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Workplace active shooting drill

Another angle might be; don't impose your personal things at work. Like the anti-gay cake guy, or the anti-gay minister lady, people should just leave their personal stuff at home do their job and this is simply a modern training reality in the workplace.
 
Good post Schnell.

Half my office is working from home / remote on any given day so I’d probably just opt for that if we had a drill - or take off and go home as soon as it started.

We had a discussion on active shooters a while back and while a couple people mused about places to hide (and we had a productive and educating discussion on cover vs concealment), I did find out that a few of the older ladies carry bear mace and about 3/4 of my floor are (surprisingly) no strangers to guns. There are several other veterans I work with as well and it seemed like unbeknownst to us most people’s plan for an active shooter seemed to be “get to the veterans, do what they say, and GTFO the building”.
 
After the last active shooter down south made the news Sacramento County started providing active shooter workshops. I was not traumatized by the trainings and felt as if I learned a great deal.

As a child, the hide under your desk drills in case there is a bomb terrorized me for years. It was scary shit for a youngster to imagine the bomb being dropped atop of my head.
 
Our active shooter training is different, we're told to shoot back if it is clear. And a memo from the boss went around last year that we can carry to work if we want to, just have to complete the firearms training course first.
 
KooLaid said:
Our active shooter training is different, we're told to shoot back if it is clear. And a memo from the boss went around last year that we can carry to work if we want to, just have to complete the firearms training course first.
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i think this is awesome Who do you work for?
 
rush the ambush, it's what I was trained to do, it's what I will do.
sorry 11 bravo mentality, you gonna die anyway might as well try to take one of the mofos with you.

are people traumatized by CPR training?
are they traumatized by fire drills?
you are much more likely to experience a fire than an active shooter, why don't fire drills traumatize you?
 
I am not traumatized by CPR training. Not traumatized by fire drills.
Was traumatized by duck and cover drills back in the 70's.

Got over it though.

How are you doing today tux?
 
cfives said:
I believe that is the intended outcome, but the more likely outcome is propagating fear, normalizing domestic terrorism, and possibly planting the seed/blueprint of efficiency into the head of a future disgruntled employee.

Were the cold war, duck and cover drills, effective drills to minimize children's exposure to an atomic blast, or were they sensationalist media/human nature driven measures that were ineffective at best, counter productive at worst?
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Because duck and cover is useless in a nuclear attack, however...

doc4216 said:
I understand your point, however, the hide under your desk during an atomic blast was BS and it did no good. I would even agree that it might have been propaganda. IMO, that is not the case for an active shooter drill.

I used to train and coordinate the drill for my workplace in my last position. I had multiple people with zero LE experience approach me afterwards and thank me for bringing things to light that they had not considered or thought of. For people who don't understand how to protect themselves or things to consider during an active shooter situation (turn office lights out, lock or block door, and turn all electronic sounds off) or what they should expect when first responders actually arrive on scene, this drill can help save a life. I also included the local PD on the day for the response so they were aware and it gave them familiarization to my workplace.

If you don't want to participate, that's cool, but I am certain, it will help someone you work with.
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This! ^^^

Any training like this should, ideally, be done with advice from, or in coordination with, the local agency that would be responding.
 
byke said:
Another angle might be; don't impose your personal things at work. Like the anti-gay cake guy, or the anti-gay minister lady, people should just leave their personal stuff at home do their job and this is simply a modern training reality in the workplace.
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Yeah. I'm a big subscriber to this.
 
bojangle said:
Because duck and cover is useless in a nuclear attack, however...



This! ^^
.
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...
You strike me an intelligent, and rational human, who happens to work as a cop. Do you really believe that an active shooter simulation benefits anyone other than police that are involved in the simulation?
 
cfives said:
...
You strike me an intelligent, and rational human, who happens to work as a cop. Do you really believe that an active shooter simulation benefits anyone other than police that are involved in the simulation?
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Well, more than a duck and cover nuclear attack drill, but that's not saying much. :laughing

I don't know what kind of industry you work in. It's probably just a liability thing to show they've taken proactive measures in the event of a workplace shooting. I think there is some benefit in staff/faculty having a protocol in coordination with a police response in the event of an active shooter at a school. That could event involve some coordinated training with teachers and LE, maybe even with actors playing students. In other workplaces, probably not as much benefit.
 
