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HID Headlights.

corndog67

corndog67

Pissant Squid
Joined
Jan 2, 2011
Location
Santa Maria, CA
Moto(s)
KTM 950 SM Weapon
Name
Robert
Aftermarket, specifically.

There are kits to retrofit my KTM with an HID headlight. One of my vehicles has a set of them, and they are outstanding. Are the retrofit kits worth a damn or is it just more Ebay BS? I notice that the headlights generally don't have a high beam, but something inside switches and dips them. I would assume that if it dies, you are without a headlight?

Any experience with these?
 
HID requires a different reflector and/or lense than a halogen bulb to focus and direct the light properly.

I put one on my bmw, didn't like it because the light pattern sucked and I could not see far enough ahead.

I put one on my fz09 and the low beam is ok but not as good as the H4 it replaced. High beam was much worse than the H4.

What is better is that I notice other drivers seem to see me better with the HID than without.
 
motomania2007 said:
I put one on my bmw, didn't like it because the light pattern sucked and I could not see far enough ahead.

I put one on my fz09 and the low beam is ok but not as good as the H4 it replaced. High beam was much worse than the H4.
Click to expand...

The previous owner of my GSX-R750 proudly delivered the bike with an HID kit installed. I rode it at night once, threw the HID kit in the trash, and replaced it with the stock bulbs. Now I can actually see where I'm going!
 
I don't know about eBay kits, but I've got a HID low beam and a Squadron Baja for a high-beam that came as part of my Britannia Composites adjustable wind screen.

The HID goes well beyond the stock and the Baja LED positively BBQs anything less than 500ft in front of me. 4300Lumens@42watts :)
 

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From my experience in both bikes and cars is that the HID in the same housing as the halogen, is generally worse than the halogen because it just spews diffuse light every where. HIDs do make a good improvement if you get them in projector housings
 
Rottweiler sells Cyclops LED lighting kit's for your bike. An off-road and a DOT version for the 950-990. Off Road kit # CIL-KTM11-3600, DOT kit CIL-LEDMD-3800
I might try the version for my 1290, or even get the Long Range Optimus kit with a dimmer and separate switch. My friend bought some ebay kit (complete housings and relays) for his truck and told me it was a real crap kit and a pain in the rear to get working correctly. I like the stock lights so far but haven't done much night riding with this bike. Cyclops has a good rep with the off road crowd for reliability.
 
I would pass- I ran with HID's with a high a quality German retrofit kit for a 4 years until this year- FWIW:

  • Although bulbs are rated to last much longer than halogens, when they do need replaced, it's spendy
  • As others have mentioned, although the light output may seem whiter/brighter, without a properly engineered reflector for the HID, you're merely throwing light without a corrected focal point. This means less improvement for your night sight and likely an overburden of glare for oncoming traffic. Most HIDs are engineered to be used with a focusing lens as well, which is pretty tough to fit in an OEM housing on bike
  • Wiring, while not hard, requires special attention to ground, and uses precious real estate for the dedicated wiring harness, not to mention a spot to stow & secure igniters and ballasts
  • If you need to make an on-the-trip repair, trouble shooting an HID system is much more time consuming than stock wiring & housing.

LED's replacement bulbs are *almost* there, and have a lot of promise for longevity, temperature and electrical draw. However, still need some improvement to fit and correctly throw light in stock housings. In the meantime, you can get good benefits from fitting a supplemental driving light kit for the same or less cost.

If your stock headlight is throwing less than desired, there's a few things to try:
  • Clean the reflectors- it's surprising how much crap can find its way past even a sealed housing
  • Check the wiring- connections can almost always use a cleaning and grease in our marine climate
  • look into a heavy duty wiring kit- Both Jim's at Eastern Beaver and CycleTerminal sell some really good kits to overcome the often lousy bottlenecks in stock H4 wiring harnesses, also at discount over an HID retrofit set up
 
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I had a proper Morimoto HID projector retrofit on my last bike and, while it was bright as hell, turning the bike meant that you couldn't see into the turn because of countersteer and a really sharp HID cutoff.

People say that HID in a halogen housing is bad, but these people probably have never done a HID retrofit on a bike or don't ever turn at night. I'd say that HID in proper HID housing/retrofit is definitely worse on a motorcycle than HID in halogen housing.

I've got a plug-and-play 55W LED bulb in the Grom and it's got great output in halogen housing and took 5 minutes to install.
 
jh2586 said:
Aren't LEDs better?
Click to expand...

Not necessarily. If it's a retrofit bulb going into a housing where the reflector and lens is designed for halogen, then it'll work about as good as a flaming turd. Reflector and lens designs are very different for different bulb types. That's why the cheap retrofit kits that put HID or LED bulbs in halogen designed housings suck.
 
HeatXfer said:
I don't know about eBay kits, but I've got a HID low beam and a Squadron Baja for a high-beam that came as part of my Britannia Composites adjustable wind screen.

The HID goes well beyond the stock and the Baja LED positively BBQs anything less than 500ft in front of me. 4300Lumens@42watts :)
Click to expand...

While those lights might not be legal (DOT approval), at least the housings and lenses are designed specifically for the type of bulb providing the light. :thumbup
 
The key to an HID retrofit is two fold.

