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RZ350 re-frame... classic 2-stroke gets modern upgrade

I'd be honored. Let me know when and where. Modelo is perfectly fine with me. You weld like most people coming out of school. I did the same exact thing. It took some luck for me when I met a pro that helped fine tune my technique. To this day, I'll do anything for that guy (Thank you Ford!).

No matter what any welder tells you, everybody has their own style. It's like riding bikes or playing an instrument. It'll be fun and you'll even be able to do Aluminum (as long as the machine allows it). I was astonished at how little more info. I needed to achieve what I really wanted (the next level). Give me a couple of days to plan for it. Send me a PM if possible.

**Also, quick tip for anyone who wants to TiG weld anything considered small. 1/16" rod or less (steel), which is mostly what I use. It is a wise investment to get the magnifying glass that Miller sells to install inside your hood. It'll seem a little weird at first but once you get used to it and especially if your eyes are aging, like mine, it makes a HUGE difference. They're not very powerful, just enough to stop the squint. =)
 
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This is what 25lbs of clay looks like in the VERY rough shape of a moto tail...

20220227_173013 by andbike, on Flickr

20220227_171731 by andbike, on Flickr




Okay, grab the brakes! What's going on here? Alright, lets back up a few weeks. Remember that little wood working project that was started a while back? Here's how that progressed...

If you remember back a few months, I had made the support structures for the tail buck. Now a bunch of small pieces are cut, glued together, and eventually attached to a metal armature to become the buck...


20220127_121647 by andbike, on Flickr

20220125_172622 by andbike, on Flickr

I want to get some styling ques from the later model R6s, so small winglets are added...

20220121_182640 by andbike, on Flickr


Then all the wood needs to be drilled with shallow holes for the clay to grab onto...

20220127_121701 by andbike, on Flickr

20220127_121710 by andbike, on Flickr


HOLD ON! something doesn't look right. The seat is so wide it covers the winglets. So more experimentation with paper mock-ups to get the winglets right...

20220127_185712 by andbike, on Flickr

20220127_220955 by andbike, on Flickr

That's going to get really wide. I just don't like the direction its going. Time to re-think. Hummm, I know, try a different seat. I dive into my stash of R6 seats and tails (yes, I have a small accumulation of these) and I find four generations of R6 seats (99-03, 04-05, 06-07, and 08 to?) I try them all and decide I like the 06-07 seat shape the best. That means building a new sub-frame to accommodate the change, but oh well. Its worth the extra effort to make this bike look correct.

20220129_131432 by andbike, on Flickr

The recess at the back of the seat now leaves a big gap. So that gets a piece of wood to support clay that will come later.

20220201_192300 by andbike, on Flickr

Okay, now just need to seal the wood with shellac, then ready to pack clay!

20220216_193145 by andbike, on Flickr

The clay is heated to 160 degrees F, so its a bit hot to the touch! I put on 2 lbs at a time before my fingers can't handle the heat. Eventually my fingers get tougher and some days I'll add 4lbs at a time. Its a slow process but getting it done...

20220216_201253 by andbike, on Flickr

20220219_102727 by andbike, on Flickr


Now, are we up to date?
 
Playing with MUD!? You sure seem to have a LOT of fun Julian.
 
NOPE! Not up to date. There have been a few other twists and turns along the way...

First off, I've been notified that this bike has been officially accepted into The One Motorcycle show... but I won't be ready. Fuck! Okay, think. What's the backup plan? I email the organizers and politely explain that I will need to decline the invite and re-submit for next year... and if they are interested, I'd love to bring the prototype. A few weeks later I get a nice reply. They completely understand, and yes! They would like me to bring the prototype. Okay, now the focus has changed because in doing the seat and tail development I've cut up the tail on the prototype. So here we go in another direction...

Screenshot-from-2018-04-24-03-22-44 by andbike, on Flickr

Since my original direction was to use the 04-05 seat, I decided to cut out a portion of the fiberglass race tail to use as the seat interface surface on the tail buck. But since I changed the direction on the seat, I no longer need that strip of fiberglass. I'd like to use that tail on the prototype for The One Show. I can spend $200 for a new one from AirTech, or repair the one I cut. I decide to do a repair.

