Right now I'm looking at ~$150 for that pump/CPU block combo, ~$60 for a radiator, and then about $80-$150 for a GPU block. So probably around $400 after fittings, coolant, and tubing. Add another $60 if I decide to go with the external reservoir which is about the only one I can fit.

Eyeballing a slim radiator now (the Hardware Labs GTS 240 / Black Ice GTS 240 gen 2 to be exact) to combine with the full size fans to give myself a bit more breathing room to get better fittings off the CPU block/pump. While I think the low profile Koolance ones would work, I'm really not keen on the minimal threads they have. I'd still use thread tape/threadlock but it makes me a bit nervous to have the riskiest point of failure have the worst fittings.

Yeah I think thread locker would be a requirement? Hmmm...

Another disturbing point about Koolance & others is: NO HOSE CLAMPS? :

A surprising thing when you consider # of heat cycles the average pc gets when turned on & off, & every time those hoses go thru a "slight" deterioration. EDIT: (think about auto coolant hoses. Almost ALL have clamps.)

Eventually you might spring a leak? Then blooey!

 

[Phanuel]

Modern fittings are o-ring sealed on both ends. No threadlocker is applied as the fittings are hand tight.

These systems also don't really heat cycle. We're talking ambient temp water being heated an additional 50 degrees and then back down again. Most of the damage to tubing happens through being dyed if a dye is used or corrosion from dissimilar metals in the cooling system.

Typically you do a multi hour leak test prior to starting the system and then you don't have to worry about it again until you change a component.

[youtube]2GMfqtzjZxY[/youtube]

 

[NorCalAthlete]

You can always add hose clamps too if you want, but I was leaning towards just using compression fittings and some quick disconnects.

 

[NorCalAthlete]

I'm giving up on the pre-waterblocked cards. They're all too tall and I don't want to bother with stuff like trying to make a custom spacing for the side panel and whatnot (plus then there's more gaps for dust and stuff to get in).

Aiming at getting either:

EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 SC Gaming ACX 3.0 8GB GDDR5X (08G-P4-6183)
or
EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 ACX 3.0 8GB GDDR5X (08G-P4-6181)

Ordered a Watercool.de Heatkiller block + backplate (models 15579, 16063) for it already, just need to find somewhere that has the actual cards in stock.

Also ordered a Hardware Labs GTS 240 radiator and 2 of the Noiseblocker Eloop 800-1500 rpm PWM fans someone recommended a few pages back. They look solid, good static air pressure, good CFM, and custom sleeved cables on them for like $3, plus they come with both long and short cables which gives me some flexibility in the build.

Last things to order:
Swiftech pump/CPU block combo, comes with the MCP35X pump
Fittings and quick disconnects (haven't picked these out yet, but leaning towards 3/8" by 1/2", I don't like how fat and bulky the 5/8" stuff looks)
Tubing
Coolant (haven't picked this out yet either. I know I want clear and simple, nothing that's going to break down over time, as maintenance-free as possible)
Reservoir for filling that I can disconnect after topping off

 

[EastBayDave]

I'm giving up on the pre-waterblocked cards. They're all too tall and I don't want to bother with stuff like trying to make a custom spacing for the side panel and whatnot (plus then there's more gaps for dust and stuff to get in).

Aiming at getting either:

EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 SC Gaming ACX 3.0 8GB GDDR5X (08G-P4-6183)
or
EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 ACX 3.0 8GB GDDR5X (08G-P4-6181)

Ordered a Watercool.de Heatkiller block + backplate (models 15579, 16063) for it already, just need to find somewhere that has the actual cards in stock.

Also ordered a Hardware Labs GTS 240 radiator and 2 of the Noiseblocker Eloop 800-1500 rpm PWM fans someone recommended a few pages back. They look solid, good static air pressure, good CFM, and custom sleeved cables on them for like $3, plus they come with both long and short cables which gives me some flexibility in the build.

Last things to order:
Swiftech pump/CPU block combo, comes with the MCP35X pump
Fittings and quick disconnects (haven't picked these out yet, but leaning towards 3/8" by 1/2", I don't like how fat and bulky the 5/8" stuff looks)
Tubing
Coolant (haven't picked this out yet either. I know I want clear and simple, nothing that's going to break down over time, as maintenance-free as possible)
Reservoir for filling that I can disconnect after topping off

Very cool. Yeah I think the 5/8" is probably too big & not required for a short run in a closed loop system. It will get back to pump quick anyway, & I don't think we want a thermostat controlled system like a car...

Also longevity is likely not that big a deal either. You guys upgrade every few years; I did when I was in the industry. Had to stay on the cutting edge. Now being retired, I only update after a long time as s/w requirements seem to be slowing?

Again current pc is 8+ years old, a record for me (Dell big tower "XPS") that I had intended to upgrade. But now I don't know if current muthaboards will fit? Hmmm... water cooling certainly will not me thinkss...

So, jury still out for me. Still looking even though the wifie has said "go ahead & buy one." Tempting but I need to decide if I can afford new bike, car, or home mods 1st. PC is the least of my worries as primarily a bulletin board plaything.

What to do, what to do?

 

[NorCalAthlete]

Very cool. Yeah I think the 5/8" is probably too big & not required for a short run in a closed loop system. It will get back to pump quick anyway, & I don't think we want a thermostat controlled system like a car...

Also longevity is likely not that big a deal either. You guys upgrade every few years; I did when I was in the industry. Had to stay on the cutting edge. Now being retired, I only update after a long time as s/w requirements seem to be slowing?

