Anti-Asian Hate Crimes

[Eldritch]

I'm was not making an argument, I was reacting to your post.

You were the one making the argument and you wrote it in the same way the NFL had architected their criteria for paying out a settlement for brain injuries.

Let me remind you again:

I get that you were posting that as an argument against unfair racial judgements, but can you at least admit that a lot of the stuff you have been posting really seems like you have a beef with the black community that is targeted and specific?

It seems like most of the people responding to you have you painted as a racist and aren't even really trying to hear where you are coming from anymore. I mean if that is true, I guess own it and do your thing. If it is not, you might need to do a better job with spinning your position to establish more trust before you will be able to have a reasonable discussion with most these cats.

Does that makes sense to you or no?

 

[NSR500]

Are we still discussing Asian hate crimes?

In an obtuse way.

Basically, I post a legitimate and current news link to an Anti-Asian Hate Crime and people get offended that the perpetrator of the crime is BIPOC.

 

[scootergmc]

I've learned black people disproportionately commit crimes against asians because the white man is pulling the strings, you know, because Covid.

 

[NSR500]

I get that you were posting that as an argument against unfair racial judgements, but can you at least admit that a lot of the stuff you have been posting really seems like you have a beef with the black community that is targeted and specific?

It seems like most of the people responding to you have you painted as a racist and aren't even really trying to hear where you are coming from anymore. I mean if that is true, I guess own it and do your thing. If it is not, you might need to do a better job with spinning your position to establish more trust before you will be able to have a reasonable discussion with most these cats.

Does that makes sense to you or no?

Makes perfect sense because there's an established narrative that anything posted that isn't in support of CRT will put a target on the back of the poster.

Also fitting that my reaction with the other post and NFL accusation was in the corner supporting BIPOC, but still I get labeled as Anti-BIPOC.

The exchange was literally: (Summarized)

Karbon - BIPOC suffer from poverty, stress, etc which cause cognitive issues in decision making

Me - "Facepalm"... You're literally taking the position of the NFL which judges BIPOC to have lower cognitive ability

Karbon - Why you hate BIPOC?

 

[Climber]

Guy with a narrative accuses everybody who calls him out on it of having narrative.

 

[Sharxfan]

This is the "just stop being poor" argument.

While that it's true that it's uniquely American to consume at the levels we do, the data shows it's not just as simple as this.

And also, being impoverished, over time affects ones cognitive functions negatively due to poor nutrition, stress, health, education (financial or otherwise)ect.

I am not using the stop being poor argument. I am stating that if you give a person money and they blow it on frivolous things how are you helping them or are you instead enabling them?

Welfare in this country was meant to be a hand up to better your situation but instead it has become self-perpetuating system that helps to keep people down and dependent on the system. For example if you save a bit of money then you are denied benefits. If you try to work then you are denied benefits. that is not how it should be. Welfare needs to be reformed but it is the third rail of politics you touch it and your political dreams die. I also think we should have term limits for politicians because the way things are all they care about is getting reelected and not always what is best for their constituents just mostly what will get me back in office. but that is a pol sink topic.

Pop culture does not help either. buy this buy that and you will be cool doesn't matter if you can't afford it, it's all about perceived status.

I think a lot of this starts at home and home is where we should be focused on, maybe link grades to benefits or something so that there is an incentive for people to have their kids get good grades in school. make it so there is a perceived value in education so that people don't think that sports is the only way out of poverty.

I get there are obstacles to bettering your situation but they can be overcome with help not handouts. The whole teach a person to fish versus giving them a fish argument....

Sorry for the rant and stream of consciousness post.

 

[NSR500]

Guy with a narrative accuses everybody who calls him out on it of having narrative.

Call the news stations if you don't like their reporting.

Lastly, if it isn't black people attacking Asians in higher frequency than other demographics, then why is the media focusing on it?

https://www.etonline.com/jada-pinke...eath-divide-between-black-americans-and-asian

I see 4 black people and Lisa Ling specifically talking about Black v Asian divide. Typical to Hollywood, they blame White people again.

