Reli
Well-known member
Well my lower back actually prefers clip-ons, because I can use my thigh and torso muscles to absorb bumps. With high bars, bumps go straight up my spine.
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New Kawasaki Ninja 400
- Thread starter mrzuzzo
- Start date
Hmm... I actually broke my back and am very sensitive to riding position, and never found this to be a problem. How do your neck, shoulders, and wrists fare with the leaned over position? What bike with high bars did you try? I find that the VStrom 650 with a very plush seat is the epitome of riding comfort.
Reli
Well-known member
Take the naked SV650 for example, I bought the S model instead, as my first bike back in 2002. I find that lower bars (clip-ons) allow your back to act like a leaf spring, absorbing bumps better than it would if your back was straight up and down like a pile driver. That and I grip the tank firmly so that there's little to no weight on the bars.
When I first started riding, I put most of the weight into the bars, and a few weeks later I wondered why I developed rotary cuff pain. Plus I wasn't even gripping the tank, so I felt like I was going to get blown off the bike at highway speed. Learned a lesson there.
When I first started riding, I put most of the weight into the bars, and a few weeks later I wondered why I developed rotary cuff pain. Plus I wasn't even gripping the tank, so I felt like I was going to get blown off the bike at highway speed. Learned a lesson there.
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Kestrel
Active member
I can't agree with this.
Ninja 400 is not a 'sport' bike per se. Sporty? Sure. Sport bike? No. Ridden in a very sporting manner? That's a grey area. What does that even mean?
You cite a 50cc two stroke bike coming in at cheaper, with the twin spar frame and USD forks... but it also came with a 50cc two stroke engine, which costs significantly less to make than a 400cc 4 stroke engine. Manufacturing costs could be poured into other areas... Is it better than a Ninja 250? That depends.
I rode a Ninja 250 8000 miles in four weeks this summer. NC to CA to WI to NC. Hit up beautiful twisties in Colorado.. Rode through the beautiful wasteland that is southern Utah. Slept under the stars in Nevada. Dipped toes in the pacific in Oregon. Watched ash rain down as Crater Lake burned. Crawled into ice filled volcanic caves in Idaho. Heard wolves howl off in the distance in Yellowstone. Fight insane headwinds through South Dakota... etc ... etc... etc...
The bike? It was sufficient. Not great at times; totally gutless and carburetor mixture was fucked at high elevations in Colorado. Lack of wind protection wrecked me across SD.
It's a cheap bike; I think I paid $1500 with 6000 miles or something on it... I had 7200 miles on the odometer this past April, and I'm about to crack 20k here at the end of October.
It's not a sport bike, but I can drag knee on it. It's not a touring bike, but I saw the USA. It's not the best commuter, but it gets mid 50s, is easy on tires, and is cheap to insure. It does pretty well at everything, and it's cheap. That's what these bikes are... cheap introductions to motorcycling that can dabble in all different areas... Not a niche 50cc sport bike that wants to bounce off the rev limiter in 20-60mph twisties all day.
A Derbi never would have made that trip. It never would work as a daily commuter 40 miles on the highway. It'll certainly compete to an extent on tight twisty roads, but when the rate of speed goes up to any decent amount, it's left for dust.
Apples to oranges. They aren't competing.
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Joseppi
no longer bikeless.
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im still sketchy from my stroke 3 years ago and riding on the pavement scares the shite out of me ,i lost everything i ever knew about riding pavement with my memory loss and i feel it would be dangerous for me to be out there with anybody so i just stick to dirt riding,im happy with that and it has been helping with my memory
Blankpage
alien
There is truth to that. Current and last two bikes have handlebars and dirt riding seating position. I notice the impacts are straight up the spine unless you're standing which I don't do while street riding.
He's probably gonna suggest you should have taken a car. Or that you could have shaved 2 minutes off your cross country tour had your bike been equipped with radial brakes and USD forks.
Reli
Well-known member
Not to mention that USD forks simply look better. And let's get serious, how much more could they possibly cost? Ooh boy, a shim stack instead of a damping rod, ooh that's some massive machining cost.
mrzuzzo
New member
Grom USD forks are pretty shitty and cheap.
I also don't know why Kawi couldn't have used USD forks...
Yes there is: corners.
Well if that's how you feel then it's fairly obvious that you don't understand this bike, nor this conversation.
The Ninja 400 is a sport bike.
Revzilla considers it a sport bike.
Road Racing World considers it a sport bike.
Cycle World considers it a sport bike.
There are more, although this should be plenty to illustrate the point. Still, I'll go one further just in case you need it sent home. Even Kawasaki considers it a sport bike.
How you use the bike doesn't change what it is--for instance I commute on an 899. That doesn't magically make it not a super bike. It's still a super bike.
The Ninja 400 is a sport bike.
