Who's gone Solar

[TwistedGRAY]

I'll have to look. I'm confident in everything other than mounting the racks to the roof, because I have no experience with that and don't want to risk a leak. The permitting and financial aspect of it are also a bit mysterious. I'm confident I could install the system and get it working properly, but getting the permit signed and all my money due back might be worth hiring someone.

It's just a matter of drilling holes and then managing the water ingress (caulk, silicone, yada yada). My hands aren't made for manual labor, but it cannot be that complicated. It's construction...not rocket science...watch a video, follow along.

The permitting side of things...yah...that's a different story.

But if you are crafty, hands-on person, I would absolutely look into doing it yourself. Your city will have someone responsible for building permits, and I bet they can easily walk you through the process of getting the permits. And if you have someone doing your taxes, reach out to them and discuss ahead of time. I suspect that would be pretty hands off, too (but not sure on that).

 

[Starpower]

If getting batteries later be sure that the inverter you first purchase is capable. Otherwise you'll be buying another inverter, some batteries systems have one integrated into the package.

As to the paperwork, I would seek out a person or firm (some specialize in just doing the solar doc's.) to do both the permit and utility submittals. It is complicated, time consuming and confusing and well worth the loss of headaches from taking it on yourself.

 

[greenmonster]

SolarEdge vs Enphase?
I have received two quotes now. One company uses SolarEdge inverters and the other uses Enphase inverters.
The Enphase guy is cheaper by $3700. The SolarEdge guy says his inverters are superior to Enphase in terms of efficiency but a quick Google search shows they are pretty much the same.
The SolarEdge system generates 6.4 kWh and the Enphase generates 6.080 kWh with the same number of panels so there is a slight difference there.

Any reason why I'd want to go with SolarEdge and pay the higher price?

 

[kingmoochr]

If getting batteries later be sure that the inverter you first purchase is capable. Otherwise you'll be buying another inverter, some batteries systems have one integrated into the package.

As to the paperwork, I would seek out a person or firm (some specialize in just doing the solar doc's.) to do both the permit and utility submittals. It is complicated, time consuming and confusing and well worth the loss of headaches from taking it on yourself.

I definitely want to play a larger role in equipment selection than most typical customers I imagine. I'd build my own battery out of cells (appropriately) so I'd want them to put in an inverter capable of simply accepting a 48v DC input. If it does any monitoring that'd be a bonus, but not necessary. I think a firm to do the paperwork would be ideal, but I'm 99.9% certain that won't be accomplished by me by NEM3 deadline. The other consideration is, is it worth getting an oversized system now to simply meet the deadline, if the majority of my bill is currently gas? I didn't spend more than $90 in a single month last year on electricity, but several $200+ months of gas. Everything other than the dryer that would be gas is currently, but they'd all be eventually swapped out for electric. I also expect to own 1-2 EV's, but currently don't. So how do I even estimate for future use in such an extreme case? If I'm building battery backup, do I even care about sell rates, since I will be storing most power?

 

[bojangle]

I definitely want to play a larger role in equipment selection than most typical customers I imagine. I'd build my own battery out of cells (appropriately) so I'd want them to put in an inverter capable of simply accepting a 48v DC input. If it does any monitoring that'd be a bonus, but not necessary. I think a firm to do the paperwork would be ideal, but I'm 99.9% certain that won't be accomplished by me by NEM3 deadline. The other consideration is, is it worth getting an oversized system now to simply meet the deadline, if the majority of my bill is currently gas? I didn't spend more than $90 in a single month last year on electricity, but several $200+ months of gas. Everything other than the dryer that would be gas is currently, but they'd all be eventually swapped out for electric. I also expect to own 1-2 EV's, but currently don't. So how do I even estimate for future use in such an extreme case? If I'm building battery backup, do I even care about sell rates, since I will be storing most power?

It obviously depends how much you'd drive an EV. A typical driving amount, say 12,000 miles a year, you can roughly add 4,000 kwh per vehicle, per year. Very close to that I believe.

 

[HappyHighwayman]

So in South Africa, where the energy is very spotty, my buddy's complex has a generator, but he has a battery setup that the energy runs through so that he doesn't get an interruption for the few minutes while the generator kicks in...

it's quite small (but very heavy) and seems to be made of 3-4 car-type batteries. Can run his house for a while. It wasn't thousands of dollars. Is something like this available for homes in California or do you need to spend a small fortune on a battery?

 

[kingmoochr]

So in South Africa, where the energy is very spotty, my buddy's complex has a generator, but he has a battery setup that the energy runs through so that he doesn't get an interruption for the few minutes while the generator kicks in...

it's quite small (but very heavy) and seems to be made of 3-4 car-type batteries. Can run his house for a while. It wasn't thousands of dollars. Is something like this available for homes in California or do you need to spend a small fortune on a battery?

The inverter is less than $1000 (for 3kw, small short term backup size). How you choose to store the energy and charge the batteries is up to you. Sure, you could stack up a whole bunch of lead acid batteries and charge them back up with a massive generator (if it has to run your house at the same time) or solar panels. But most people doing this is out of want, not need, so they usually have the disposable income to do something better. LiFePO4 is the preferred home chemistry.

 

[scratchpad]

I didn't spend more than $90 in a single month last year on electricit
I also expect to own 1-2 EV's, but currently don't.