Titled, "Confronting the Divide Between Black and Asian Americans," the episode shows the group discuss the tragic increasing rates of racial violence against Asian Americans, which has skyrocketed since the beginning of the coronavirus pandemic. They begin by touching on how white supremacy impacts all the races and how people start competing with and comparing each other.

 

[Climber]

I am not using the stop being poor argument. I am stating that if you give a person money and they blow it on frivolous things how are you helping them or are you instead enabling them?

Welfare in this country was meant to be a hand up to better your situation but instead it has become self-perpetuating system that helps to keep people down and dependent on the system. For example if you save a bit of money then you are denied benefits. If you try to work then you are denied benefits. that is not how it should be. Welfare needs to be reformed but it is the third rail of politics you touch it and your political dreams die. I also think we should have term limits for politicians because the way things are all they care about is getting reelected and not always what is best for their constituents just mostly what will get me back in office. but that is a pol sink topic.

Pop culture does not help either. buy this buy that and you will be cool doesn't matter if you can't afford it, it's all about perceived status.

I think a lot of this starts at home and home is where we should be focused on, maybe link grades to benefits or something so that there is an incentive for people to have their kids get good grades in school. make it so there is a perceived value in education so that people don't think that sports is the only way out of poverty.

I get there are obstacles to bettering your situation but they can be overcome with help not handouts. The whole teach a person to fish versus giving them a fish argument....

Sorry for the rant and stream of consciousness post.

I think that you're buying into the fiction that the anti-welfare folks have been peddling that 'ALL' welfare recipients are just using welfare to avoid having to work. That BS has been going on for a long time, with a few, often recycled, examples being held up as 'proof'.

School grades and how kids do in them is a whole other conversation. Look at the school ratings in crappy towns. Richmond 3 schools are rated 1/10, 2/10 and 3/10. If you look at other poor towns, you'll see the same kind of ratings.

Not all schools are created equal...by a long shot. It isn't just the teachers, but also the culture around the school and what goes on there. Some schools are dangerous, having fights daily.

Then there is a racism in the schools, my son was a victim of a very racist teacher, and his councilor lied through his teeth to protect her, and the principle took his obvious lies without question. This shit exists!

 

[Climber]

Call the news stations if you don't like their reporting.

Lastly, if it isn't black people attacking Asians in higher frequency than other demographics, then why is the media focusing on it?

https://www.etonline.com/jada-pinke...eath-divide-between-black-americans-and-asian

I see 4 black people and Lisa Ling specifically talking about Black v Asian divide. Typical to Hollywood, they blame White people again.

It's not the news stations that we're objecting to, it's your constant references to black people committing crimes and your apparent dislike of them.

It's hard to tell if you're unaware of your pattern or just trolling us.

 

[Sharxfan]

I think that you're buying into the fiction that the anti-welfare folks have been peddling that 'ALL' welfare recipients are just using welfare to avoid having to work. That BS has been going on for a long time, with a few, often recycled, examples being held up as 'proof'.

School grades and how kids do in them is a whole other conversation. Look at the school ratings in crappy towns. Richmond 3 schools are rated 1/10, 2/10 and 3/10. If you look at other poor towns, you'll see the same kind of ratings.

Not all schools are created equal...by a long shot. It isn't just the teachers, but also the culture around the school and what goes on there. Some schools are dangerous, having fights daily.

Then there is a racism in the schools, my son was a victim of a very racist teacher, and his councilor lied through his teeth to protect her, and the principle took his obvious lies without question. This shit exists!

Nope not at all. I think there are probably a ton that milk the system but there are others that want to get of it. If you look at what I said I wrote that the system is designed to keep people dependent on it. If you try to work and save you lose benefits. If you get a decent job then you lose all benefits. I think it needs to be moved back to a hand up model and not a hand out model. I also think time limits should apply you can only have it for X amount of years. I think we should include job training and have people that help them get jobs.