$85 dollars and a trip to Tap Plastic I now have a resin, gelcoat, MEKP (catalyst), acetone (for cleanup), some fiberglass tape, mixing cup, and some cheap'o brushes and mixing sticks.

I use a few C-clamps at first to hold the pieces together while adding the strips of glass tape...

20220226_135945 by andbike, on Flickr

20220226_140036 by andbike, on Flickr

20220226_140544 by andbike, on Flickr

Then I get the dumb idea that I want to re-sculpt the tail a bit. More on that later.



Then there are more twists and turns...

Screenshot-from-2018-04-24-03-22-44 by andbike, on Flickr

In a complete absence of normal reason I decide to take on not one, but two more projects. Oh, I've also taken on a big client project. Not the RD400 swingarm conversion. That is done and the owner is very happy. But a big corporate project (aside from my regular day job). I think I've gone completely nuts!:wow

Anyway, the other two projects can be found here...

https://bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=553883

And here...

https://bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=553882

Okay, now I think we're up to date. :party
 
Lonster said:
Playing with MUD!? You sure seem to have a LOT of fun Julian.
Click to expand...

Ha ha, yep! playing with mud.

Although not the ordinary mud you played with in grade school. This clay has lots of paraffin, and sulfur added in. It never "dries" the way ordinary clay does. As mentioned, heat is used to make it soft so it can be applied to the buck. Once it cools back to room temperature it can be carved and has the consistency of a hard wax.

Stay tuned. Its about to get interesting!
 
motoprotocol said:
I'd be honored. Let me know when and where. Modelo is perfectly fine with me. You weld like most people coming out of school. I did the same exact thing. It took some luck for me when I met a pro that helped fine tune my technique. To this day, I'll do anything for that guy (Thank you Ford!).

No matter what any welder tells you, everybody has their own style. It's like riding bikes or playing an instrument. It'll be fun and you'll even be able to do Aluminum (as long as the machine allows it). I was astonished at how little more info. I needed to achieve what I really wanted (the next level). Give me a couple of days to plan for it. Send me a PM if possible.

**Also, quick tip for anyone who wants to TiG weld anything considered small. 1/16" rod or less (steel), which is mostly what I use. It is a wise investment to get the magnifying glass that Miller sells to install inside your hood. It'll seem a little weird at first but once you get used to it and especially if your eyes are aging, like mine, it makes a HUGE difference. They're not very powerful, just enough to stop the squint. =)
Click to expand...

Thanks Adrian. I'm excited to get a pro tutorial from you:thumbup I've got a good friend who would also like to join.

Good tip on the magnifier. I need to get one. I wear reading glasses for most up close work. A few years ago, I'd always get spare glasses that were one power stronger just for welding. But now my sight has gotten bad enough that I wear the strongest power you can get without prescription lenses. So something in-helmet would be great.

I here you on the thin welding rod. For a long time 1/16" was the finest I could find locally. So I bought some MIG wire that was thinner. I would cut and straighten sections at a time. Then by chance I found a welding shop near where I was working a few years ago and they stocked down to I think 1/32 rod. Now I'm sold on thin rod so I order online when needed. Its great for moto stuff. Another good tip. Thanks!:thumbup
 
Right on, I'm glad to help any time. I hear you on the glasses, I started using reading glasses as "safetys" a couple of years ago. It was liberating. My near sight is totally gone! Thank god I never look at the Speedo! LOL

The MiG wire to substitute welding rods is a neat old school trick. Good thinking. On that note, I only purchase thin wire. Here's why, if you need a thicker rod, just take two wires and braid them into one thicker rod. That's what I do with Titanium rods since they're so expensive. To make them hella tight and proper, I pinch one end of each rod/wire in a vise and place the other two ends in a drill. Pull the trigger and twist away! You can also just use a long wire and bend it in half. No need to straighten it prior to braiding. :thumbup

I can't wait to see your clay work. I don't think I've ever seen the process of going from clay to fiber glass. I'm about to post how I make "one-of" composite tails as well. This thread is the Bomb! :banana
 
Another great update Julian. That is quite a process you go through to "develop" these custom parts. It's fun to sit here with my coffee and breakfast reading all this cool stuff. And looking at the pictures. Thanks for posting with all the details. :thumbup:thumbup:thumbup
 
Well it looks like we have a theme this week with three different ways for sculpting tails. I really like the simple method that motoprotocol used with construction board and fiberglass. Very simple technique, if you like the very simplified aesthetic, which I do!

