Thats it asshile, im renting a big foot costume and I'm gonna finda ya and scare the bejesus out of you on your next ride
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CHP Causing a Motorcycle Accident
- Thread starter ElDiablo
- Start date
No, I think Arch is actually a very informed poster and experienced rider, so I'm not out to bash him despite his lack of compassion for the crashed (myself included). Unfortunately these situations suck (esp when you bin), but I've accepted the blame game won't undo my crash, but trying to learn from it will prevent future ones. There are all sorts of things that can spook us out on the road, so as riders we need to be prepared to deal with all of them, even if its a spunky CHP rookie blaring his lights and sirens just a few feet from your head. At the end of the day, the ONLY thing we can control is ourselves and how we handle the situations we encounter out there.
silversvs
Lean, Twist, repeat.....
}Dragon{
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ ︵ ╯(°□° ╯)
Archimedes
Fire Watcher
And as long as I don't have three buddies riding 10 feet away from me on every side, I'll bet I'll come out okay.
And nobody swerved into them here. The guy came up behind quick and they were riding too close together .
Oh and UCB, I have plenty of compassion for everyone involved. I have compassion for anyone who gets hurt in any situation, their fault or not. What I don't agree with is someone blaming someone else for their misfortunes. I have a ti rod in my femur from a big crash that I could blame on others, but in the end it's my fault it is there.
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I never blamed him, its just an outside factor that we as riders have to deal with. You bolded that one statement about LEOs then completely ignored the rest of my comment. In my case, no lights or sirens were used, just a nascar like presence. Still no blame given to the officer. I wasnt happy with the way he conducted himself, but I know I still can't blame him, I can only learn from it and apply it to future situations such that I don't panic and let myself get intimidated.
Seems like you are quick to blame the rider (and rightfully so), but have yet to comment on the actions of the officer.
So is that normal practice? Cutting into a group like that with suck close proximity? Do you do that on a normal basis and condone those actions? I'm not a CHP officer and I've been pulled over once on a highway and never in a group situation, so I'm not sure what's normal and what's not
I'm being 100% objective here, I'd be nice if you could return the favor
silversvs
Lean, Twist, repeat.....
I return the favor every time I am on the board. I'm here answering questions because I think it is a great opportunity for law enforcement to contribute to the community and break down some stereotypes that are out there.
I've been objective about both of the threads that had to do with riders claiming that they crashed due to the actions of an officer trying to pull them (or other riders with them) over.
I've watched the video a couple dozen times. I freely admit (and have from the start) that I know nothing about what occurred prior to what is seen in the video.
I see an officer with emergency lights activated initiating a traffic stop on a rider(s) that he/she wants to pull over. I see a rider grab a fist full of front brake and endo his/her bike. What more objectivity do you want?
Is it normal practice to cut into a group ride? I don't know because I can only speak for myself. If I want to stop a particular rider who happens to be in a group, I am probably not going to start at the back of the group and wait for each rider to yield to the side until I get to the one I want. If I can safely work my way to get behind my target violator then that is what I will do, and that appears to me to be what happened in this video. If I can't safely get behind the violator I want to stop, I wait until I can. In many cases I have been unable to get to the violator, or wasn't able to get to them in a manner in which I could safely make the stop, so I just abandoned the stop and let them go.
I've been objective about both of the threads that had to do with riders claiming that they crashed due to the actions of an officer trying to pull them (or other riders with them) over.
I've watched the video a couple dozen times. I freely admit (and have from the start) that I know nothing about what occurred prior to what is seen in the video.
I see an officer with emergency lights activated initiating a traffic stop on a rider(s) that he/she wants to pull over. I see a rider grab a fist full of front brake and endo his/her bike. What more objectivity do you want?
Is it normal practice to cut into a group ride? I don't know because I can only speak for myself. If I want to stop a particular rider who happens to be in a group, I am probably not going to start at the back of the group and wait for each rider to yield to the side until I get to the one I want. If I can safely work my way to get behind my target violator then that is what I will do, and that appears to me to be what happened in this video. If I can't safely get behind the violator I want to stop, I wait until I can. In many cases I have been unable to get to the violator, or wasn't able to get to them in a manner in which I could safely make the stop, so I just abandoned the stop and let them go.
Fixed.
(don't take it personally, I agreed with everything you said except that part)Seriously, let's get past the bashing, conspiracy theory, and blue line. It's called tailgating, and there was no need for it.
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silversvs
Lean, Twist, repeat.....
Fixed.
Seriously, let's get past the bashing, conspiracy theory, and blue line. It's called tailgating, and there was no need for it.
Sorry, wrong answer!
Ever driven a patrol car? Ever tried to make a traffic stop on a motorcycle? Ever try to get the license plate, work the radio, maintain control of the patrol vehicle, plan your stop, and prepare to contact the violator? I'm guessing you have not.
Both of us are basing our opinion on the video only, but from what I see the officer was not driving in an unsafe manner while making an enforcement stop.
So, no need to fix my post or try to put words in my mouth.
Eisernkreuz
unteroffizier
No, I'm not saying im a good rider, but yes, if that LEO was not on my arse, I would have never pulled off, and I would have never crashed, at least not that day on that section of road. Now I realize it was my choice to pull off, thus the crash is 100% my fault. However, there are factors that can influence a crash and take 0 fault. I managed to navigate 100+ miles all on my own that day when their wasnt a LEO on my ass. Imagine that
I'm really not sure what point you are trying to prove, and whatever it is, you are doing it poorly. Next time don't use such a bogus analogy
No one's counting how many miles you did that day without crashing while not being followed by a cop, the point is something happened that shouldn't have happened. The presence of lights, sirens, loudspeakers, or any other equipment shouldn't prevent you from coming to a safe stop.