I also didn't say racism doesn't exist. Maybe schools need a kick in the ass too and get rid of teacher tenure so we can get rid of awful teachers but that is a whole different story. I have seen the decline in schools personally my kids school was awesome but lately teacher quality has gone down so I am not impressed anymore and I live in a better heeled part of town so it happens everywhere.

 

[GAJ]

Lastly, if it isn't black people attacking Asians in higher frequency than other demographics, then why is the media focusing on it?

I posted this 10 days ago.

"Here's the most comprehensive study I could find.

Indeed Asians are attacked by non Whites at a greater percentage than Blacks are or Latinos are.

26 percent vs 1 percent vs 19 percent respectively.

But all groups are attacked by Whites far more often.

74 percent vs 99 percent vs 81 percent.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7790522/

60 percent of the US is White."

 

[NSR500]

I posted this 10 days ago.

"Here's the most comprehensive study I could find.

Indeed Asians are attacked by non Whites at a greater percentage than Blacks are or Latinos are.

26 percent vs 1 percent vs 19 percent respectively.

But all groups are attacked by Whites far more often.

74 percent vs 99 percent vs 81 percent.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7790522/

60 percent of the US is White."

As I originally posted over 30 pages ago:

https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv18.pdf

The thread title is; "Anti-Asian Hate Crimes" and according to the statistics in the BJS study there is one category where Whites are not the primary interracial perpetrator.
It is the category where Asians are the victim.

 

[Climber]

Nope not at all. I think there are probably a ton that milk the system but there are others that want to get of it. If you look at what I said I wrote that the system is designed to keep people dependent on it. If you try to work and save you lose benefits. If you get a decent job then you lose all benefits. I think it needs to be moved back to a hand up model and not a hand out model. I also think time limits should apply you can only have it for X amount of years. I think we should include job training and have people that help them get jobs.

I also didn't say racism doesn't exist. Maybe schools need a kick in the ass too and get rid of teacher tenure so we can get rid of awful teachers but that is a whole different story. I have seen the decline in schools personally my kids school was awesome but lately teacher quality has gone down so I am not impressed anymore and I live in a better heeled part of town so it happens everywhere.

Perhaps not 'designed' that way, but in practice it can work out that way.

Yeah, I've heard about the disincentives to seek work, typical feel-good but lacking in intelligent application that government programs tend to apply.

I do agree that there needs to be a better design where people trying to dig themselves out are not penalized, in the short run, for making that effort. Stupid design is stupid.

Part of the problem is that it's become a highly politicized issue so one side wants to eliminate it completely and the other side doesn't want to touch it or wants to expand it, neither side is willing to agree with a good viable solution. (I hope I didn't step too far over the line with this post, but it was necessary for the conversation and not a starter down that path. Just a statement of fact without promoting one side or the other)

 

[GAJ]

As I originally posted over 30 pages ago:

https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv18.pdf

The thread title is; "Anti-Asian Hate Crimes" and according to the statistics in the BJS study there is one category where Whites are not the primary interracial perpetrator.
It is the category where Asians are the victim.

So the two sources agree, about 1/4 of attacks on Asians are Blacks.

Your posts, oddly, are 100 percent Black on Asian crime.

 

[Climber]

So the two sources agree, about 1/4 of attacks on Asians are Blacks.

Your posts are, oddly, are 100 percent Black on Asian crime.

Imagine that.

 

[Karbon]

I'm was not making an argument, I was reacting to your post.

You were the one making the argument and you wrote it in the same way the NFL had architected their criteria for paying out a settlement for brain injuries.

Let me remind you again:

It's simply not the same context as what I asserted.