First, you need a single element lens with a single element bulb for it to work. If you have H4 bulbs or other hi/lo in the same lens and bulb combo it's not going to work correctly. This is why ST Guy has never had success. The Honda ST1100 and ST1300 use dual filament bulbs in lenses designed to be both a hi and low. It's a bad idea. Not only is the light diffuse and unfocused, but it blinds everyone else on the road and it will piss them off. And because the HID bulb does not have the same shaped 'element' as the halogen, it lights up all kinds of places in the dual element reflector it shouldn't. Just say no.

Next, you need a headlight that has a modern style focused light pattern in either a low-beam or high-beam lens but not both. One with a definitive cut-off above which it does not project light. A horizon of sorts. Most projector housings and many, many motorcycles built since about 2000 have them, even without the projector housing. You also have to be one of those people okay with putting the horizon where it belongs, which is low enough to keep it out of on-coming traffic's eyes. I know several old people who have vision problems or cataracts who can't see anything above the horizon on a dark road. What these dudes do it adjust the headlight up so it shines in everyone's face- then they can see (maybe not the people coming toward them though.) If you're one of these guys, don't convert your lights.

So, then, go to someplace like DDM tuning (.com) and buy a motorcycle kit for a good price and put it in your bike being careful to keep it adjusted properly. It will probably work great. If not, you didn't spend too much money and you can look for other solutions.

If you are careful and mindful of other people on the road, and understand that it may not work well enough to be worth it, then I say go for it. You'll maybe be out $50 and you'll have a better understanding of your bike.
 
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boney said:
The key to an HID retrofit is two fold.

First, you need a single element lens with a single element bulb for it to work. If you have H4 bulbs or other hi/lo in the same lens and bulb combo it's not going to work correctly. This is why ST Guy has never had success. The Honda ST1100 and ST1300 use dual filament bulbs in lenses designed to be both a hi and low. It's a bad idea. Not only is the light diffuse and unfocused, but it blinds everyone else on the road and it will piss them off. And because the HID bulb does not have the same shaped 'element' as the halogen, it lights up all kinds of places in the dual element reflector it shouldn't. Just say no.

Next, you need a headlight that has a modern style focused light pattern in either a low-beam or high-beam lens but not both. One with a definitive cut-off above which it does not project light. A horizon of sorts. Most projector housings and many, many motorcycles built since about 2000 have them, even without the projector housing. You also have to be one of those people okay with putting the horizon where it belongs, which is low enough to keep it out of on-coming traffic's eyes. I know several old people who have vision problems or cataracts who can't see anything above the horizon on a dark road. What these dudes do it adjust the headlight up so it shines in everyone's face- then they can see (maybe not the people coming toward them though.) If you're one of these guys, don't convert your lights.

So, then, go to someplace like DDM tuning (.com) and buy a motorcycle kit for a good price and put it in your bike being careful to keep it adjusted properly. It will probably work great. If not, you didn't spend too much money and you can look for other solutions.

If you are careful and mindful of other people on the road, and understand that it may not work well enough to be worth it, then I say go for it. You'll maybe be out $50 and you'll have a better understanding of your bike.
Click to expand...
True HID retrofit - projector housings and bi-xenon bulbs. Bi-xenon = high and low.
http://bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=324085
 
Respectfully disagree with what boney said.

A proper HID kit setup is great for cars, but terrible for motorcycles. And manufacturers such as DDM or TRS don't know better.

A sharp cutoff like the one you see on cars won't work for a motorcycle if you ever plan on taking turns.
 
motomania2007 said:
HID requires a different reflector and/or lense than a halogen bulb to focus and direct the light properly.

I put one on my bmw, didn't like it because the light pattern sucked and I could not see far enough ahead.

I put one on my fz09 and the low beam is ok but not as good as the H4 it replaced. High beam was much worse than the H4.

What is better is that I notice other drivers seem to see me better with the HID than without.
Click to expand...

I recently threw in a 55w DDM H4 Hi/Low hid setup in my fz09 and it blows the stock halogen out of the water in terms if light output. Sure it's not in a projector lens setup, but at least it has a shield fixed to the bulb housing to limit the low beam from shining too high.
 
mrzuzzo said:
Respectfully disagree with what boney said.

A proper HID kit setup is great for cars, but terrible for motorcycles. And manufacturers such as DDM or TRS don't know better.

A sharp cutoff like the one you see on cars won't work for a motorcycle if you ever plan on taking turns.
Click to expand...

Well I can't say what BMW and KTM are thinking, but all of my recent KTM and BMWS have had the horizon light pattern. And they all retrofitted to HID awesomely. Whether or not that type of beam is appropriate for motorcycles is a different discussion. They came on mine. For riding the twistis in the dark I suggest a nice set of LED accessory lights. If you buy the good ones it's like having the sun at your back all night long.

DDM and TRS know exactly what they're doing. They're selling illegal retrofit kits for off road use only to anyone who wants one.
 
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ST Guy said:
Not necessarily. If it's a retrofit bulb going into a housing where the reflector and lens is designed for halogen, then it'll work about as good as a flaming turd. Reflector and lens designs are very different for different bulb types. That's why the cheap retrofit kits that put HID or LED bulbs in halogen designed housings suck.
Click to expand...

I dunno.... I've had really good luck driving at night by flaming turds! I will give ya that they don't last very long, though, especially at freeway speeds. :rolleyes

I tried HID retrofit and agree: terrible scatter.

Currently I'm running a LED replacement that does reasonably well in the stock housing. No cars flash me and it's definitely brighter than the halogen OEM, even if it's not quite as tightly focused. I also have a pair of LED running lamps that give me the added throw needed for freeway speeds, and I use them with consideration of other drivers.
 
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