Marcoose
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As (I) mentioned above, there are a dozen parts that Japanese motorbike makers could add to their stock models and wouldn’t increase OTD by $500. Adjustable rearsets, shorty adjustable levers, braided lines, ‘real’ tyres, etc. Go figure.
sckego
doesn't like crashing
And that increase in OTD price would lead to less sales, less profit. Don't imagine that they haven't done the research and analysis that determines their product choices. The riders who want fancy shit can still buy a budget bike and add stuff on. Riders who want a budget bike won't necessarily pay an additional $500 over a competitors offering.
I'm sure they could figure out a damping rod USD fork
I suspect the price difference is significant to them.
Marcoose
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Hardly, tho it’s IMHO. IMHO Japanese motorbike makers are selling sub par “sporty” models. If they’re including slipper clutch and performance electronics, they’re targeting a clientele that want braided lines and adjustable rearsets. Additional cost at the factory? $20. Go figure.
As for this 400 be a budget motorbike, gut feeling says it’ll be close to $7K OTD. You can buy an umolested ‘03 954 or a brand new Nighthawk 250 for $4K. Perhaps we diverge a bit on the meaning of budget, but the cost-conscious motorcyclist has loads of options below $7K. IMHO, YMMV and that good stuff.
russ69
Backside Slider
I guess you never railed through a corner, checked your six, and saw nothing but a GSXR1000 headlight? Or Keith Code running your butt down on a Z1?Yes there is: corners.
I check my 6 all the time!
I will grant you that there are some people that can ride like that, but most of those only do so on the track. I have seen a few of them in the SC mtns--terrifyingly fast, although very rare as they don't tend to ride the roads I ride.
I've never seen anyone that fast (on one of those bikes) in Marin, but I don't go out there early on Sunday mornings! And the percentage of people that own those bikes, and can ride like that is really tiny.
MysterYvil
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How much time do you spend staring at your forks?
HuffPo and salon.com also consider them to be "sport" bikes. Doesn't necessarily make them so.Yes there is: corners.
Well if that's how you feel then it's fairly obvious that you don't understand this bike, nor this conversation.
The Ninja 400 is a sport bike.
Revzilla considers it a sport bike.
Road Racing World considers it a sport bike.
Cycle World considers it a sport bike.
There are more, although this should be plenty to illustrate the point. Still, I'll go one further just in case you need it sent home. Even Kawasaki considers it a sport bike.
How you use the bike doesn't change what it is--for instance I commute on an 899. That doesn't magically make it not a super bike. It's still a super bike.
The Ninja 400 is a sport bike.
Distrophe
Member
I also find it funny that usd just means upside down, AFAIK.
Sounds dumb sometimes.... "Hey buddy your forks are upside down!"
I'd like to test out this new Ninja 400
I had a 1980 kdx 80 & still have an '81 kdx 175 as a backup. Newfangled forks? Honey badger don't give a Fook.
'92 KTM 300 exc (WB usd forks) succeeded those. It's a bad mofo with 3rd gear wheelies .... On dirt.
.Geared to do 80+, almost too much for woods riding, haha.
FreeRyde
The Curmudgeon
Hardly, tho it’s IMHO. IMHO Japanese motorbike makers are selling sub par “sporty” models. If they’re including slipper clutch and performance electronics, they’re targeting a clientele that want braided lines and adjustable rearsets. Additional cost at the factory? $20. Go figure.
As for this 400 be a budget motorbike, gut feeling says it’ll be close to $7K OTD. You can buy an umolested ‘03 954 or a brand new Nighthawk 250 for $4K. Perhaps we diverge a bit on the meaning of budget, but the cost-conscious motorcyclist has loads of options below $7K. IMHO, YMMV and that good stuff.
It's interesting that you disregard peoples (whom work in industry) opinions so light heatedly. It's not like Kawasaki has a SS brake line manufacturing department, they can't just hollar down the hall and say "whip me up some cheap SS lines for this here Ninja 400 budget bike". They have to call up their supplier and ORDER lines or parts of lines, this all costs money.
What Ninja 300 rider have you talked to that said "Man, I really need some SS brake lines on this here savage beast", how many Ninja 300's have you seen on the street with adjustable rearsets on them? I've seen me hundreds of dem little 250's and 300's, in all my years, I've maybe seen 2-3 with adjustable rearsets. (Besides track bikes)
Also, the ninja 400 will not be seven thousand flipping dollars.
If it is, I'll buy us a round of beers and we can cheers to my blissful ignorance.
I can buy an Apple at Safeway, they also sell banana cream pies. Who cares how much a 2003 CBR954RR costs? People who are buying Ninja 400's sure don't.
Marcoose
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While not familiar with Kawasaki’s operations, it’s well-known that auto ‘manufacturers’ actually don’t manufacture much, often times just the block and the chassis. All other parts are sourced; fluids, fuses, lamps, tyres, knobs, hoses, batteries, gauges, wires, etc. Assuming that’s the case, whether rubber or braided lines, it’d be sourced in bulk, and the factory price delta is very small.
That previous comment was a blanket comment for Japanese sporty motorbikes in general, compared to their European counterparts. Even the top litre Japanese motorbikes still roll out with ‘cheap’ parts. But that’s IMHO and evidently YMMV.
That’s all I have to say to you.