To bring this point home...three months into my riding career, several years ago, I moved up from a CB750 (good learning bike) to an inappropriate bike, a ZX9R. While coming back from a dinner that ran late in Vacaville, I got caught out after dark with a tinted visor. I got on the freeway onramp, hit a metal plate I didn't see and crashed. Would I have crashed if the plate wasn't there? No. Would I have crashed if the visor was clear? Probably not. Would I have crashed if I stayed the fuck at home that night and ordered a pizza? Nope. But the fact is, what happened happened, and I crashed, and it was my fault. Move on, dude. And if you don't know how to stop on loose surfaces, get a bike with ABS.
In other words, the officer's presence is at fault exactly the same amount as the plate's presence on the onramp in front of me, i.e. NONE!
It was my job to safely avoid an obstacle in the road, it was your job to stop safely. We both sucked at it. But now we won't make the same mistake, right? 
Shaggy
Zoinks!!!!
Fixed.
Seriously, let's get past the bashing, conspiracy theory, and blue line. It's called tailgating, and there was no need for it.
From my experience, motorcycle license plates are small and difficult to read until very close behind the vehicle. It would inherently make it necessary to be closer to the motorcycle in order to read the license plate.
I'm with what silversvs said also. If I'm going to stop a bike at the front of a group, I'm not going to chop down the group from the back and move them all over to get to the one I want (unless I was on I5 or something). It takes a while for that type of action.
The officer had emergency lights on, positioned himself in the group behind the violator vehicle(s), and dude-slice hamfisted the brake and ate dirt.
Sorry, wrong answer!
Ever driven a patrol car? Ever tried to make a traffic stop on a motorcycle? Ever try to get the license plate, work the radio, maintain control of the patrol vehicle, plan your stop, and prepare to contact the violator? I'm guessing you have not.
Both of us are basing our opinion on the video only, but from what I see the officer was not driving in an unsafe manner while making an enforcement stop.
So, no need to fix my post or try to put words in my mouth.
Wasn't putting words in your mouth, just seemed an effective way to voice my disagreement. My apology if it came accross other than that.
My point is that a motorist (non LEO) making the same manuver (cutting behind the bike) would likely be cited. I'm not trying to crucify the officer, but I hope from the result he might be a bit more careful on his next stop. Not saying it was the officer's fault, but I'd say his actions contributed.
Personally I'd think safe driving is more important than reading a plate, working the radio, or pretty much any other activity the LEO would have been doing at the time.
With all this talk about how unsafe the LEO's stop was, I have yet to see the issue of WHY the LEO was making the stop. Clearly one can see the riders are riding at a "brisk pace" in the few moments shown before they check-up because of the patrol car. (It's interesting that the editing was that tight. It wasn't done so to make the riders look like they weren't speeding, was it?)
If everyone here is so concerned about people not endangering riders by not splitting the group or roaring up behind with loud sounds and lights then there is another painfully obvious solution. Don't do things to get pulled over!!!
If the video showed a patrol car harassing a bunch of law-abiding riders I'd be taking the riders side, for sure. That isn't what we have here. Some guys got caught being a little squiddly and the stop got messed up because some of the guys got flustered when the *completely predictable* thing happened.
Oops.
An expensive and somewhat embarrassing lesson to be learned.
If everyone here is so concerned about people not endangering riders by not splitting the group or roaring up behind with loud sounds and lights then there is another painfully obvious solution. Don't do things to get pulled over!!!
If the video showed a patrol car harassing a bunch of law-abiding riders I'd be taking the riders side, for sure. That isn't what we have here. Some guys got caught being a little squiddly and the stop got messed up because some of the guys got flustered when the *completely predictable* thing happened.
Oops.
An expensive and somewhat embarrassing lesson to be learned.
B-Cuz
Honorably Discharged
IMO, due to the editing I believe that whatever violation was not shown but remember that all an LEO needs is "probable cause." As I had mentioned earlier the LEO maneuver is a bit gutsy, but well within safety reasonability (ie: no blind corner, excessive speed, etc.) The crash was caused by excessive front brake that caused the full on somersault. Sorry to say rider, but you're at fault.
ok ill give you that, you do suckIt was my job to safely avoid an obstacle in the road, it was your job to stop safely. We both sucked at it. But now we won't make the same mistake, right?
but I guess I do too
egrep
Serious Business
While I respect the OP for respecting the request of another BARFer, I cannot help but comment on the futility of trying to put a genie back into a bottle. Especially if that genie is information and that bottle is the Webtubes. I'm sure that anyone reading the OP would realize that typing the title of this thread into a search engine will return the object of the removed link at the top of the list If you're a little clever you can easily return links to cached versions of this BARF thread as well.
The only way for this never to be seen or commented on is for it never to have occured in the first place, I'm afraid. There's no where to hide in this brave new world, everything you do is captured, indexed and preserved.
The only way for this never to be seen or commented on is for it never to have occured in the first place, I'm afraid. There's no where to hide in this brave new world, everything you do is captured, indexed and preserved.
silversvs
Lean, Twist, repeat.....