So continuing with the two methods I'm currently working with... First, I should explain whats going on with the clay. I'll start by mentioning that this is not the same clay we played with as kids in grade school. Specifically what I'm using is Chevant modeling clay which is what you see used in professional design studios. What's unique about this clay is the paraffin content. It has a feel and constancy more like wax. And like wax, it gets soft with heat. When heated it can be applied to the model, but then at room temperature is gets hard and has nice consistency for carving. The advantage is if you take too much off, simply grab more clay from the oven and pack back on to the model. This makes it very easy to try different shapes. If you don't like the direction, add more clay and try a different direction. In the photos below I'm deliberately modeling each side of the tail differently. This is the fun part of the process where I can play and try different ideas with the form.

The first surface starting to appear...

20220304_204441 by andbike, on Flickr

20220304_210754 by andbike, on Flickr

20220305_180530 by andbike, on Flickr

Then after I have a direction started on each side, its time to see how it looks on the bike...

20220305_165611 by andbike, on Flickr

20220305_165552 by andbike, on Flickr

20220305_165543 by andbike, on Flickr

A little more refining...

20220305_165636 by andbike, on Flickr

20220305_180530 by andbike, on Flickr

Then back on to the bike, and so on. Here I'm playing with it at night using light and shadow to see how the form reacts...

20220307_091406 by andbike, on Flickr

Eventually I'll refine the form till I have something I like. Then the tedious task of making both side symmetrical. But that will come later.
 
Meanwhile, repairs and reshaping is progressing well on the fiberglass R6 tail. I've add urethane foam to the top to add some crown where it was flat. I'll also extend the the very end out to a tip.

Working with foam is much different than clay. Its consistency is much different and it comes off VERY easily. The problem with foam is if you take too much off you can't put it back on. At least not easily.

Here you can see the crowned surface taking shape. I'm rough shaping with a Sureform file, then I'll fine tune the surface with a rubber block and sandpaper...

20220305_125007 by andbike, on Flickr

20220305_125015 by andbike, on Flickr

20220305_132003 by andbike, on Flickr

Once the shape is how I like it, I'll seal the foam with resin and a layer of very fine fiberglass matte. When finished, it will have a hard outer surface much like an egg shell. First the fiberglass layer. While the resin for the fiberglass is hardening, I'll add a few more blocks of foam (using resin as a glue) to build up the rear tip...

20220305_134650 by andbike, on Flickr

The resin doesn't sand very well, so I'll add a coat of gelcoat over the fiberglass. But the gelcoat has a tacky surface if exposed to air while it cures, so another coat of PVA (poly vinyl acetate) is sprayed on as an air barrier while the gelcoat cures. Its messy and lots of steps, but getting closer. The white coating is the gelcoat...

20220305_182619 by andbike, on Flickr

The faint green coating is the PVA...

20220306_130642 by andbike, on Flickr

The PVA is water soluble so it washes of very easily once the gelcoat is cured. Then I can begin the process of sanding and eventually filling the voids and imperfections, followed by more sanding. Here the sanding process is just starting...

20220306_132203 by andbike, on Flickr

20220307_091344 by andbike, on Flickr

Stay tuned for much more clay carving and eventually finishing the fiberglass tail:party
 
This is awesome! I like the longer of the two halves you designed. The left side. The R6 tail looks totally different with the mods you did. The pointy tip looks perfect. Good job Julian!
 
Damn. This is a lot of work!!!

Stay the course passionate man!!
 
budman said:
Damn. This is a lot of work!!!

Stay the course passionate man!!
Click to expand...

A lot of work is correct. I'm admittedly loosing a bit of steam... but compared to my first big custom moto project which took 7 years before being ridden, this is going rather quickly:party

Anyway, Thanks for the encouragement. Much appreciated:thumbup
 
This week a bit more work on the clay happened. Working on the right side, I'm starting to like the proportions... the rear has been extended and I like the transition from side of the hump to the top of the winglets. However, the overall design language it a mismatch with the tank. So I'm not there yet...

