More shity gas on the way.....More Ethanol! WTF?

[revnort]

I agree that there's BS on both sides. But unlike some. I do take sides and I'm not shy about it. I like the idea of moving forward with technology and transportation methods. But I don't want the government leading that charge. I want to see industry, entrepreneurs and the consumer leading the push for clean energy and what not. Now pardon my raunchy and tasteless use of the pics I post. I'ts my sarcastic way of getting people to see what is happening to our country and who is mostly responsible for it...

Ok fair enough, you wanted a reaction. I knew that

The government is NOT leading the charge on this though. They granted a request from refineries to add more ethanol. It isn't mandatory. Sounds like free market to me. They did offer an incentive. Probably also at the request of said industry. We grow A LOT of F@#$ing corn. It's worth a lot of money.

So how is Obama responsible for this? Hes responding to our capitalist system. Lobbyists lobby. They want more money. Nothing new here.

Also, my points from before... Isn't this GOOD for America? Money to farmers, back to the economy, less dependence on foreign oil etc etc. The only adverse effect is it COULD harm my vehicle (debatable, depending on who you ask, and I don't know the answer...but I trust those more mechanically inclined that it does suck).

As a marine I know you agree with putting your country's needs before your own. It's kind of a job requirement. Thats not intended to be a personal dig (I have the utmost respect for those that serve). I am just saying beside it affecting ME, what is the problem with this?

 

[Grikl]

E15 will make it worse - right now the 'hit rate' of tank problem is about 50/50... and increase from E10 to E15 for sure won't help the situation.

oh ok maybe i should read up on it

but it sounds like something else plays a factor maybe bikes left in the sun v guys who garage their bikes?
cuz i doont think they would coat some tanks and not others
if I had one of thoes tanks I surely would pull it off coat it and not worry anymore

 

[sandyxb]

If this trend continues you may end up over the legal limit while at the gas station

 

[Aluisious]

so whats this mean to us illiterate peeps

It means your tax money is going to farmers to make a gas additive that requires more gas to produce than it saves, and will fuck up your bike.

And, it's not as powerful as real gas.

Win win win

 

[UDRider]

Ok fair enough, you wanted a reaction. I knew that

The government is NOT leading the charge on this though. They granted a request from refineries to add more ethanol. It isn't mandatory. Sounds like free market to me. They did offer an incentive. Probably also at the request of said industry. We grow A LOT of F@#$ing corn. It's worth a lot of money.

So how is Obama responsible for this? Hes responding to our capitalist system. Lobbyists lobby. They want more money. Nothing new here.

Also, my points from before... Isn't this GOOD for America? Money to farmers, back to the economy, less dependence on foreign oil etc etc. The only adverse effect is it COULD harm my vehicle (debatable, depending on who you ask, and I don't know the answer...but I trust those more mechanically inclined that it does suck).

As a marine I know you agree with putting your country's needs before your own. It's kind of a job requirement. Thats not intended to be a personal dig (I have the utmost respect for those that serve). I am just saying beside it affecting ME, what is the problem with this?

Ah yes the corn must flow.

 

[Aluisious]

Also, my points from before... Isn't this GOOD for America? Money to farmers, back to the economy, less dependence on foreign oil etc etc. The only adverse effect is it COULD harm my vehicle (debatable, depending on who you ask, and I don't know the answer...but I trust those more mechanically inclined that it does suck).

No, because they burn more oil producing ethanol than it replaces in gasoline.

 

[Aluisious]

Ah yes the corn must flow.

[youtube]vMkGkRw1h7Q[/youtube]

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[revnort]

Where? "The Obama administration grante a request from ethanol producers to increase concentrations of the corn-based fuel additive in gasoline for vehicles made for 2007 and later." http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-...rmit-blending-more-ethanol-into-gasoline.html

It already harmed my vehicle. I had a leaky plastic gas tank replaced on one of my new bikes already. It was a pain in the ass to have it replaced under warranty and I don't want to go through that again. Now my warranty is almost expired and I don't shit money. I find it interesting how politicians are so apathetic to other people's money. If Ethanol is going to screw-up my bikes or car? Then I don't want it. Specially if it's signed off by that dope head, Obama...

OK, thats true. It is sounding like a bad idea as others have made some good points on why ethanol is negative. However, my point is that it is free market, corn lobbyists, and the ethanol producers ASKING for it. It isn't really Obama's fault. Nothing would be different if someone else was in charge. From my understanding farming subsidies aren't really a partisan issue. You find both parties for and against.

Thanks for the discussion. It helps me to understand other's viewpoints. Its how I wade through the BS.

 

[hayabusafiend]

I used to be against extended warranties. Now it looks like they will actually pay for themselves thanks to E10 and E15. Manufacturers will get absolutely hammered with warranty claims and lawsuits.

Well done EPA.

The first person to die by an engine fire due to a fuel leak will put an end to E15. Please, please don't let that day come.

 

[achung123]

yes thats right cuz what I heard is the epa dident allow the type of sealer they use so ducati just sold them with a sealer lol

No shit.... F EPA...

but it sounds like something else plays a factor maybe bikes left in the sun v guys who garage their bikes?