Again current pc is 8+ years old, a record for me (Dell big tower "XPS") that I had intended to upgrade. But now I don't know if current muthaboards will fit? Hmmm... water cooling certainly will not me thinkss...

So, jury still out for me. Still looking even though the wifie has said "go ahead & buy one." Tempting but I need to decide if I can afford new bike, car, or home mods 1st. PC is the least of my worries as primarily a bulletin board plaything.

What to do, what to do?

1. Build smaller. Full tower XPS? Nah, no bueno. If you're not doing quad video cards, 8 HDDs, etc, there's absolutely no reason imo to go with anything bigger than micro-ATX at least. But if you do want to build a mid size or full tower and the old Dell isn't cutting it, I have a really good Coolermaster HAF for sale in the grab bag I'll cut some more off for you.

2. New bike, new car, and new PC shouldn't even be in the same price bracket imo, but if they are, reliable transportation > new gaming PC. Home mods can wait unless it's leaks or something like that.

3. In regards to updating frequency - I think we're plateauing there. Used to be you had to upgrade every year to play the latest games at the top graphics settings, but it was a massive, noticeable difference. These days, not so much. If you get something that can play 4k games now, I think it'll easily last you 5 years minimum.

So...I say go for it assuming #2 doesn't apply for whatever reason.

In other news, monitor arrived today. I went with the Viewsonic.

 

[NorCalAthlete]

So, update. Here's what I just finished building.

NCase M1 V5
Intel i5 7600K 3.8 Ghz
G.Skill Ripjaws 32GB DDR4 3200
Western Digital M.2 256GB
Intel 3710 400GB SSD
EVGA 8GB GTX 1080
Corsair SF600
Swiftech Apogee Drive II Pump/CPU block combo (pump is an MCP35X)
Hardware Labs GTS 240 slim radiator
Noiseblocker E-loop B12-P 800-2000 rpm PWM fans
Watercool Heatkiller IV GPU block + backplate
Swiftech 90 degree fittings x6
Swiftech quick disconnects x2 (2 sets)
Swiftech 3/8" ID - 1/2" OD compression fittings
XSPC T fitting
XSPC male/male extenders
XSPC plugs
Swiftech ITX reservoir (for filling only)
Nonplasticized tubing 3/8" ID - 1/2" OD
Distilled water + P T Nuke
Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste

Doing initial fill and leak testing now.

 

[EastBayDave]

So, update. Here's what I just finished building.

NCase M1 V5
Intel i5 7600K 3.8 Ghz
G.Skill Ripjaws 32GB DDR4 3200
Western Digital M.2 256GB
Intel 3710 400GB SSD
EVGA 8GB GTX 1080
Corsair SF600
Swiftech Apogee Drive II Pump/CPU block combo (pump is an MCP35X)
Hardware Labs GTS 240 slim radiator
Noiseblocker E-loop B12-P 800-2000 rpm PWM fans
Watercool Heatkiller IV GPU block + backplate
Swiftech 90 degree fittings x6
Swiftech quick disconnects x2 (2 sets)
Swiftech 3/8" ID - 1/2" OD compression fittings
XSPC T fitting
XSPC male/male extenders
XSPC plugs
Swiftech ITX reservoir (for filling only)
Nonplasticized tubing 3/8" ID - 1/2" OD
Distilled water + P T Nuke
Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste

Doing initial fill and leak testing now.

Pics pics pics !!!

Wow! Sounds really nice/expensive/long-haul machine...WTG!

 

[NorCalAthlete]

Having trouble getting any power to the pump for leak testing. Can't figure out if it's the PSU, cable, or pump itself.


edit - nvm, got it all working. Finishing up wire management now...which is a bitch when everything is already in the system, but I don't want to drain / refill it yet again. Although I really should...I bought some Alphacool stuff for the final loop fill. Guess I'll play with it some more - don't even have a copy of windows to install yet.

 

[EastBayDave]

Having trouble getting any power to the pump for leak testing. Can't figure out if it's the PSU, cable, or pump itself.

gotta volt/ohm meter? 1st just check the inputs to the pump connection to see if you got voltage from the power supply. If so, it's something else....maybe the pump itself.

Like, does the pump have a good ground where it screws/mounts into chassis? (normally that would be enough, unless the pump mounting point surface is painted or something?)

Perhaps the pump needs to be fully filled to operate? (as in built-in "fail-safe.")

 

[ScarySpikes]

So, update. Here's what I just finished building.

NCase M1 V5
Intel i5 7600K 3.8 Ghz
G.Skill Ripjaws 32GB DDR4 3200
Western Digital M.2 256GB
Intel 3710 400GB SSD
EVGA 8GB GTX 1080
Corsair SF600
Swiftech Apogee Drive II Pump/CPU block combo (pump is an MCP35X)
Hardware Labs GTS 240 slim radiator
Noiseblocker E-loop B12-P 800-2000 rpm PWM fans
Watercool Heatkiller IV GPU block + backplate
Swiftech 90 degree fittings x6
Swiftech quick disconnects x2 (2 sets)
Swiftech 3/8" ID - 1/2" OD compression fittings
XSPC T fitting
XSPC male/male extenders
XSPC plugs
Swiftech ITX reservoir (for filling only)
Nonplasticized tubing 3/8" ID - 1/2" OD
Distilled water + P T Nuke
Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste

Doing initial fill and leak testing now.

Pics...

also, where the hell did you find eLoop fans. Every place i've seen that says they stock them is always sold out.