Digital SLR / DSLR Camera Question / DSLR Thread 2

[VeloceMoto]

So I watched some cool videos of the California Sunbounce things in action. Can anyone help me understand what makes them different than an $11 Walmart car windshield reflector? They are freaking expensive! $600+ for the big ones...

Obviously they are more sturdy and "professional"--but what is the difference from a functional standpoint? Anyone use them? Looks like you can use them to bounce speedlites, too.

 

[Cycle61]

Walmart car windshield thingy FTW. The expensive ones are more durable, more controllable, pack up smaller, and they're easier to store because you'll have lots of empty space in your wallet.

I could have used one today, along with a good assistant. Was shooting at f/13 to keep my shutter speed down to 1/250th and the poor little flashes were smoking hot popping at 1/2 power for a couple hundred consecutive frames. A reflector would have been very nice.

 

[BrassPremier]

I told you, if you ever need help lemme know . I have more free time than I know what to do with.

 

[VeloceMoto]

Walmart car windshield thingy FTW. The expensive ones are more durable, more controllable, pack up smaller, and they're easier to store because you'll have lots of empty space in your wallet.

Fair. This makes me a happy camper!

I could have used one today, along with a good assistant. Was shooting at f/13 to keep my shutter speed down to 1/250th and the poor little flashes were smoking hot popping at 1/2 power for a couple hundred consecutive frames. A reflector would have been very nice.

I have been wondering about this! Shooting in bright, high-noon sunlight... can't you just throw an ND filter on it and drop down several stops?

 

[Cycle61]

I told you, if you ever need help lemme know . I have more free time than I know what to do with.

You're definitely on the list.

Shooting in bright, high-noon sunlight... can't you just throw an ND filter on it and drop down several stops?

Yes, you can. But the flash has to get through that ND filter also. Which pretty much makes it a moot point. If you have BIG strobes (like a Hensel 3200w/s box) then you can put on a 4 stop ND, and shoot at f/2.8 1/250th in bright sunlight, but that's several orders of magnitude more power than I have available. I did shoot above my sync speed, at 1/320th instead of 1/250th, which meant that the flashes didn't light everybody's legs at the bottom of the frame, but it knocks down the ambient 1/2 stop. You can see in the picture here how it goes a little darker at the bottom. This is what I was talking about a couple of days ago.

 

[BrassPremier]

Speaking of ND filters, I really need to try out my 3.0 (10 stops) ND Filter that recently came in. Plan to get some cool long exposures during the day, just got to think of something interesting to shoot with it... Like a waterfall. Hm, maybe time for Yosemite trip

 

[Rambeezi]

I have been wondering about this! Shooting in bright, high-noon sunlight... can't you just throw an ND filter on it and drop down several stops?

...and in addition to cycle61's comments you will still want a flash and/or reflector/bounce back material to get rid of those high contrast shadows (when shooting in high noon).

Hmmmmmm.... $11 windshield thingy at Walmart??? Gonna have to make a stop...or see if Kragens is just as cheap.

 

[VeloceMoto]

Yes, you can. But the flash has to get through that ND filter also. Which pretty much makes it a moot point. If you have BIG strobes (like a Hensel 3200w/s box) then you can put on a 4 stop ND, and shoot at f/2.8 1/250th in bright sunlight, but that's several orders of magnitude more power than I have available. I did shoot above my sync speed, at 1/320th instead of 1/250th, which meant that the flashes didn't light everybody's legs at the bottom of the frame, but it knocks down the ambient 1/2 stop. You can see in the picture here how it goes a little darker at the bottom. This is what I was talking about a couple of days ago.

Dohhhhh. Sorry, my brain was not present when I asked that question.

Regarding the California Sunbounce reflectors (or windshield reflectors!): what kind of light do they produce? I would imagine harsh light at first guess, since the reflective material is not "diffusing" it, just sort of bouncing it. But it would seem that when you hold it very close to the subject, it can be a very large source, which, produces softer light, no? *shrug*

I probably shouldn't ask, given the 'ol saying... but how much do those Hensel things cost? I Googled it and couldn't find any prices.

 

[Cycle61]

Dohhhhh. Sorry, my brain was not present when I asked that question.

Regarding the California Sunbounce reflectors (or windshield reflectors!): what kind of light do they produce? I would imagine harsh light at first guess, since the reflective material is not "diffusing" it, just sort of bouncing it. But it would seem that when you hold it very close to the subject, it can be a very large source, which, produces softer light, no? *shrug*

I probably shouldn't ask, given the 'ol saying... but how much do those Hensel things cost? I Googled it and couldn't find any prices.

Depends on how you use it. Just the silver, it can be harsh, but certainly less so than direct sun. Usually they have a white side as well, that is very soft and diffuse, at the cost of the absolute amount of light it puts out. A flat sheet of walmart stuff won't throw much of a beam, as the surface is distorted, but it's still plenty to fill in a lot of shadows. I've used white $1.99 foamboard with good results as well.