The article notes that the race norming used by tht NFL (a private org not a public in one) is a tool that's abused/misused to save money. It doesn't mean studying systemic problems and trying to fix the problems in the systems is inherently bad. Or that recognizing poverty along with racism affect certain groups of people in different ways. In fact the baseline norming method/system mention in the article was contentious and needed more refinement (which sociologist and CRT aims to do)but the NFL just ran with it because MONEY.

 

[Karbon]

I am not using the stop being poor argument. I am stating that if you give a person money and they blow it on frivolous things how are you helping them or are you instead enabling them?

Welfare in this country was meant to be a hand up to better your situation but instead it has become self-perpetuating system that helps to keep people down and dependent on the system. For example if you save a bit of money then you are denied benefits. If you try to work then you are denied benefits. that is not how it should be. Welfare needs to be reformed but it is the third rail of politics you touch it and your political dreams die. I also think we should have term limits for politicians because the way things are all they care about is getting reelected and not always what is best for their constituents just mostly what will get me back in office. but that is a pol sink topic.

Pop culture does not help either. buy this buy that and you will be cool doesn't matter if you can't afford it, it's all about perceived status.

I think a lot of this starts at home and home is where we should be focused on, maybe link grades to benefits or something so that there is an incentive for people to have their kids get good grades in school. make it so there is a perceived value in education so that people don't think that sports is the only way out of poverty.

I get there are obstacles to bettering your situation but they can be overcome with help not handouts. The whole teach a person to fish versus giving them a fish argument....

Sorry for the rant and stream of consciousness post.

I think you have this idea/perception that the exceptional few people who squander financial aid or lack financial discipline is grossly more common than it is. It's an appeal intuition and its an inaccurate and incomplete picture of poverty in the US. You've latched onto the ever pervasive concept of the Regan era "ghetto queen/king" used to deter the implementation of welfare in the US. I understand the contention us how much is enough, but it seem there a lot of people motivated by the perception of losing something than the idea of actually helping your fellow man.

All systems have inefficiencies. Moving forward we should address those shortcomings but it's no reason throw out the baby with the bath water.

 

[NSR500]

So the two sources agree, about 1/4 of attacks on Asians are Blacks.

Your posts, oddly, are 100 percent Black on Asian crime.

Other than the Atlanta sex worker shooting what story ‘in the media’ isn’t black on Asian crime?

Additionally, what isn’t a black vs Asian narrative in mainstream media that isn’t blaming whites and white supremacy for black on Asian crime?

 

[Sharxfan]

I think you have this idea/perception that the exceptional few people who squander financial aid or lack financial discipline is grossly more common than it is. It's an appeal intuition and its an inaccurate and incomplete picture of poverty in the US. You've latched onto the ever pervasive concept of the Regan era "ghetto queen/king" used to deter the implementation of welfare in the US. I understand the contention us how much is enough, but it seem there a lot of people motivated by the perception of losing something than the idea of actually helping your fellow man.

All systems have inefficiencies. Moving forward we should address those shortcomings but it's no reason throw out the baby with the bath water.

Its more pervasive here and I see it everyday. Families live in Section 8 housing blocks but yet wear the latest kicks, gold chains, trendy clothes and drive expensive cars. I am not saying it is everyone but it is also not a negligible amount either.

From personal experience also it seems to be designed to keep people on it rather than give them tools and help to better themselves. At least that is how is seems here maybe other states are different but I am not sure they really are that different.

I would be willing to spend anything it took to help (keyword being help) someone stand on their own two feet but there should also be a way to weed out those who are milking the system and have no desire to help themselves.

 

[GAJ]

Other than the Atlanta sex worker shooting what story ‘in the media’ isn’t black on Asian crime?

Additionally, what isn’t a black vs Asian narrative in mainstream media that isn’t blaming whites and white supremacy for black on Asian crime?

I don't see anything about White Supremacy or Whites being blamed when I watch NPRNewshour or read the Chron, the PD or CNN.

But evidently the media you read has Black on Asian crime as the story line.

The only White Supremacy stuff I've read since the election has been by FBI news releases.