Not that I know of - heat from the sun can hardly compare with the engine heat, and UV will damage the paint, not the form of the tank. Shitty gasoline on the other hand will deform the gas tank quick. In my case, less than 1500 miles on my Streetfighter - and I ride weekend only, and the rest of the time my bike is in my garage.

It means your tax money is going to farmers to make a gas additive that requires more gas to produce than it saves, and will fuck up your bike.

And, it's not as powerful as real gas.

Win win win

Well said man!

 

[Grikl]

well any way my point was it would be less stressful to just line your tank if you know the problem is known

 

[achung123]

well any way my point was it would be less stressful to just line your tank if you know the problem is known

I did... one more to go

 

[sliverstorm]

"The Obama administration doesn’t have the power to order use of E15, though the decision has “the potential to increase the use of renewable fuels in the future,” McCarthy said."

And this is only for 2007 and newer vehicles. Is anyone really going to pay attention to what year vehicle fills from which pump? Not like they're going to a different filler-neck size, so this must be entirely voluntary?!

It's not an official requirement yet. Also, easy; the gas station will just sell the one kind of gas, and 99% of the saps who fill up won't know what's happening.

Only reason gas stations today have more than a single option is because 91 is a must-have while 87 is cheap enough to get people to care enough about the difference. They probably wouldn't offer 89, but it's easy to prepare on the fly- 1 part 87 per 1 part 91.

 

[sliverstorm]

It means your tax money is going to farmers to make a gas additive that requires more gas to produce than it saves, and will fuck up your bike.

And, it's not as powerful as real gas.

Win win win

I used to be a car guy before I got into bikes, and we discussed ethanol a lot. IIRC that's not precisely true. E85 does not have as much energy as gas, so it's less fuel-efficient and produces less power, but here's the thing: in terms of detonation resistance and other such qualities, it's supposedly about as good as 102 octane race gas if you tune your engine right, so you can get a lot more power out of it with proper adjustment (now you ask, why would I want to use it instead of 102 octane race gas!? ... well, it's a hell of a lot cheaper, and may one day be available at every corner pump unlike 102)

If this trend continues you may end up over the legal limit while at the gas station

It may well go something like that, yes. E85 is hovering just beyond the horizon- you'll basically be running your vehicles on 170 proof

 

[wrexallen]

I do, in fact, find this offensive. ...But posting some shit like this just simply not cool

Seriously?

 

[Roadstergal]

try thinking about it

Good luck.

 

[Ogg]

The college student in the lab, scientists, entrepreneurs and private investors willing to take a risk on new technology are the one's who get the job done. Lawyers turned politicians do not. They can only mandate. The more the government controls, the less control you will have of your own destiny...

[jack] A huge amount of that university research that's going on is, in fact, funded directly by government grants. Another huge chunk comes from corporate grants and partnerships. Nuthin' to do with runnin' the bike on corn-likker, but the image of the plucky independent researcher working with only the funds in his meager bank account or VC/angel funding is mostly myth.
Signed - a guy who did university research for about 8 years
[/jack]

On topic: I want plain distilled dinosaur in my ride. Where's the black market for it?

 

[Razorback]

No, because they burn more oil producing ethanol than it replaces in gasoline.

As I recall, this is one of the contributing factors as to why ethanol for fuel actually has a larger carbon footprint than just dinojuice.

Maybe someone with more info can chime in on this?

 

[Slate]

I used to be a car guy before I got into bikes, and we discussed ethanol a lot. IIRC that's not precisely true. E85 does not have as much energy as gas, so it's less fuel-efficient and produces less power, but here's the thing: in terms of detonation resistance and other such qualities, it's supposedly about as good as 102 octane race gas if you tune your engine right, so you can get a lot more power out of it with proper adjustment (now you ask, why would I want to use it instead of 102 octane race gas!? ... well, it's a hell of a lot cheaper, and may one day be available at every corner pump unlike 102)

The problem is precisely what you just described. E85 has less power potential, therefore it requires a larger amount to produce the same combustion. I know many tuners who switch to E85. They have 2 things in common, lots of HP and extremely poor mpg. When you convert to E85, you have to increase your injector size by as much as 25%. E85 will also break down natural rubbers fast, so the tuners replace fuel o-rings with Viton seals.

The only thing I see from this is that the lobby group got what they were paid to get. E15, if sold, will likely have it's own pump (as the article suggested). As long as E10 is still around, I don't think we'll see any worse case scenarios. E85 is usually a yellow pump, Diesel is green, so if they color code E85, it shouldn't be much of an issue. Just make sure you steer clear from it

 

[Slate]

As I recall, this is one of the contributing factors as to why ethanol for fuel actually has a larger carbon footprint than just dinojuice.

Maybe someone with more info can chime in on this?

Ethanol produces less CO2, but has been found in one study to produce higher levels of formaldehyde and acetaldehyde, both toxic to humans. So, we're still killing ourselves, one way or another.

http://www.helium.com/items/483846-the-impact-of-e85-on-greenhouse-gas-emissions