And regarding the Hensel? If you have to ask......

(between $3 and $10k, depending on what exactly you get)

 

[mosquito]

Windshield thingies... if you can find them get the ones that have a spring wire around the edge and 'fold' into a smaller disk.

 

[Joebar4000]

I have been wondering about this! Shooting in bright, high-noon sunlight... can't you just throw an ND filter on it and drop down several stops?

The main issue for me was the model. Damn nearly blinded her. Sun AND a reflector? She couldn't open her eyes...

 

[Cycle61]

Good lord. Freggin white balance nightmare. Ceremony was in open shade, between 11:45 and 12:15, next to a lake. Neutral color temp for the bride's dress is somewhere in the 10,500K range, but that makes everything else look WAY too warm. If I make everything else look normal (at about 5,500K) then her dress looks blue. And I can't abruptly transition white balance from the procession (where they're actually in the sun) to the ceremony without making the grass, trees and water change color suddenly.

 

[VeloceMoto]

Good lord. Freggin white balance nightmare. Ceremony was in open shade, between 11:45 and 12:15, next to a lake. Neutral color temp for the bride's dress is somewhere in the 10,500K range, but that makes everything else look WAY too warm. If I make everything else look normal (at about 5,500K) then her dress looks blue. And I can't abruptly transition white balance from the procession (where they're actually in the sun) to the ceremony without making the grass, trees and water change color suddenly.

Curious what you use for white balancing. Do you take a reference shot of a Whibal card or just go with what looks good in Adobe RAW?

Are there any cheap/DIY gray card solutions?

 

[Cycle61]

I generally go with what looks good (in Lightroom, which uses the same processing engine as ACR. I don't have a functioning copy of Photoshop)

Regarding cheap/DIY solutions, I think it's one of those things that either you take the free approach and hack it like I always do, or spend the $$$ for a good one. A cheap one is likely to be no better than any found object, if you're going for a precise color balance.

It's usually pretty easy to find something neutral to choose a balance from, but in this case, there was sooo much blue reflected from the sky and the lake, that setting the dress to a clean white throws everything else way off. I ended up going with a "cloudy" WB (about 6500k) and it looks pretty good. It's one's tricky because the subject is in very different light than the background.

Here's what I ended up going with. It doesn't help much that the willow trees kept blowing around opening up patches of direct sunlight either.

 

[BrassPremier]

Hm, if only the paint tool in light room let you paint a section to change WB

 

[VeloceMoto]

I generally go with what looks good (in Lightroom, which uses the same processing engine as ACR. I don't have a functioning copy of Photoshop)

It's usually pretty easy to find something neutral to choose a balance from, but in this case, there was sooo much blue reflected from the sky and the lake, that setting the dress to a clean white throws everything else way off. I ended up going with a "cloudy" WB (about 6500k) and it looks pretty good. It's one's tricky because the subject is in very different light than the background.

Here's what I ended up going with. It doesn't help much that the willow trees kept blowing around opening up patches of direct sunlight either.

Ahh!

Man, this RAW stuff is just so damn cool. I don't see any reason to shoot anything else now, especially since even Picasa supports my NEF files. Two clicks and everything is exported/resized to JPG, something I do anyway when I want to share them with friends/Facebook.

It seems like constantly shooting a reference 18% gray card would be logistically burdensome. I guess a calibrated monitor and an eyeball can do the trick and I can save my money for a lightstand/285/umbrella/other strobist goodies.

I really like your first photo. The lighting is very cool!

 

[Cycle61]

I've never really played with that one. Probably should, but the only edit tools I use are the spot remover and sometimes the gradient. I definitely need to work on my editing skills.

ETA: And yeah...Raw is definitely the way to go. I was converted very early on, within a few months of getting into photography. It's priceless, especially after shoots like yesterday, with fun WB issues and white dresses in bright sunlight. I was able to shoot right at the edge of overexposure, and then pull back a few blown-out highlights while retaining all the details in the shadowy areas of the black suits, etc.

 

[BrassPremier]

The brush tool is great, say if you want to add/remove a little saturation/contrast/exposure to a section of the photo instead of the whole thing. When painting, press O to see exactly where you've painted. Pretty much works exactly same as gradient tool.

I also like shooting in RAW, but if I'm shooting a crap load of shots say, at the track, I just try to set camera up best I can and shoot jpg.

 

[Cycle61]

Okay, so what does the "Color" one do? I'm not seeing any effect.

Edit: Ahh, nevermind. I was being too subtle/impatient with it. Now she's got a big blue stripe across her dress and arm.

 

[Cycle61]

Link for those working with flashes that don't have PC jacks or good optical slaves:

http://strobist.blogspot.com/2009/05/universal-translator-ushers-in-new-age.html