20220318_085158 by andbike, on Flickr

20220318_103143 by andbike, on Flickr
 
Some progress was made over the week, so here's a quick update...

Because of the previously mentioned change of plans to bring the prototype bike to The One Show, my current priority is to get that bike ready. First on the to-do list is getting a tail mounted so that it will look like a complete bike again. With the modifications to the R6 tail almost complete, I can finish building the rear-sub-frame.

Saturday I was able to get a little bit of Bondo and primer on the now modified tail and it is starting to look much better. Adding a bit of crown to the top and making the end pointed was exactly what it needed...

20220320_165230 by andbike, on Flickr

Sunday the rain let up and had a beautiful day to work outside. I added extensions to the sub-frame to support the rear of the tail and two screw brackets for mounting...

20220320_145928 by andbike, on Flickr

20220320_150142 by andbike, on Flickr


Tail on. Seat on. Looking good! Admittedly the tail looks a bit high, but I really like the seat position and if I lower the back of the tail is opens gap under the seat, so its gonna stay where it is...

20220320_150210 by andbike, on Flickr

20220320_165215 by andbike, on Flickr

I had hoped to also mount the tail light and license plate. I often make extras when getting brackets laser cut, but not the case this time. So Sunday night I ordered more brackets from my favorite laser cutting vendor. Next weekend should see the light and plate get mounted if the brackets arrive by Friday. Fingers crossed.
 
Looking Good! I like the tail rake.
 
I think it looks beautiful. Don't forget you're using a tail section from a bike with a full fairing up-front. Maybe consider a bikini fairing to balance out the front and back? (perhaps a '93 RGV 500 upper?) Anyway, this build is looking sweet, keep it up!

When I run out of steam, I try to switch to something else for a bit. A different part, or a different bike. Maybe go design something for a couple of days. Make a coffee table? Go ride and forget the shop for a week, etc. Although it's kind'a hard when you got a show coming up.
 
motoprotocol said:
I think it looks beautiful. Don't forget you're using a tail section from a bike with a full fairing up-front. Maybe consider a bikini fairing to balance out the front and back? (perhaps a '93 RGV 500 upper?) Anyway, this build is looking sweet, keep it up!
Click to expand...

The prototype bike will probably be finished once this tail is mounted. I've thought about putting a single shock version of the swingarm, but running out of time before the show, so likely will finish mounting tail light and plate, then call it done. The final version of the bike will get a small fairing. I've already done some mockups with a gen2 SV650 fairing. So I think we're on the same page:thumbup

motoprotocol said:
When I run out of steam, I try to switch to something else for a bit. A different part, or a different bike, start another moto project, start another moto project after that. Take on a client project, take on another client project. Maybe go design something for a couple of days. Draw 10 coffee table concepts in a sketch book. Get stressed out because too many projects all at once, so no time ride. Get more stressed out because you got a show coming up.
Click to expand...

There, I fixed what you said to be much more accurate:rofl
 
Since the last post... my official invite to The One Show arrived. They even included a special edition commemorative Leatherman tool! These guys get the best sponsors and always have some amazing swag for the builders:party

20220326_115620 by andbike, on Flickr

Okay, where did we leave off? I think I was working on modifications to the R6 race tail. It still needed a little bit more filler and final sanding. In the last pictures you'll see a light "guide coat" of black that is just fogged on. The idea is that when most of the black has been sanded off, I have a visual guide that indicates where I've sanded and where I haven't.

20220416_113638 by andbike, on Flickr

20220416_171927 by andbike, on Flickr

20220417_114930 by andbike, on Flickr



Black guide coat mostly sanded off...

20220417_140001 by andbike, on Flickr




Surface prep isn't perfect, but good enough for crappy rattle can paint job:teeth Looks like the paint-in-a-can is a pretty close match to the Yamaha metallic silver:thumbup

20220417_163106 by andbike, on Flickr

20220420_094059 by andbike, on Flickr



And this is how the bike will look for the show. I still think the tail is a bit too high (it actually looks worse in the photo). Oh well. Not going to fix it now.:x

20220417_163006 by andbike, on Flickr

See you after the show in May:wave
 
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