As to the trauma some people can experience in active shooter drills, CPR and Fire drills aren't remotely close, fire doesn't chase you around outside and the CPR victim isn't about to do much either.

Properly planned and conducted an active shooter training scenario will seem as close to real as it gets. The responders will get into role and the victims often experience what would actually happen, emotion wise. Extreme care must be exercised to insure things don't get carried away because participants can sometimes get so far into character that unfortunate things can happen.

For the die hards, sure, it's just a training situation but for others who only experience fear when their choice of makeup runs or they've zipped up and forgotten to put penis back in pants, it can have a real effect. This is why those planning and running active shooter training scenarios must know what they are doing and not just think they do.
 
cfives said:
...
You strike me an intelligent, and rational human, who happens to work as a cop. Do you really believe that an active shooter simulation benefits anyone other than police that are involved in the simulation?
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What about what I had to say? Why does it seem that you feel it so worthless to explore what you and your coworkers would do in such a case?

What about fire drills and arson?
 
cfives said:
Hoping the the Bay Area Mores Forum can help me find ammo that confirms my bias against a proposed active shooter drill at my work, during normal working hours.

Today, I went through a 5 hour annual safety training, and the new Health and Safety Compliance dude mentioned that he was working on a active shooter drill (announced to the day (best), or to the week (worst)). This strikes me as capitulation towards terror propagation, and greatly increasing the chances of it by planting the idea into disgruntled employees minds.

The workplace is understaffed, and wasting billed hours company wide, on a statistical insignificant possibility, is philosophically, morally, and economically fucked up!
Please confirm my bias with links to compelling and affirming data!
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How many people who have been killed in active shooter environments have said, "statistically, it won't happen to me, so why should I plan?" Maybe none, maybe a lot... still, they're all dead.

Think of it like this:
Statistically, our houses will not burn down. But we still make a plan with our kids.
Statistically, we won't crash our cars, but we still wear seat belts. And helmets and riding gear on the motorcycle.
Statistics say we should ignore a lot of the things we get ready for, but we get ready for them anyway. Mostly because if you want to survive these things, your chances increase dramatically if you've evaluated the possibilities and made a plan.

Even if you don't make a plan, you've made a plan; your plan is to let someone else worry about your safety and burden them with trying to look out for you if something like this happens. Hopefully they have the time and awareness to do so and you don't get them killed in the process.

Or, maybe it's easier to be oblivious to such possibilities. Leaving other people to look out for our own safety has always been the easier road to travel.
 
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All true but never underestimate the ability of a bad plan to kill you faster than someone trying to do it intentionally.

I think the emphasis is on good planning vs haphazard amateur hour training by people unqualified to refill the toilet paper roll.

Consider things like barricading a door. Sounds great. Yeah, unless you don't know for certain where the shooter is. Then when said active shooter is actually outside and shoots inside through the windows no one can get out, or; the accomplice is in the room being barricaded and then they have you. That is just one small example of how thorough training needs to be and how someone without any real qualifications can simply say do this or that when their only experience is some video sim game.

Don't get me wrong, good training is good but like any major concern, "security experts" are cloned and go out selling their crap to companies desperate to do anything or risk looking like they are unprepared.
 
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It's disheartening that we've reached a point where folks feel it necessary to train for the inevitability of some psycho going apeshit and shooting up their place of business/worship/recreation/whatever.
 
Abacinator said:
It's disheartening that we've reached a point where folks feel it necessary to train for the inevitability of some psycho going apeshit and shooting up their place of business/worship/recreation/whatever.
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More disheartening is the continued blame on things we make and not the things we do with the things we make. The former is the easy way out, the later means someone has to actually do something about it.
 
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