Id never consider going solar with that electric bill. Also, with adding an EV i wouldnt either. Youre still looking at probably less than $150 a month

 

[Starpower]

Time is running out. All the fence sitters should strongly consider getting off of it. You have until April 13 to get your applications in to the utility and permitting office in order to lock in NEM2 for 20 years. When it changes to NEM3 (in April) the value of your production will decrease by 75-80%. You just need to get your paperwork submitted and then you have a few years to get it installed.

More info here: https://solarrights.org/faqnem3/

 

[HappyHighwayman]

The inverter is less than $1000 (for 3kw, small short term backup size). How you choose to store the energy and charge the batteries is up to you. Sure, you could stack up a whole bunch of lead acid batteries and charge them back up with a massive generator (if it has to run your house at the same time) or solar panels. But most people doing this is out of want, not need, so they usually have the disposable income to do something better. LiFePO4 is the preferred home chemistry.

Thanks a lot.

Right now I break even on the electricity so a battery would just push my break even out even more years with no benefit.

 

[TwistedGRAY]

Id never consider going solar with that electric bill. Also, with adding an EV i wouldnt either. Youre still looking at probably less than $150 a month

Yeah, but if he is trying to offset his high gas portion of the bill while also eliminating his electric portion, wouldn't you still consider it?

 

[TwistedGRAY]

When it changes to NEM3 (in April) the value of your production will decrease by 75-80%.

Isn't it more accurate to say that the value of your OVER production will decrease.

The value of what you use in your home will be consistently the same. Well, I guess you could argue that the value of your use will increase as the differential is paid off through the longevity of the system.

 

[kingmoochr]

Thanks a lot.

Right now I break even on the electricity so a battery would just push my break even out even more years with no benefit.

The primary benefit is running your house off-grid. If you have hybrid capability in your inverter, $2000 in battery could theoretically help you out when the power goes out. How many fridges full of groceries is that for you? What's loss of convenience worth? If you work from home your answer is probably drastically different.

 

[kingmoochr]

Isn't it more accurate to say that the value of your OVER production will decrease.

The value of what you use in your home will be consistently the same. Well, I guess you could argue that the value of your use will increase as the differential is paid off through the longevity of the system.

Yeah, the value increases with the increase of the cost of a kwh. You're basically fixing your electricity cost now. My issue is I don't expect to have a lot of over-production since I'd have a battery system. I'd be battery at night in stead of buying power back, so there's less value in my making extra to sell it. So do I need to rush into it? As for my meager consumption, I'm anticipating that to increase greatly not only with EV's, but also with an electric stove, and heat pump water heater and furnaces. I just don't know what that final number would look like. Double current? Triple?

 

[HappyHighwayman]

I'm in a special area that doesn't have a lot of power outrages. I'm near hospitals and fire departments etc. I can't remember the last outage, maybe 1 in 10 years since I've been here?

i work from home 3/5 days

 

[kingmoochr]

I'm in a special area that doesn't have a lot of power outrages. I'm near hospitals and fire departments etc. I can't remember the last outage, maybe 1 in 10 years since I've been here?

i work from home 3/5 days

I work at the 911 center for SF. Our power was out for 16 hours on New Years, as soon as PGE had the majority of the area fixed (after 3 hours), they took off. They only care about # impacted, not who you are. Those places you mentioned aren't priority, they have their own generators.

 

[HappyHighwayman]

Ok? I still haven't had more than 1 outage in 10 years.

 

[kingmoochr]

Ok? I still haven't had more than 1 outage in 10 years.

You're lucky, not due to your proximity to other facilities. Your infrastructure isn't any more robust or more highly prioritized. Sounds like you have little need for a battery.

 

[mean dad]

Apologies if this has been addressed already.

First round of quotes all had Enphase inverters, with different brands of panels, but I just got off the phone with a solar guy and their company leans towards individual optimizers on the roof with the panels, and a single inverter in the garage (or elsewhere, just not under a panel on the roof).
His reasoning is that the inverters are affected by heat and in the middle of a triple digit day my output is reduced; inverters are more likely to fail due to heat than optimizers; and general longevity of optimizers vs inverters.

What does the brain trust say to this? Is he hustling me?
I'm in P'burg and it routinely gets over 100 in the summer so I don't want to ignore legit issues.

 

[bojangle]

Time is running out. All the fence sitters should strongly consider getting off of it. You have until April 13 to get your applications in to the utility and permitting office in order to lock in NEM2 for 20 years. When it changes to NEM3 (in April) the value of your production will decrease by 75-80%. You just need to get your paperwork submitted and then you have a few years to get it installed.

More info here: https://solarrights.org/faqnem3/

Yup. I'd been a fence sitter for a while. More so after I purchased an EV in June. If you want to do it, and it makes sense for you, now is definitely the time to act.

Apologies if this has been addressed already.

First round of quotes all had Enphase inverters, with different brands of panels, but I just got off the phone with a solar guy and their company leans towards individual optimizers on the roof with the panels, and a single inverter in the garage (or elsewhere, just not under a panel on the roof).
His reasoning is that the inverters are affected by heat and in the middle of a triple digit day my output is reduced; inverters are more likely to fail due to heat than optimizers; and general longevity of optimizers vs inverters.

What does the brain trust say to this? Is he hustling me?
I'm in P'burg and it routinely gets over 100 in the summer so I don't want to ignore legit issues.

It sounds to me like legit advice. But I probably know about as much as you do, so that doesn't mean too much.